Separate PvE and PvP balances

[DauntedVenus]

There should be a way to separate the balances made to dinosaurs and game mechanics between PvE and PvP.

Multiple balances have made PvE nothing but hard. Managarmr being a recent example, in PvE they're useless now thanks to the many balances made to make PvP better.

Flier nerf was a huge change in PvE making fliers and transportation harder by forcing us to land since PvP was taking to the skies too often and the game tried to "ground" the fight

[d1nk]

Just now, DauntedVenus said:

There should be a way to separate the balances made to dinosaurs and game mechanics between PvE and PvP.

Multiple balances have made PvE nothing but hard. Managarmr being a recent example, in PvE they're useless now thanks to the many balances made to make PvP better.

Flier nerf was a huge change in PvE making fliers and transportation harder by forcing us to land since PvP was taking to the skies too often and the game tried to "ground" the fight

I agree with the topic but not the flier nerf bit. It was needed and shouldnt be put back in.

[Manoko]

I agree too with this suggestion, some "nerf" for example on the mana hit the PVE who was not necessary, on PvP i understand, but on PvE i do not !

+hype

[Oieru]

As the title says, we need SEPARATE buffs/nerfs/balance tweaks for PVE and PVP. 2 completely different game modes with completely different strategies, objectives and player types need different tweaks to the game.

This has become especially evident in the cases of the extreme and repeated nerfs of the Managarmr, a new and versatile creature that quickly became as useful as throwing small feces at a wild Giga... All because of the outcry of a portion of PVP players, while completely ignoring, disregarding the PVE community. While PVP was focused on griefing fellow players with Manas, PVE players needed that versatility to focus on boss taming/killing. You can see the frustration on both sides. PVP is still and will be forever complaining about Manas, while PVE clings to being able to still play with that creature. This is only one example.

For two game modes you need two game settings. It is only logical, as a famous saying goes.

So please, for the sake of the PVE and PVP communities, revert those extreme tweaks and focus on implementing them completely different in PVE and PVP game modes. This might be the most urgent game balance.

 

PS: DO NOT, I repeat, DO NOT make this a discussion over PVE/PVP supremacy. If you want to know, they both suck equally bad for different reasons!

 

 

Edited April 23, 2019 by Oieru

[Caerbannog]

11 minutes ago, DauntedVenus said:

There should be a way to separate the balances made to dinosaurs and game mechanics between PvE and PvP.

Multiple balances have made PvE nothing but hard. Managarmr being a recent example, in PvE they're useless now thanks to the many balances made to make PvP better.

Flier nerf was a huge change in PvE making fliers and transportation harder by forcing us to land since PvP was taking to the skies too often and the game tried to "ground" the fight

I agree with all of this, including reintroducing  classic fliers. I miss my speed quetzal.

[anubis3691]

Came strait here to put this in.  You beat me to it! This.  Do this. 

[divisd1]

I'm okay with the flyer nerf, it made it so players would opt to use other creatures instead of just solely using a lightning fast flyer. I know also that it is hard to code in separate entries for PVE and PVP when it comes to creatures. Essentially, there would be two different instances of the same creature. Not real sure if making separate settings for PVE and for PVP for dinos is something that we would likely see, but it would be cool.

[Coffee6969]

I 100% agree with this as a PVP player, So often we are forced to endure nerfs and gameplay forced upon us due to PVE needing something to act or be a certain way versus how it effects the PVP side of things

[Rossnvnw67]

I agree that they do need to be approached differently, as they've basically different games. Some aspects of the flier nerf could have stayed for PvE tbh. But the mana nerf I don't agree with. There's no reason you need the fastest dino in the game to be DPS haha.

[Aylana314159]

2 hours ago, divisd1 said:

I know also that it is hard to code in separate entries for PVE and PVP when it comes to creatures. Essentially, there would be two different instances of the same creature. Not real sure if making separate settings for PVE and for PVP for dinos is something that we would likely see, but it would be cool.

It would be easy (just a bit of time) if WC added settings for all stats for each species of creatures and maybe settings for special abilities. Make it customizable for unofficial servers. Then it would be a set of settings for PvP and a different set for PvE.

[Aylana314159]

2 hours ago, Coffee6969 said:

I 100% agree with this as a PVP player, So often we are forced to endure nerfs and gameplay forced upon us due to PVE needing something to act or be a certain way versus how it effects the PVP side of things

Got an example. Because all the nerfs i know about were due to PvP reasons.

[AleXtreme1]

Oieru is right!!! At first , extinction creatures were the best in the game (managarmr ,velonosaur , gacha , etc) . After several updates the abilities of those creatures were reduced at half or eaven lower. When managarmr appeared on ark for the very beginning i killed a giga from high range with no problem. Now , i have to move close to a dino just to freeze it a little. Same thing with gacha : when extinction map was released , a gacha fed with proper food dropped crystals with mastercraft or ascendant items very easy. Now , i have to open a lot of crystals to get maximum a mastercraft item at it's lowest quality. I think no-one cares on PvE if you kill a wild dino with a primitive pick or an ascendant rifle.  

[covenantgrunt]

27 minutes ago, AleXtreme1 said:

Oieru is right!!! At first , extinction creatures were the best in the game (managarmr ,velonosaur , gacha , etc) . After several updates the abilities of those creatures were reduced at half or eaven lower. When managarmr appeared on ark for the very beginning i killed a giga from high range with no problem. Now , i have to move close to a dino just to freeze it a little. Same thing with gacha : when extinction map was released , a gacha fed with proper food dropped crystals with mastercraft or ascendant items very easy. Now , i have to open a lot of crystals to get maximum a mastercraft item at it's lowest quality. I think no-one cares on PvE if you kill a wild dino with a primitive pick or an ascendant rifle.  

In pve they should just enable creative mode and God mode. People should not even have to farm just spawn in creatures and bases. And instant kill anything by right clicking on it. It's pve balance don't matter.

Edited April 24, 2019 by covenantgrunt

[divisd1]

16 hours ago, Aylana314159 said:

It would be easy (just a bit of time) if WC added settings for all stats for each species of creatures and maybe settings for special abilities. Make it customizable for unofficial servers. Then it would be a set of settings for PvP and a different set for PvE.

It would not be easy at all. Have you ever looked at the dev kit to see how stuff actually works? Easy to give suggestions and say they are easy to implement if you haven't the slightest idea of how any of it actually works.

[Lowly]

18 hours ago, Coffee6969 said:

I 100% agree with this as a PVP player, So often we are forced to endure nerfs and gameplay forced upon us due to PVE needing something to act or be a certain way versus how it effects the PVP side of things

You know what's hilarious is that pve players always blame PvP for the nerfs, I'd love to hear from PvP players what needs are the result of PvE players

[Lowly]

2 minutes ago, divisd1 said:

It would not be easy at all. Have you ever looked at the dev kit to see how stuff actually works? Easy to give suggestions and say they are easy to implement if you haven't the slightest idea of how any of it actually works.

There is already a. Giant server file setting as far as in aware with every Dino and every stat base value and gain per wild and gain per tamed level and affinity and imprint bonus.

[Aylana314159]

4 minutes ago, divisd1 said:

It would not be easy at all. Have you ever looked at the dev kit to see how stuff actually works? Easy to give suggestions and say they are easy to implement if you haven't the slightest idea of how any of it actually works.

I have used the devkit. The devs already have entries for species damage and resistance. They would just need to extend this to other stats.

[Aylana314159]

9 minutes ago, Eoptap said:

Your wrong the mana is junk now pvp balance dose not apply to pve environment. Only the mentally challenged would think the balance is the same. The mana should not drop like a rock after less than 1 second. The stam drops to fast. Instead of a nerf they should have provided a pvp patch. Pve always gets ruined by pvp's misconception of balance. If you play pvp you should just move to pve if you can't handle the heat not screw over pve with your repeated childish wines for a nerf.

The mana is a post flyer nerf (removed speed leveling) creature.

 

This whole post is about separating PvE and PvP nerfs/balancing. Make them each robust independent game modes. 

[Eoptap]

16 minutes ago, Aylana314159 said:

The mana is a post flyer nerf (removed speed leveling) creature.

 

This whole post is about separating PvE and PvP nerfs/balancing. Make them each robust independent game modes. 

Lol never mind me meds put me out of it a bit. Pvp and pve should have seperate patches. The mana is a good example of why they should be seperate. Pve should never be the same standard as pvp.

Edited April 24, 2019 by Eoptap

[Aylana314159]

1 minute ago, Eoptap said:

Yup if you paid attention you would notice that I was telling the pvp person that the standards are not the same, and should be seperate.

The person you replied to was talking about the flyer nerf. You were talking about manas. Completely different things.

 

The flyer nerf increased the challenges of PvE making land dinos useful for transport and travel. Instead of get flyer = easy mode = win.

 

The mana nerf is a completely different topic. 

 

I don't think any major nerf should be enacted without settings (not requiring mods) to revert them. Also, PvE shouldn't be effected by PvP only nerfs. But this would mean creating one or more setting(s) to make PvP and PvE different.

[Eoptap]

3 minutes ago, Aylana314159 said:

The person you replied to was talking about the flyer nerf. You were talking about manas. Completely different things.

 

The flyer nerf increased the challenges of PvE making land dinos useful for transport and travel. Instead of get flyer = easy mode = win.

 

The mana nerf is a completely different topic. 

 

I don't think any major nerf should be enacted without settings (not requiring mods) to revert them. Also, PvE shouldn't be effected by PvP only nerfs. But this would mean creating one or more setting(s) to make PvP and PvE different.

Sorry yup allergy meds making me to out of it lol. 

[Aylana314159]

Anyone has a list of things that desperately need separate balancing?

Besides the things that were nerfed for PvP.

 

PvE (official) has dino cap as a main issue, so maybe make cryopods function differently on PvE. Or introduce a breeding pod with no delay. 

 

[YourHearse]

If there are separate settings for PvE and PvP then what happens when PvE tribes go to war ? 

 

Do the settings change for those PvE tribes ? 

Dino stats?

Player stats?

 

 

 

[Guest BubbaCrawfish]

See @Cedric The bare mention of it, and this is what gets spawned...

[Aylana314159]

1 hour ago, YourHearse said:

If there are separate settings for PvE and PvP then what happens when PvE tribes go to war ? 

 

Do the settings change for those PvE tribes ? 

Dino stats?

Player stats?

 

 

 

These would all be possible differences. PvE might have a more generous player weight setting.

 

As for tribe war, it would have to be based on the PvE mode. It wouldn't make sense for tribes at war to suddenly be under PvP settings like wild flyer carry. 

[YourHearse]

1 hour ago, Aylana314159 said:

These would all be possible differences. PvE might have a more generous player weight setting.

 

As for tribe war, it would have to be based on the PvE mode. It wouldn't make sense for tribes at war to suddenly be under PvP settings like wild flyer carry. 

That is still a bit worrying with our brightest Managarmr example. 

Un-nerfed mana on PvE is all nice and good. The minute a tribe goes to war the managsrmr is God.

 

Edit: 

I think Managarmr should never existed as mythical creature. It’s like the black sheep. 

Edited April 28, 2019 by YourHearse