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Cedric

Weigh In: Options for the future of Primitive+

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Something I would like to point in argument against the "make it part of the main game and have an ability to turn off tek" sentiment is that you are perhaps overlooking having to remove all those things from dino loot tables and loot crate tables as well. It's not just a matter of disabling engrams.

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14 hours ago, Cyres said:

Feedback from a German PS4 Player that was playing with friends on an own Server. 

.....

If I and my fellow Players had to decide I think it would be best to add P+ into the Main Game without the Tech and High-Tek Restrictions. More Building stuff is always a good Idea.

The Option in the main menu to choose between Survival Evolved and P+ (if this would work) could still be a Trigger that says: while this mode is activated -> disable the following Engrams (everything that does not suit P+) until the game is switched back to Survival Evolved.

This could solve 2 Problems at the same Time. First everyone can get new Stuff to build/decorate with no mather what Map/DLC they are playing and secondly there still would be the option to play P+ like it was intended (without advanced Weaponry or Tek)

I for one think this is a grate Idea.

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Personally, I love Primitive Plus and have played it on and off since starting with Ark.

The additional building items are awesome and seem to be appropriately designed to grow with the survivor. 

It seems to have a bit more of a progressive learning curve as well, whereas the standard game seems to miss the mark a bit. Adding even just a few of the items and building materials could help smooth that over. 

Even the consumables make sense, adding character to the kitchen and a few more options beyond the soups and stews. 

Most on the Primitive plus unofficial server I run would probably say the same as it has be a fun conversation topic with us in the past. 

It may mean losing our server, but if the items were in the standard edition, we would be okay as we have a server there as well. 

Edited by SapphireSam7

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Another thing you guys can do to save our servers and our work is just flip the switch from prim to normal. It was done by mistake before and the servers came up, all dinos and mats were there just any prim only things were gone. If somehow you could have brick=metal patch, and a list of containers to empty (cause they will go poof) and give us a week to try to get our mats moved out of them... Then swap us over to normal servers, lock transferring and let us farm turrets.

I just dont really think wiping a none legacy server type that has a big icon at the bottom of the main load screen to play it, that is considered at the same level as rag, and has zero specific updates in one year and a 20min load time is fair. By all measures it was designed to fail but we played it trusting that it would be supported, it hasn't been. Give us a path forward since we weren't give a path to succeed. 

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Guest BubbaCrawfish

Never could get into it as the load times were so long that it was just annoying to have to deal with that on an SSD/high spec system.

Anything that makes it load up quicker and more reliably, would be good for it.

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FINALLY, THE POST THAT I HAVE WAITED 3 YEARS FOR!!!!

Experienced Ark player not so experienced coder. Correct me if I am wrong, but from my understanding it sounds as if wipes are going to be necessary no matter what to make any real progress in preserving prim+. So as someone who has played normal Ark and Prim+ I can say that if Prim+ becomes apart of the normal game in the sense that it just carries over structures, recipes, weapons, etc as pieces in the game, but still allows the existence of TEK and higher tech engrams then I can guarantee that the majority of its players are going to not play ark anymore. The reason we enjoy Prim+ so much is because it allows what we feel is the "true Ark experience." If we just have to go back to normal Ark and deal with every person who just farms up C4 and rockets then goes around wiping people then you are going to lose all of us. With that being said from what I have gathered from my 3 years playing the game is that the majority of people playing Prim+ are Role-players running private servers(like myself as of late) and people who don't like the normal aspects of normal Ark. Prim+ has been so buggy and so under maintained that I don't think there is anything else that can happen that will make players stop playing. We have endured Hell so I don't think much else can happen that will stop us from toughing it out.  So let me ask this question: How doable is it to integrate primitive plus into the main game, but allowing a ticker box option on private servers that essentially just disables higher up engrams? Would that not be the simplest way? Then just run official PVP server with that setting engaged? Then from there the Devs could continue to integrate new content without the consistent bug problem we have been plagued with for the last couple years. Yes there would be wipes but I personally feel that the wipes would be worth it if it means we are going to get a stable, well maintained game. By just enabling the content on official servers players can choose if they want to use their engram points to unlock the new items or not. This would make it so that PVP players could ignore the new building textures if they so please, but PVE'ers who are more interested in building structures could choose to use them. It also would make it incredibly easier to add new content to the game because it would just require the addition of new engrams at different levels throughout the game. There even could be integration of the primitive items like the industrial forge by simply making the normal industrial forge be unlocked later and either increasing it's production or decreasing the prim+ ind. forges production. You could still even retain things like coal and claystone as resources. You could also finally synchronize adobe structures by making them not require different types of clay to make them. That's just my two sense. Honestly on private servers the wipes wouldn't be as bad because through the ability to boost servers most progress could be rebuilt in a short period of time. As far as the official servers go it sounds to me as if they could use a fresh start. I have been saying for a long time that the key for Ark's success is to consolidate the game and go away from scattered method we have now. So excited we are getting some sort of dialogue going now at least. On another note I really do have to hand it to you Cedric I have seen you in just the last week engaging in dialogue with players on this matter more than other devs have in like the last 2 years. We appreciate your effort.

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i am gonna say and agree that it should just intergrate to the main game because ark needs more crops and primitive plus does this also scorched earth has fire arrows already and primitive plus has its own fire arrows another thing is currently primitive plus isn't ascendable as last i played it cause u can't even go into the redwood cave on the island without scuba primitive plus removes scuba gear so thus ending the boss battleing pointless and not doable.. so tbh make it part of the main game adding its features and content so that way we have more crops more weapons more tools more resources just much more...... ingeneral. : )

  • Like 1

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Ok since this thread was posted initially us Prim Plus Players were excited Ced was making us feel recognized. We don't get much attention from Wildcard except for a couple old timers with some sentimental attachments from when it first went live. Then concern overwhelmed us with the thought of all our hard work getting wiped away.

So the regular blood sweat and tear Prim Plus people have been trying to come up with the best solution for us mainly since we are the ones being affected. We have had great discussion in discord etc. 

How about this @ced?

How about you create your new servers that will work seamlessly and progress with the Ark story line. Then allow input from a representative which we would recommend since they would have our best interest on what parts to turn on and off. Just before the transition give us the ability to transfer tames/bloodlines to the new servers. The one issue that is hard for us Prim Plus players to let go is the bloodlines some have developed over the last couple years. It is extremely hard to breed and maintain consistent deep lines because its all hands on. We do not have refrigerators and tek feeders. Don't get me wrong we want it to be hard but we also want the reward of our much invested time and ingenuity. Again we have some very deep bloodlines from grueling breeding. We do not want to have to start lines all over. Now if we could have a time of say 60 days to transfer those special bloodlines to the new server/ cluster I believe that would be enough to get everyone on board and we can move forward. 

I think this is fair and with a new faster loading, up to date, expanded story line , still true Prim Plus game play , set of servers some old timers would come back and new players could give it a try and hopefully they have as much fun as we do. 

Thanks for your time ,

VannZann ( Lucy ) 

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I'm not a long time Prim+ player. I dabbled, and I loved the new items, the building options, the no tek feel, but it was too restrictive when it came to adding mods (I'm a sucker for those), and Prim+ on single player wasn't that fun.

So I'm of the mind to integrate it into ARK main game. I love building options, I've been longing for new farmables for ages, and since you can disable engrams you could create a "Prim+" ini file and/or Prim+ setting tick boxes for the settings page. (Like a new tab called Prim+ or something). It won't be 100% the same, but it's possible to disable dino riding for certain dinos, too, right? It should be doable to fiddle with ini settings to set up a very primitive server that doesn't allow modern stuff.

If you do incorporate Prim+ in, I also highly encourage you to let Prim+ players know in advance so they can prepare.

Also as a budding modder I'd be delighted to have access to Prim+ items.

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I play on both pc and ps4, but primitive plus is more important to me on ps4. With that bias layed out, I would say it should be made a core part of the game, but with an easy to access checkbox for singleplayer or splitscreen players to enable and disable based on tech flavor preference. If a few well explained checkboxes could change both loot-tables and engram availability, I think making all the stuff core would be welcome to nearly all. Perhaps the problem with prim+ specific stuff not being useable in customizeable rp food recipes could be tackled in the integration process? Heck, if different tech tiers could be easily toggled on and off, even stone age playthroughs could become supported? So my vote is core implementation as long as it leads to muuuch better engram-loot control for users in the process. Perhaps even achievements/trophies for defeating certain bosses in worlds locked below certain technology levels? Or am I just getting greedy now...

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Hello,

I played it before retail launch and after every big update. I like it very much. However it's too far between updates so to say that it is unsupported is not a stretch, just so many dead ends.

If it is removed that is ok, sadly.

Another player trap is legacy servers, dead end sooner or later.

Regards,

Ariana 

Edited by ArianaGaming

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How bout you dont strip the people who have been working on prim plus since the games been out of everything they've worked on? Just do your best to keep up and if you cant then just leave it out of any further updates. We just need coal and kib fixed and then you can leave it alone all together, me and my tribe have been playing on prim plus since it came out and have dinos that are thousands of generations in so we do not want prim to be forgotten but we also dont want to lose all of our progress since the start of prim

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Yeah just drop us from the update list and leave us be if ya must, or be nice and fix it so it doesn't load core then overwrite with prim and just loads prim. I get the other people want all the prim stuff to the core game but what they are really talking about is shutting down a official supported mod that they didn't support. It's not that people didnt want to play the version of this game, they did its just this version of the game never was given the care all the other official mods were.

Drop us from the normal patch list.

Fix the load

Now that you are not rewriting the mod every week spend a little time on the bugs list from 2 years ago after you take all the prim content and add it to the normal servers so they can not use any of it and wonder why none of the crops do anything.

Be funny as hell if you added the battle axe to the normal game, just so all you guys know no door or gate can hold up to it for longer then 30secs. The rest..... you have better versions. Would be a ton of work adding it to the main game for nothing... Except what some of you are talking about which is disabling everything and making a prim plus server.... which we have now!

The dev is saying they are gonna wipe us cause rather then splitting us out of the game (like i thought we should of been being it restarts when you turn prim on) and spending their time giving us updates they been wasting their time making specific patches to keep us running with each patch. Which being we have been able to pick up ankys for one week with our argents just now and that came out match 20th last year  has mostly been to keep our servers online and not actually add the patches....

We aint a legacy server, we need a path out of here....

Edited by kelive

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I probably should mention that I talk as someone who mostly plays solo, barely ever on any server, so that skewers my perception of things.

Please do not think that I "want to take away from prim+ players". I honestly wouldn't mind not having Prim+ stuff not be part of the main game, if the assets were made available for modders - then modding community would let those who want the items/building options/crops/etc have them, while keeping Prim+ itself intact.

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35 minutes ago, Ihmislehma said:

I probably should mention that I talk as someone who mostly plays solo, barely ever on any server, so that skewers my perception of things.

Please do not think that I "want to take away from prim+ players". I honestly wouldn't mind not having Prim+ stuff not be part of the main game, if the assets were made available for modders - then modding community would let those who want the items/building options/crops/etc have them, while keeping Prim+ itself intact.

Oh no, it's the framing of the question, "What to do about prim plus" 1-5 are something then wipe. All are wipe, we dont wanna get wiped lol whats done with the content doesnt matter to us, the questions arent even directed at us. "Hey we are gonna wipe prim you guys want their stuff?" lol

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Ok, first of all I wanna apologize because this comment is gonna be a long one:

 

Thanks for the support of Primitive Plus. I already said it somewhere else in this forum and I will say it again. Thanks for that.

 

I played "the poop" out of this mode because of one simple reason: I like the primitive style which is why in my opinion it doesn't belong to be in the main game. But on the other hand, being part of the main game would also drastically increase the loading time, right? It would give you guys way more options to better work with it?

 

To be honest here, I wouldn't make it a mod again. It was that before and as you said yourself already: Potential functionality loss. Nope. I don't want that. Nobody wants that.

 

Let the community handle it? Maybe by this Survival Plus guy? God no! I have respect for what some people can do but there is a reason why so many people still play the "buggy mess" called Primitive Plus! Because we like the way Primitive Plus DOES make changes to the game. And that's why this is my opinion on what you guys should do:

 

Make it a part of this main game. But under one condition: Add an option in the game settings which automatically removes modern engrams and items/objects from loot tables like drops and beacons so people can easily activate a "Primitive Mode". This is really important if you decide to make it part of the main game because even tho the Primitive Plus content can be integrated without any problems because it makes sense to be in the main game, it's main reason is going to be ignored if you don't add this option in the settings. Because Primitive Plus was supposed to limit the players at some point.

 

Anyway, I hope I stated everything in an understandable way. I apologize if everything wasn't clearly understandable, I am German so English isn't my native language. What do you think about this? Can this idea of a "Primitive Mode" option be pulled of so people in the main game can easily get rid of the modern content and still enjoy Primitive Plus to it's fullest?

 

No matter what you'll do in the end I am sure it will be good for both the DLC but also for the community.

 

Edit: I read through a few comments by now and I'll see that a lot of people complain about what I have seen come of Primitive Plus gets to be part of the main game: People wanna be limited but with all the modern content they aren't. In this case, again, my idea of a "Primitive Mode" option in the settings would make everyone happy. Modern players have access to everything and Primitive Plus players can limit themselves with this option.

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I think before you, Cedric, don't fully understand my idea of the so called "Primitive Mode" I will carefully explain what I expect what it should do:

It should be a checkbox option somewhere on the normal settings of ARK. If it is checked it removes ever modern engrams and items/objects from dino loot as well as from Beacons and loot crates like the ones in the caves or the deep see loot crates. Something modern that should still exist in the Primitive Plus games are for example the TEK Dinos on Extinction. It makes sense to still exist in a Primitive Mode because of the ARK Story.

Do you think this is technically being able to be done? With this, integrating it into the main game would be the best option you have.

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I play on both pc and ps4, but primitive plus is more important to me on ps4. With that bias layed out, I would say it should be made a core part of the game, but with an easy to access checkbox for singleplayer or splitscreen players to enable and disable based on tech flavor preference. If a few well explained checkboxes could change both loot-tables and engram availability, I think making all the stuff core would be welcome to nearly all. Perhaps the problem with prim+ specific stuff not being useable in customizeable rp food recipes could be tackled in the integration process? Heck, if different tech tiers could be easily toggled on and off, even stone age playthroughs could become supported? So my vote is core implementation as long as it leads to muuuch better engram-loot control for users in the process. Perhaps even achievements/trophies for defeating certain bosses in worlds locked below certain technology levels? Or am I just getting greedy now...

Just read your comment. You have the same idea that I have. Integrating Primitive Plus into the main game with some sort of checkbox. Your right. That would make everyone happy.

 

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4 hours ago, kelive said:

Oh no, it's the framing of the question, "What to do about prim plus" 1-5 are something then wipe. All are wipe, we dont wanna get wiped lol whats done with the content doesnt matter to us, the questions arent even directed at us. "Hey we are gonna wipe prim you guys want their stuff?" lol

My bad, I misunderstood.

Yeah they should consider you guys more. Unfortunately, I think you are in the minority. So your voice will easily be drown out.

I wonder what part/s of Prim+ tend to break when the main game updates? Knowing that might help finding a fix. And I still think allowing the assets to be used in modding would give many players the best of both worlds, though I understand that console players would be left in the dark. (I'm a PC player so I easily forget console versions exist)

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My bad, I misunderstood.
Yeah they should consider you guys more. Unfortunately, I think you are in the minority. So your voice will easily be drown out.
I wonder what part/s of Prim+ tend to break when the main game updates? Knowing that might help finding a fix. And I still think allowing the assets to be used in modding would give many players the best of both worlds, though I understand that console players would be left in the dark. (I'm a PC player so I easily forget console versions exist)
Well you also have to admit that it's not very fair for the vanilla game players to not be able to get Primitive Plus content added to the main game IF it is possible. But that's not even the important thing here.

We are talking about Primitive Plus, a big DLC. No matter if you are a long year Primitive Plus player or not (I am one myself Btw): Adding it into the main game is the best decision because in the long run it is easier to maintain, to update and we will no longer get updates that break Primitive Plus because it is a separate DLC. Being part of the main game will fix literally everything. And I gotta say it again: Add a checkbox in the settings which disables modern content so Primitive Plus players can limit themselves as always.

I am playing this for years and I'll be honest: If adding it to the main game fixes so much then I'll gladly give up my saves.

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