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Hidden Mutation Levels!?!?

Oldskool

By Oldskool,
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Oldskool Cloth Armor

Oldskool

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Hey guys, i'm breeding Rex's on my server to try an get the highest stat levels i can before I start to grind for mutations. I have been breeding all my wild tames into Base dinos that have best of all stats. Any that come with mutations at this early point i just put to one side or kill ( Pointless stats). 

I thought i had my head around all of this completely then i just hatched a Rex that came out 2 levels higher than the 2 bases i was breeding. Parent 244 + parent 244 and it came out at 246. I thought bingo, another mutation. Went to check if it had melee or damage (which I would keep), but on the ancestor tree it has 0/20 on both sides!?

In my confusion I input all the stats into Dododex, and it turns out it has gained 2 levels in movement speed, both parents had 27 points this guy has 29. But no increase to mutation counter!? I know that movement speed is a wasted stat, but it still adds to the level which I want.

Has anyone seen this before, i didn't realize you could gain 2 levels and not take a hit on the 0/20 counter. If anyone could shed some light on this I would be grateful. 

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Nim Cloth Armor

Nim

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Since breeding became a thing and long before mutations were introduced, it was possible to get stats to round up a little if you had two parents with a lot of points in the same stat. Two high melee parents could give you a baby with slightly higher melee. For example, my first two thylas have 287.1 and 287.2 melee; every single time I breed them, the baby has 289.2 melee. The stat rolls up a little, though how much it changes is dependent on which species, which stat, and how many numbers in that stat you are working with. This is how you got better dinos before mutations, and obviously you still can.

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Cataclisto Cloth Armor

Cataclisto

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The mutations are broken when it comes to inbreeding, I'll give you a scenario.

Rex 1: mutations 20/20 + rex 2 (sister of rex 1): mutations 20/20
Breeds together, offspring will have mutations 40/20 on both or one of the maternal/paternal. These both still have 20 mutations but the counter is now broke and will keep going up. If you keep breeding you can really break it... I'll give you a example on something I have.
example.thumb.jpg.3582bd6895decd5fbbcda0f0155cef96.jpg
There isn't this many mutations on it... I wish there was... Its just a semi-broken mechanic right now showing history mutations and adding them up. Not showing current mutations.

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invincibleqc Flak Armor

invincibleqc

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First of all, you cannot extract points of a tamed/bred creature with dododex; this is a WILD stats calculator. Smart people use Smart Breeder by @cad:

Second of, a stat mutation give 2 extra points into a specific stat. Which include the 7 stats (Health, Stamina, Oxygen, Food, Weight, Melee and Speed). So yes, a speed mutation is possible (expect for flyers, which only rolls onto 6 stats). However, a mutation will increase the markers. Meaning that you didn't get a mutation. The difference of points is caused by the rounded stats which make dododex, which is again a WILD stats calculator, will detect those as higher/lower and add/substract more points onto some stats. Then when it add all points together and calculate the speed based on given level, you gain/lose speed points.

 

In short, don't use dododex calculator for tamed/bred creatures cause you will only get false results.

 

As for exceeded markers, this only means that a 20+/20 won't roll for new mutations. Markers are not broken, since they adds up from previous parents. This is why you need to avoid inbreed, or make sure your babies get the stats/colors for the markers they carry otherwise they are dirty breeding lines that cannot mutate further.

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invincibleqc Flak Armor

invincibleqc

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10 minutes ago, DarthaNyan said:

you can, even manually, if you know "mult" and "add" modifiers for tamed creature's stats (mainly damage).

You just... can't. Dododex is for wild stats. Once a creature is tamed, it gains taming bonuses into some stats which will results in higher values and dododex will extract them as higher points than they really are. You should probably read the instructions of the tools you are using.egFLYrT.png

Also, I'm not saying that points cannot be extracted, just that OP is trying to place a screw using a hammer which resulted in the false results and confusion about this whole thread.

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Oldskool Cloth Armor

Oldskool

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6 hours ago, invincibleqc said:

You just... can't. Dododex is for wild stats. Once a creature is tamed, it gains taming bonuses into some stats which will results in higher values and dododex will extract them as higher points than they really are. You should probably read the instructions of the tools you are using.egFLYrT.png

Also, I'm not saying that points cannot be extracted, just that OP is trying to place a screw using a hammer which resulted in the false results and confusion about this whole thread.

You can use it for any Dino as long as you know the stats from parents and when it was born. I have been using this tool for ages and it is always correct. It only has to show where the levels of the Dino have gone, wild or bred it doesn't matter. Its the same thing. This was not the point of the post tho, I do use smart breeder and it tells me the exact same results, dododex is just easier because i have it on my tablet as I play. Im not new to this breeding business, just first time out of over 200 rexs that I have had a point increase with no mutation on the board. And a new stat that is not just rounded up slightly is 2 levels higher than both parents. Just wanted see if anyone had anything similar not a lecture in using the "smart people" tool. 

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Oldskool Cloth Armor

Oldskool

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6 hours ago, DarthaNyan said:

you can, even manually, if you know "mult" and "add" modifiers for tamed creature's stats (mainly damage).

You 100% can. I have compared with my friend who always uses smart breeder and we are always on the same results. I actually prefer the look of dododex its less of an eye sore to see whats going on.  

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TheLastNerb Cloth Armor

TheLastNerb

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1 hour ago, Oldskool said:

You 100% can. I have compared with my friend who always uses smart breeder and we are always on the same results. I actually prefer the look of dododex its less of an eye sore to see whats going on.  

I am 100% sure, the dododex is not accurate for melee stat post tame on pteranodons or rexes. Smart breeder is much better

 

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danleveille

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17 hours ago, TheLastNerb said:

I am 100% sure, the dododex is not accurate for melee stat post tame on pteranodons or rexes. Smart breeder is much better

 

Hey guys. I'm the developer of Dododex. I can confirm that this is true -- Dododex is not built for post-tame stats, as the site says several times, because there are bonuses you get once you tame it -- you can't simply use the same formula for post-tame stats. If you try calculating points on top of that, you won't get correct results.

I plan on adding calculators for post-tame stats, breeding, etc. It's on the to-do list. :)

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Ballmann Cloth Armor

Ballmann

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The wiki has detailed formula for stat calculation, script them at excel and u have a working calcultor but use a round-function for melee the UI is not presenting the exact value. Also i would recommend to estimate the stats for tamed creatures and only calculate for breeded ones the taming efficiency mutliplier produces a slight failure in the calculation.

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Harrist14 Flak Armor

Harrist14

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9 hours ago, Ballmann said:

The wiki has detailed formula for stat calculation, script them at excel and u have a working calcultor but use a round-function for melee the UI is not presenting the exact value. Also i would recommend to estimate the stats for tamed creatures and only calculate for breeded ones the taming efficiency mutliplier produces a slight failure in the calculation.

Or just use ark smart breeding...

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MTek9 Cloth Armor

MTek9

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On 25/05/2017 at 11:00 AM, Demerus said:

I also had this happen to one of my beavers from breeding a wild tame. I gained 4 levels in melee with no mutation.

Not exactly sure the science behind it but am curious to find out why as well.

For you, it's because bred dinos that come from wild tames breed out their stats at 100% tame efficiency. 

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brenon45 Hide Armor

brenon45

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My tribe member breeds dimorphodons.. He breeds specificall a 218 and a 221 every reset. But all the babys come out with plus 6-14 levels worth of stats in variations of health, stam, or melee, weird part is there never the same and the keep getting thes bonus stats and levels with 0/20 muts on both sides with out really getting a overall level being higher...

 

Today. Newest one came out with 38 levels worth of stats but is only level 223. According to dododex it should be 261. Muts 0/20 on both sides.

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invincibleqc Flak Armor

invincibleqc

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1 hour ago, brenon45 said:

My tribe member breeds dimorphodons.. He breeds specificall a 218 and a 221 every reset. But all the babys come out with plus 6-14 levels worth of stats in variations of health, stam, or melee, weird part is there never the same and the keep getting thes bonus stats and levels with 0/20 muts on both sides with out really getting a overall level being higher...

 

Today. Newest one came out with 38 levels worth of stats but is only level 223. According to dododex it should be 261. Muts 0/20 on both sides.

How about you read previous posts? But let me repeat, Dododex is NOT for tamed/bred creatures.

Smart people use Smart Breeding:

 

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