Mindwipe tonic can now only be applied once per level up.

[Iimmy]

51 minutes ago, ranger1presents said:

Which means there are far more people abusing (to use the term loosely) than are apparent even in this thread.  You just reinforced my point my friend.

How is being able to reallocate your skills and attributes at LEAST 100 times "useless" again?  "Cause I'm not seeing it.

This is baffling.

I've used mindwipe 3 times in 2200 hours. I play Solo, so it's a necessity to do it once or twice, which is acceptable.

So I'm lvl 100 now, now I can't do it again, little to ZERO chance of ascending due to being solo and having a family.

Once again another band-aid fix applied by a team of artists who make pretty models but have baffling and downright rubbish approach to balance and coding.

Why not make it cost 3k ingots, 1k poly, 1k Organic poly if necessary, then it won't be spammed. If it is spammed it'll cost you a fortune.

There, even that is a better approach in an offhand comment thought up in 10 seconds than the mess the devs are consistently making time and time again.

The flyer nerf brought the 'Overall' rating down on steam, that was no small feat due to the number of reviews, I'll not sit and patiently watch it plummet again. A dangerous gamble with full release imminent. 

Just a little hint to WC, when browsing on Steam for new games to buy, I would STOP and very carefully consider something with 100k reviews having a "mixed" or lower review score, most likely would just simply not purchase it. 

Learn from your mistakes, take ownership, suck it up and apologise and look after your players. Important lessons to learn, especially with full release incoming. 

 

[BeardO]

Any word on whether or not we private server peeps will be able to change this with an ini setting?

[Lumitesi]

38 minutes ago, Volcano637 said:

Because they have been around for a lot longer

And they have tried costly re-specs and eventually learned that flexible character customization only adds to a game

So Ark devs have got the choice of making the same mistakes or learning from someone else's. Seems like they wanna taste how it feels making those mistakes instead of avoiding them.

[SinWeaver]

Bob: Hey, play play plah, why don't you join our tribe and play with us.

Joe: Sorry, I already used my one mindwipe 4 years ago, I speed to troll with a club, so it how I will play the game till I quite.

Bob: But you can delete you too and start all the way over.

Joe: Nah, why don't you use your 1 mindwipe and come troll with me.

Bob: I can't I used mine so I could emptied this box for a trade so all I can do is move pixels now.

Joe: ah well nice meeting you, to bad we can't play together...

[perk8504]

3 minutes ago, ArkRage said:

I have numerous characters across different servers and not one of them have even reached lvl 100. I'm in no rush to max out either as anything I may want I can always ask for, although that is not the point. I just don't like the fact that things are permanent when we cannot predict what will destroy us next. I've only ever used one mind wipe to see what all the fuss is about. Give the assumptions a rest, or don't, it's hilarious.

the assumptions were based on YOUR example

if you're not level 100, then there's no issue, you can still mind wipe to get that 1 engram you dont have anymore

[Bckjerome]

So far the only supporting argument I've seen is that this was to fix game breaking mindwipe spam. Well from now on I think we should all just focus on things to make the game harder.

 

1)5 wood per tree (regardless of skill or dino)

2)1 stone from rocks (because I mean, a rock is a rock right?)

3)darts and arrows are to op, everything must be done with a club or fists.

4)all other structures are to strong so everything is reverting to thatch.

5)transmitters make transferring way to easy they are now on a one month cd.

you can call me unreasonable or whatever you like but all these stupid things I'm bringing up can be considered "game breaking" by a certain person. This list could go on forever if I had the patience to do it. Because a therizno getting over 1k wood from one redwood tree...are you kidding me? Or a deod getting close to 1k stone from a metal node? Don't hear anyone complaining about that. Fact is tribe professions is a very stupid concept in this game because only maybe 10% of tribes can actually utilize this idea because if you look at what most tribes are it's 2 to 4 people where as on 2 are probably considered active. The reason this will never change is because how easy it is for some random to completely ruin all your hard work by just trusting the wrong person. This may have been something super game breaking on pvp but on pve this was hurting nobody and now your just forcing people to make separate characters to make ult professions on because nobody is going to put faith in someone in their tribe to be on when they need them(anyone who has played an MMO and has been in an active raiding tribe/clan/guild knows what I'm talking about...oh well we where supposed to be raiding 30 mins ago but our tank/healer hasn't shown up yet). This is why like every MMO has made it easy to repec classes.

 

[EBW]

So I now have to just spend hour or two power leveling a crafter with all points into craft and have my main character who I used for everything else. This hasn't solved any issues WC (mainly because there wasn't an issue to begin with), all you've done is made me visit the obi every time I need to do a bunch of crafting instead of pop a mind wipe.

If anything WC have done us all a massive favor! No need to constantly learn engrams after mind wipes! Thanks boys

[Ranger1]

4 minutes ago, Bckjerome said:

So far the only supporting argument I've seen is that this was to fix game breaking mindwipe spam. Well from now on I think we should all just focus on things to make the game harder.

 

1)5 wood per tree (regardless of skill or dino)

2)1 stone from rocks (because I mean, a rock is a rock right?)

3)darts and arrows are to op, everything must be done with a club or fists.

4)all other structures are to strong so everything is reverting to thatch.

5)transmitters make transferring way to easy they are now on a one month cd.

you can call me unreasonable or whatever you like but all these stupid things I'm bringing up can be considered "game breaking" by a certain person. This list could go on forever if I had the patience to do it. Because a therizno getting over 1k wood from one redwood tree...are you kidding me? Or a deod getting close to 1k stone from a metal node? Don't hear anyone complaining about that. Fact is tribe professions is a very stupid concept in this game because only maybe 10% of tribes can actually utilize this idea because if you look at what most tribes are it's 2 to 4 people where as on 2 are probably considered active. The reason this will never change is because how easy it is for some random to completely ruin all your hard work by just trusting the wrong person. This may have been something super game breaking on pvp but on pve this was hurting nobody and now your just forcing people to make separate characters to make ult professions on because nobody is going to put faith in someone in their tribe to be on when they need them(anyone who has played an MMO and has been in an active raiding tribe/clan/guild knows what I'm talking about...oh well we where supposed to be raiding 30 mins ago but our tank/healer hasn't shown up yet). This is why like every MMO has made it easy to repec classes.

 

So I may be out of the loop, but which popular MMO is it that allows your tank to instantly respec completely as a healer, and then on to anything else you may need at a moments notice?

[Bckjerome]

2 minutes ago, ranger1presents said:

So I may be out of the loop, but which popular MMO is it that allows your tank to instantly respec completely as a healer, and then on to anything else you may need at a moments notice?

Lol I may have missed worded but usually some sort of mage can respec into healer or melee can respec into tank to fill your need for a raid

[Ranger1]

3 minutes ago, ArkRage said:

No they weren't.  I simply stated it's a bad idea. And from there you flapped your lips about me wanting to mind wipe at lvl 100 and not being able to. Give ya head a bang, kid.

As stated previously, the point of the matter is that I want to relearn engrams once I hit level 100 if whatever reason I need to, and I no longer can. Idk DILO you or that other guys talking about. You both clearly have it in your minds that I want to abuse the mind wipe which is terribly frustrating as it's not the fking case. 

We don't particularly care if YOU respec constantly or not, that is completely irrelevant.  The point is that anyone CAN... and frequently DO... use this tactic to avoid their choices having any lasting relevance.

[perk8504]

3 minutes ago, ArkRage said:

No they weren't.  I simply stated it's a bad idea. And from there you flapped your lips about me wanting to mind wipe at lvl 100 and not being able to. Give ya head a bang, kid.

As stated previously, the point of the matter is that I want to relearn engrams once I hit level 100 if whatever reason I need to, and I no longer can. Idk DILO you or that other guys talking about. You both clearly have it in your minds that I want to abuse the mind wipe which is terribly frustrating as it's not the fking case. 

I have yet to say that you want to abuse it (not sure he did either...), I'm simply laying out the other options that are available instead of having to mind wipe time after time

and I already posted (my first post in the topic) that I think it needs to be rethought for max level characters, and that I thought the month long cool down seemed appropriate for max levels, but keeping 1 per level the same for everyone else seemed reasonable

but the fact of the matter is, that the reason for this change IS because there were a lot of people abusing it

[Lumitesi]

40 minutes ago, ranger1presents said:

Something else to consider, when everyone can respec their character from the ground up to do anything and everything in game to perfection... what value are you to a tribe?  Other than being another meat shield of course.

Your skills and stats should have some value... even if someone else can rival you in your chosen area the next time (out of 100+ times) they level up.

For the most part the only people that will be negatively affected will be those that min/max their characters constantly and have come to depend on being able to focus every fiber of their being into whatever they are doing at the moment.  Their choices literally have zero consequence beyond their present task.

It's not hard to see why WC, for official game play at least, do not want this to be the case.  For everyone else there will be a mod that gets around this within the week, if that long.

This is SO wrong. Firstly all the stats do is help with fulfilling tasks. You can't finish any of the end-game content off of stats. When i was doing boss runs I didn't ask people for stats even. They could do hard dragon as long as they knew the tactics and fulfilled their role, which again, has nothing to do with stats because if you do the dragon well you can avoid all damage to your char. Having the best stats for it just made you be able to commit 1 or 2 more mistakes. And even in PvP, if you can't hit the broad side of a barn, there isn't really much usefulness to you. Your stats are 0.00005% of your value as a player, end-off.

And once again, the people that will be affected negatively the most aren't min/maxers, it's the people with certain roles inside a tribe (like crafting) who will be forced to have all their points into 1 stat that is useless for 99% of the game and will have NO chance of having a decent build that allows them to have fun because they will have 1 mindwipe until their tribe decides to carry them through tek cave. Do you see how ridiculous this sounds? Would you accept to play in these conditions? I for sure wouldn't. I wouldn't be a human crafting station and might end up being kicked out of the tribe for it. Now tell me, do you really think this is good design?

[Bckjerome]

6 minutes ago, perk8504 said:

I have yet to say that you want to abuse it (not sure he did either...), I'm simply laying out the other options that are available instead of having to mind wipe time after time

and I already posted (my first post in the topic) that I think it needs to be rethought for max level characters, and that I thought the month long cool down seemed appropriate for max levels, but keeping 1 per level the same for everyone else seemed reasonable

but the fact of the matter is, that the reason for this change IS because there were a lot of people abusing it

How can people possibly say people where abusing something that was super easy to get. I'd simply call it playing the game. So when you go use a dino to farm a resource is it considered abuse? I mean it makes things easier right? Better remove it from the game. Now if they make it more expensive or on a cooldown to make it more difficult that's one thing, but making it so people no longer get a chance to do more than one thing a Max level is no different then removing gathering from all dinos.

[Ranger1]

4 minutes ago, Lumitesi said:

This is SO wrong. Firstly all the stats do is help with fulfilling tasks. You can't finish any of the end-game content off of stats. When i was doing boss runs I didn't ask people for stats even. They could do hard dragon as long as they knew the tactics and fulfilled their role, which again, has nothing to do with stats because if you do the dragon well you can avoid all damage to your char. Having the best stats for it just made you be able to commit 1 or 2 more mistakes. And even in PvP, if you can't hit the broad side of a barn, there isn't really much usefulness to you. Your stats are 0.00005% of your value as a player, end-off.

And once again, the people that will be affected negatively the most aren't min/maxers, it's the people with certain roles inside a tribe (like crafting) who will be forced to have all their points into 1 stat that is useless for 99% of the game and will have NO chance of having a decent build that allows them to have fun because they will have 1 mindwipe until their tribe decides to carry them through tek cave. Do you see how ridiculous this sounds? Would you accept to play in these conditions? I for sure wouldn't. I wouldn't be a human crafting station and might end up being kicked out of the tribe for it. Now tell me, do you really think this is good design?

I think you're misrepresenting and exaggerating your point of view.  No, if your tribe is worth staying with they won't throw you out if your skill set isn't ideal for a particular task, especially when it has value when doing other tasks.

If their choices in how they develop that character are really that poor though, and they weren't able to fix that after 100+ redo's, then perhaps they do deserve to be thrown out.

The comments you made about stats not affecting the things you do, particularly in PVP combat situations, I'm not going to get into for obvious reasons.  Lets just say that my experiences haven't proven that to be true. 

[Ranger1]

2 minutes ago, Bckjerome said:

How can people possibly say people where abusing something that was super easy to get. I'd simply call it playing the game. So when you go use a dino to farm a resource is it considered abuse? I mean it makes things easier right? Better remove it from the game. Now if they make it more expensive or on a cooldown to make it more difficult that's one thing, but making it so people no longer get a chance to do more than one thing a Max level is no different then removing gathering from all dinos.

You are quite correct in this.  The mechanic was allowed, so it can't truthfully be called abuse or exploitation.  However, it should also be easy to understand why it has been changed, considering how powerful it was.

[perk8504]

3 minutes ago, Bckjerome said:

How can people possibly say people where abusing something that was super easy to get. I'd simply call it playing the game. So when you go use a dino to farm a resource is it considered abuse? I mean it makes things easier right? Better remove it from the game. Now if they make it more expensive or on a cooldown to make it more difficult that's one thing, but making it so people no longer get a chance to do more than one thing a Max level is no different then removing gathering from all dinos.

you people need to stop comparing apples to molasses

it's pretty obvious that mind wipe tonic was introduced for occasional use, so that you DID have a method to respec if you made mistakes, or decided on a different way to play, or needed a different set of engrams after disaster struck

but instead people were using it, crafting a handful of potions, using it again, crafting a handful of items, using it again, to make trading large amounts more convenient, using it again and going in on a boss fight (and don't tell me it wasn't happening, it's been said by many people here that's how they were using it)

whereas it's painfully obvious that better harvesting using dinos is an intended mechanic, that gets tweeked as needed as well (i.e. theriz getting a farming nerf, and doed/mammoth/anky getting farming buffs)

[Bckjerome]

2 minutes ago, ranger1presents said:

You are quite correct in this.  The mechanic was allowed, so it can't truthfully be called abuse or exploitation.  However, it should also be easy to understand why it has been changed, considering how powerful it was.

So are you also agreeing that Dino's shouldn't gather since that's overpowered too?

[Zayisha]

32 minutes ago, ranger1presents said:

So I may be out of the loop, but which popular MMO is it that allows your tank to instantly respec completely as a healer, and then on to anything else you may need at a moments notice?

Ever heard of "World of Warcraft" (WoW)?

No? No Problem, don't worry... it's just only the biggest und most successfull MMO up to day.

[eESTlane]

if you go into the high 90+ levels, the exp requirements to further yourself take quite a long time. so people might forget whether the last mindwipe is effectively still counting. i wouldn't have minded if mindwipe actually had amnestic effects where you'd lose memories. like, 10-20% of your total exp or smth. so in dire situations which pvp sometimes provide, you'd still be able to respond. 

personally, i don't like these stat based characters. the least they could do is diminishing returns. the other option which i would also liked to have seen is using skill (job) based leveling with hunters getting boost in melee, stam and health, farmers getting better farming rates and weight, tamers getting higher taming & breeding rates, aquamen thriving in the water with increased oxy and stam and swim speed etc. right now anyone can become anyone, making noone particularly special. but whatever. WC took this road and this has been suggested countless times. 

[Bckjerome]

5 minutes ago, perk8504 said:

you people need to stop comparing apples to molasses

it's pretty obvious that mind wipe tonic was introduced for occasional use, so that you DID have a method to respec if you made mistakes, or decided on a different way to play, or needed a different set of engrams after disaster struck

but instead people were using it, crafting a handful of potions, using it again, crafting a handful of items, using it again, to make trading large amounts more convenient, using it again and going in on a boss fight (and don't tell me it wasn't happening, it's been said by many people here that's how they were using it)

whereas it's painfully obvious that better harvesting using dinos is an intended mechanic, that gets tweeked as needed as well (i.e. theriz getting a farming nerf, and doed/mammoth/anky getting farming buffs)

You literally just explained my point, dino gathering is a game mechanic, when it becomes overpowered it gets a Nerf not removed from the game, mindwipe is also a game mechanic, where as many explain it to be "overpowered" why can't it to be nerfed instead of it just being removed for max lvl characters.

[LilNastyGurl]

1 hour ago, Zayisha said:

Ever heard of "World of Warcraft" (WoW)?

No? No Problem, don't worry... it's just only the biggest und successfull MMO up to day.

Game Myopia doesn't apply here.

Not everyone wants to play WoW.

[Bckjerome]

4 minutes ago, eESTlane said:

if you go into the high 90+ levels, the exp requirements to further yourself take quite a long time. so people might forget whether the last mindwipe is effectively still counting. i wouldn't have minded if mindwipe actually had amnestic effects where you'd lose memories. like, 10-20% of your total exp or smth. so in dire situations which pvp sometimes provide, you'd still be able to respond. 

personally, i don't like these stat based characters. the least they could do is diminishing returns. the other option which i would also liked to have seen is using skill (job) based leveling with hunters getting boost in melee, stam and health, farmers getting better farming rates and weight, tamers getting higher taming & breeding rates, aquamen thriving in the water with increased oxy and stam and swim speed etc. right now anyone can become anyone, making noone particularly special. but whatever. WC took this road and this has been suggested countless times. 

Love the idea of loss of xp on use, something like 10-20% not so sure about professions though. The more you get into that the more you require people to get into big tribes, and unless you personally know everyone in your tribe or at the very least trust them, you can lose way to much in this game for being in a tribe. It's not like any MMO where if someone douches you over you can just kick them and you maybe loose some loot. Here someone can level your entire base and every hour of work you put in.

[perk8504]

9 minutes ago, Bckjerome said:

You literally just explained my point, dino gathering is a game mechanic, when it becomes overpowered it gets a Nerf not removed from the game, mindwipe is also a game mechanic, where as many explain it to be "overpowered" why can't it to be nerfed instead of it just being removed for max lvl characters.

go back and read the first comment you quoted of mine...

 

but besides that, the intent WAS to nerf it...I just don't think it was fully thought out for max level characters (again, go back and read)

[Zayisha]

7 minutes ago, LilNastyGurl said:

Game Myopia doesn't apply here.

Not everyone wants to play WoW.

That was his question "in which game one is able to respec from tank to healer".

He just got his answer. i dont know them all, but every MMO has this feature. if there are ones without... never heard of them. guess why.

[Bckjerome]

4 minutes ago, Zayisha said:

 if there are ones without... never heard of them. guess why.

Loooooool

4 minutes ago, perk8504 said:

go back and read the first comment you quoted of mine...

 

but besides that, the intent WAS to nerf it...I just don't think it was fully thought out for max level characters (again, go back and read)

Ya, my bad I know you are not 100% in favor of how it was thought out. To be honest I quoted the wrong person when I made the comment about it not being abuse lol. Wasn't meaning to pick on you