[PVE] Wildcard destroys the endgame content on purpose

[iAmE]

1 minute ago, Jerryn said:

They literally just tried that with a couple of threads on the flyer re-balance.  But, the threads filled with the same arguments as all of the other threads, with some(if not many) people ignoring what was written and just re-posting the same demands.  It is ironic as so many people complain about a lack of communications, and when the lines are opened, any attempt at reasonable conversations, compromises, and ideas are just drowned out(and not just from one side) with repetitiveness and some that just take it so personally. 

And, there were some good ideas in there.  Fortunately, since it was created to get the ideas, I am pretty confident it was read, any constructive or original feedback was seen.  Communications are not always about getting your way, sometimes, you need to compromise a bit.  And, sometimes, you have to wait a bit; if everything is made a number 1 priority, nothing is a number 1 priority.

But, I think you are also correct on the bosses.  While glitches and exploits will get patched up, eventually, I hope, they will come back and look at it again.  I want to see creativity, planning, and risk to be as effective as brute force.

Communication is a two way street. They want Feedback, but they give us one iteration and possibility, and then expect discourse to come from....where exactly?

Not to mention, even at that point, there was a lot of trolling going around. From both sides. From Members and Moderators as well. 

 

To be fair, if a couple of *posts* from Development over the course of a controversy as huge as this flyer nerf is considered "Communication" then the respective people in charge of the communication need to go back to school . There was no communication in that thread. About once a day Jat would come in and say "We're closing this thread and opening a new one". TRH made a single post in the thread explaining their, general, direction. There was no communication there beyond that. 

There's been no meaningful acknowledgement of "Hey the Vanilla Flyer Mod has a huge population using it", and explaining that phenomenon. There's been absolutely no communication of any meaningful amount since the second iteration of the patch. 

Feedback tends to flow, uncontrolled, in a hundred different directions. Particularly when you're dealing with a demographic including hundreds of thousands of people, over a change that, literally, almost made the game unplayable at large, for multiple days. 

 

Even assuming that the one post by TRH was considered "Good communication", you can't just treat your testers and their respective feedback and place of giving it, like it doesn't exist (Which is what they've been doing) for how long now? A year at least? And magically expect the communication to turn a 180 because you gave a single post on the subject. 

[Wazzamaniac]

For the bosses, another way they could change them is making their progression linear (broodmother->megapithecus->dragon) by switching up the rewards you get from them and allowing tek items in the fights, on top of making them easier and less extremely difficult.

I suggest something like this. Broodmother would unlock the replicator and tek gun. Then, you could use the shiny new tek gun that you got to fight the megapithecus: it would have a weakness to it and take double damage or something, making sure that without said gun it is mayyybe possible, very risky and not recommended, on the other hand being doable with the gear awarded from the previous boss.

The megapithecus would then on allow the unlock of all the tek armor engrams. These items will be VERY useful to dodge the various high-speed attacks of the dragon and his minions, making you much more safe. 

Upon killing the dragon, you would be awarded with the remaining tek items, including the tek rex saddle which would be powerful enough against bosses to allow the farming of the required element by being a direct endgame counter to them, only obtainable after beating all bosses.

[Nachomasterx]

Bumping this thread because bosses and endgame in general needs reworked.

Let's keep this discussion going.

[Sky.NET]

On 6.4.2017 at 11:08 PM, Casanova said:

Your biggest mistake is that we haven't even added our end-game content yet.

Just want to quote your company:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mn2CwxY48Bk (Wildcards youtube)

Quote

14.11.2016

Revealed as part of the December cover feature with PC Gamer magazine (http://www.pcgamer.com/ark-tek-tier-u...), the TEK Tier update is endgame content in ARK’s crafting system that rewards hard-working players with awesome sci-fi armor, weapons, structures and gear.

http://www.pcgamer.com/ark-tek-tier-update/ (World Exclusive Info on Endgame Content sold to a Gamer Magazine)
 

Quote

For a complete preview of what's coming next, be sure to check out the next issue of PC Gamer, but here’s a basic breakdown. The Tek Tier is a new endgame technology tier in Ark’s crafting system that rewards the survival sandbox’s most stalwart players with some off-brand Power Rangers and Starship Troopers gear to mess with. 

 

Quote

Every ability and function requires Element, a rare resource you can only get by completing endgame challenges.

http://ark.gamepedia.com/Tek_Tier (Official Wiki, most of the time absolutely reliable on basic infos)

Quote

The Tek Tier is a set of end-game structures and equipment using very advanced technology. The first wave was released January 30th, 2017.

 

 

 

 

 

Mistake? Mh... time for an apologize because i was refering to your own companys PR all the time?
Or an apolozige from Jeremy (to everyone who was fooled) for being responsible to let this obvious lie (since you denied the existance of endgame content in the game) going out to the PR?

[GP]

13 minutes ago, Sky.NET said:

Mistake? Mh... time for an apologize because i was refering to your own companys PR all the time?
Or an apolozige from Jeremy (to everyone who was fooled) for being responsible to let this obvious lie (since you denied the existance of endgame content in the game) going out to the PR?

It's apology not apologize.

There is more end-game content to come, you can't say end-game content is being destroyed on purpose when the end-game content isn't finished.

[Sky.NET]

1 minute ago, GamerPerfection said:

It's apology not apologize.

There is more end-game content to come, you can't say end-game content is being destroyed on purpose when the end-game content isn't finished.

No?

So a half built house cant be blown into pieces, and if it gets blown into pieces regardless it cant, its not being destroyed?
Pls... come back to reality or give me some of that stuff, i wanna travel to other dimensions too.

[iAmE]

Just now, GamerPerfection said:

It's apology not apologize.

There is more end-game content to come, you can't say end-game content is being destroyed on purpose when the end-game content isn't finished.

Actually, you pretty easily can. 

Ever try to build on a fundamentally broken foundation? Anything you build is essentially destroyed. The same thing is happening here. Why release any of this Tek Tier stuff when you can't really test it due to mathematically unbeatable bosses? Particularly as you actively patch the only methods making them beatable, exploits or not?

[GP]

4 minutes ago, Sky.NET said:

No?

So a half built house cant be blown into pieces, and if it gets blown into pieces regardless it cant, its not being destroyed?
Pls... come back to reality or give me some of that stuff, i wanna travel to other dimensions too.

Maybe try waiting until all end-game content is out and everything gets balanced. I mean what the game is like now doesn't mean it will be like it is at 1.0 launch.

[Sky.NET]

Just now, GamerPerfection said:

Maybe try waiting until all end-game content is out and everything gets balanced. I mean what the game is like now doesn't mean it will be like it is at 1.0 launch.

Where did that got communicated?

Where did wildcard publicly announce

"Yo guys, we are hyping the tek stuff over the top, straight thru the roof aiming for the stratosphere but also trying to reach mars before mankind, BUT HEY, DONT GET TOO EXCITED, WE WILL MAKE IT LITTERALLY IMPOSSIBLE TO ENJOY THAT CONTENT"

???

I mean, with every sentence you answer here i feel more and more like you really wanna take me for a ride dude.

But at least this, your quoted answer is actually proving my thread title.
You just told me to skip end-game content entirely until V1.0.
Thx for the advice.

[Lewiatan]

How can be end-game content balanced without people who play it, because difficulty is so discouraging? I have no desire to lose 20 imprinted high level T-rexes, because developer thought that setting up the boss with XYZ thousands HP makes it fun and challanging to fight against. It takes no skill to fight them, only who can deals more dps and has more HP in the end.

[iAmE]

3 minutes ago, GamerPerfection said:

Maybe try waiting until all end-game content is out and everything gets balanced. I mean what the game is like now doesn't mean it will be like it is at 1.0 launch.

So, let me get this straight;

Someone says "They're destroying their end game content" because they are making bosses fundamentally unbeatable

You say "How do you destroy something that isn't out yet"

Someone responds "You can't build on a broken foundation"

You respond "Wait until they fix it"

I mean. That's great and all, if it wasn't for the fact that they're actively releasing more content for us to do, that we can't actually do, because the door is essentially a brick wall that can only be dealt with by, basically, cheating. While the devs are actively removing the ways to "Cheat". 

 

If you can't answer anything else, at all, answer me this;

Why are they wasting development time on "Tek" stuff, with the knowledge that the majority of the playerbase can't use, or acquire, them? Why wouldn't they implement a way to get these items first, reliably? Why are you releasing content onto a testing platform that testers can't actually acquire? Where is the logic in it?

[Sky.NET]

I have to quit this thread for today. Im speechless and need to chew up what GamerPerfection just said.

(btw. no worries, if this thread gets deleted because some "random" and "weird" "network error" happened or "the database got surprisingly damaged", i have made screenshots of the entire discussion)

[Kaelnayyan]

On 4/6/2017 at 4:08 PM, Casanova said:

Your biggest mistake is that we haven't even added our end-game content yet.

But, you haven't added it yet right? Tek teir isn't in the game right? 

 

Saying we haven't added it, and saying we haven't finished it are two very different things. Saying, "I meant we aren't done with it yet guys. I'm sorry, chill out." Is not too difficult I do not believe. I make myself apologize to my daughter all the time when I say something to her I didn't mean. And I'm the one paying for her existence. We the players are the ones paying for the developers, moderators, gms, and everyone else who gets a check from Wildcard's existence at this and every other point along the line. So in that thought, picking at someone's grammar, making backhanded comments about your own failure to type what you mean, and anything else that's not an apology is pure adolescent pride. 

 

In conclusion, no one should ever feel the need to not apologize. An apology is the basis for forgiveness. And when information is misleading or flat out deceptive (see quoted post) an apology is required from the offending party. I personally would like to see @Casanova explain what he meant by his original post on this thread. Because from all perspectives outside the dev/moderator perspective he flat out lied. And thus, owes the community an apology. 

[Nachomasterx]

This game is still in development. We know that. Tek teir, in its current state is our endgame. We know it isn't finished, but we are testing it. All of Tek teir is locked behind boring, and massively overpowered unimaginative bullet sponges that can only be defeated with cheats.

We can't legitimately beat the bosses in their current state, this isn't being addressed (that we know of). They keep putting new Tek stuff out with astronomical costs, but leave the old broken methods of obtaining it unfixed.

All of it requires crazy amounts of crystal, but we don't have an effective way to farm it in large quantities. The amount of element necessary to use Tek equipment is also too high relative to the cost to obtain it. 

Does wildcard plan to address these issues anytime soon? Could we get some communication on the issue?

[Wazzamaniac]

Just now, Nachomasterx said:

 amount of element necessary to use Tek equipment is also too high relative to the cost to obtain it. 

Also a good idea would be to bump the element reward amount waaayy up, along with the equipment craft costs, and leave the fuel consumption as is.

So you don't feel like you're missing out on a cool tek item craft by using up tons and tons of element as fuel because you want to keep your water base drained while offline. Because what's the advantage of that, anyway except for vanity?

[Twoapplesnbanana]

28 minutes ago, Wazzamaniac said:

Also a good idea would be to bump the element reward amount waaayy up, along with the equipment craft costs, and leave the fuel consumption as is.

So you don't feel like you're missing out on a cool tek item craft by using up tons and tons of element as fuel because you want to keep your water base drained while offline. Because what's the advantage of that, anyway except for vanity?

Agreed.  

I don't get why the armor/weapons drain so much element too.  Should definitely be reduced or system changed.  Could be like a torch, where as you use it (not simply wear/equipped tho) you lose durability.  Then can repair it like you would any other armor/weapon.  The only issue I'd see is the black pearls repair cost..

[Wazzamaniac]

5 minutes ago, Twoapplesnbanana said:

Agreed.  

I don't get why the armor/weapons drain so much element too.  Should definitely be reduced or system changed.  Could be like a torch, where as you use it (not simply wear/equipped tho) you lose durability.  Then can repair it like you would any other armor/weapon.  The only issue I'd see is the black pearls repair cost..

I heard no element is needed in the repair costs? maybe if it's reworked like you said it should cost a little bit, but I agree.

 

[Chris]

2 hours ago, Sky.NET said:

Just want to quote your company:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mn2CwxY48Bk (Wildcards youtube)

http://www.pcgamer.com/ark-tek-tier-update/ (World Exclusive Info on Endgame Content sold to a Gamer Magazine)
 

 

http://ark.gamepedia.com/Tek_Tier (Official Wiki, most of the time absolutely reliable on basic infos)

 

 

 

 

 

Mistake? Mh... time for an apologize because i was refering to your own companys PR all the time?
Or an apolozige from Jeremy (to everyone who was fooled) for being responsible to let this obvious lie (since you denied the existance of endgame content in the game) going out to the PR?

We've always said that Tek Tier is part of our End-Game content, however it's NOT our FULL and COMPLETE End-Game content. So when the OP said we have killed our End-Game - "WILDCARD DESTROYS THE ENDGAME CONTENT ON PURPOSE" - I wanted to correct him in the fact that it's barely in the builds that you are playing now, so do not judge our End-Game Content as it's not in yet. Specially as it's the major headline of this thread.

It's like saying this Ferrari 458 sucks and Ferrari have made such a HUGE mistake with this, when all you've experienced in the prototype of the bodywork.

As I said in my previous post, there is still a lot left to come, things you've never heard about or seen, which will all come together to make our End-Game content. And as always we need those things in place so we can balance the Tek Tier to make sure it all works as it should.

We understand some of you are angry that things aren't quite balanced yet, but I urge you to just bare with us and continue to provide solid and constructive feedback while we get everything in place.

[iAmE]

10 minutes ago, Casanova said:

We understand some of you are angry that things aren't quite balanced yet, but I urge you to just bare with us and continue to provide solid and constructive feedback while we get everything in place.

Quite balanced?

Provide feedback?

How are we supposed to do that when the gateway to getting your tek tier is mathematically impossible to beat?

 

No. Really. Once you patch the half dozen or so methods to glitch the bosses out that remain, no one will be able to do over half the boss content. You're asking us to give feedback, but you are ignoring the feedback we are giving you, and just shoving more things out there to "Test", seemingly ignorant of the fact that we can't test it because, again, the gate is broken.

We aren't angry that it isn't balanced. We're angry that we're being ignored, completely. 

[BlackSoul]

While reading patch notes I saw this:

Quote

- New Structure: Tek Cloning Chamber

Maybe devs mean that we won't need to breed/imprint so many dinos for arenas. We can, let's say, farm medium brood for element and use that element to clone rexes for the hard run. Just guessing.

It would've been nice if devs could at least give an example, because right now all we hear from them is "wait and don't ask questions or complain".

[Wazzamaniac]

15 minutes ago, Casanova said:

We understand some of you are angry that things aren't quite balanced yet, but I urge you to just bare with us and continue to provide solid and constructive feedback while we get everything in place.

I get where you're coming from and thank you for replying, but what you are saying sounds like this scenario:

PERSON 1: "Hey what do you think of my awesome sculpture in my basement?"

PERSON 2: "Oh geez, I don't know I haven't been in your basement yet, maybe you could let me in so I can admire your sculpture and give you constructive criticism?"

PERSON 1: "Lol no, you have to trust my word for it, it will be superb but I won't let you come see it, I just want your feedback before I finish it it's really important"

PERSON 2: " Ok fine then I'll just have to come in through a window or something to take a peek at it"

PERSON 1: "Thanks for telling me, I have now boarded my window. Now how about that feedback, huh? "

[iAmE]

1 minute ago, Wazzamaniac said:

I get where you're coming from and thank you for replying, but what you are saying sounds like this scenario:

PERSON 1: "Hey what do you think of my awesome sculpture in my basement?"

PERSON 2: "Oh geez, I don't know I haven't been in your basement yet, maybe you could let me in so I can admire your sculpture and give you consteuctive criticism?"

PERSON 1: "Lol no, you have to trust my word for it, it will be superb but I won't let you come see it, I just want your feedback before I finish it it's really important"

PERSON 2: " Ok fine then I'll just have to come in through a window or something to take a peek at it"

PERSON 1: "Thanks for telling me, I have now boarded my window. Now how about that feedback, huh? "

This is depressingly accurate. 

[Sky.NET]

24 minutes ago, Casanova said:

We've always said that Tek Tier is part of our End-Game content, however it's NOT our FULL and COMPLETE End-Game content. So when the OP said we have killed our End-Game - "WILDCARD DESTROYS THE ENDGAME CONTENT ON PURPOSE" - I wanted to correct him in the fact that it's barely in the builds that you are playing now, so do not judge our End-Game Content as it's not in yet. Specially as it's the major headline of this thread.

It's like saying this Ferrari 458 sucks and Ferrari have made such a HUGE mistake with this, when all you've experienced in the prototype of the bodywork.

As I said in my previous post, there is still a lot left to come, things you've never heard about or seen, which will all come together to make our End-Game content. And as always we need those things in place so we can balance the Tek Tier to make sure it all works as it should.

We understand some of you are angry that things aren't quite balanced yet, but I urge you to just bare with us and continue to provide solid and constructive feedback while we get everything in place.

The headline is as misleading as the flat out lying videos on youtube showing off INSANE amounts of fun you could have with that new "end-game" content.
Yet you cannot get it legit ways.
Im not angry, i just want an answer how you can hype something so excessive that you dont plan to give anyone?

Im a developer too, and if i would show ANY of my customers a video about nice stuff that will actually get implemented in their software and then not delivering it.... duuuuude...
Do you even think about stuff like that at wildcard?

Like sitting in the office and having a meeting before uploading hype videos and actually someone says

"guys... maybe we... we should just... we... just lets not get TOO loud about that, i know you did awesome work at the tek tier, and it looks pretty nice, but... we just cannot balance it until its all out, we are just not able to do that, and think about the nerfs coming... isnt that enough the core player base on our servers has to go through? lets just wait for it to be ready"

another guy answers then 

"we cannot do that, we announced it and already pushed it back multiple times, its hurting our reputation"

third guy

"lets just balance it according to the current state of the game, we can delete/wipe specific parts of player owned content later anyways, remember what we did with the artifacts, this way we take no risk, get some feeedback on testing and the players are happy, if something goes wrong, we just fix it by fixing/deleting exaggerated imbalances"

but nope...
that way of thinking seems to be nonexistant, dont get me wrong, i dont actually know whats going on at your office, and i know being a dev can be a VERY demanding and stressy job, but still, da heck is going wrong there?

I wanna enjoy game progression, i wanna play arround with TEK, since there is ABSOLUTELY nothing else that bugs me, i dont care for a tameable horse that does not give me any advantage (i tamed one for riding arround on it for "fun", but this fun gets old really quick).

...

I just dont get it, maybe an actual dev should answer here with a more satisfying answer than GP and Casa, cause they seem to have no idea in the first place and just throwing phrases around that add nothing to the discussion at all (its more like they try to build up an artifical "players vs. mods" situation, endgoal: locking up this thread after derailing it entirely? because it has a controversive title? controversive like hyped engame content that is not playable because, as we just read, its not supposed to be played until its FULLY in the game?).

[Wazzamaniac]

22 minutes ago, BlackSoul said:

While reading patch notes I saw this:

Maybe devs mean that we won't need to breed/imprint so many dinos for arenas. We can, let's say, farm medium brood for element and use that element to clone rexes for the hard run. Just guessing.

I'm gonna guess the cloning chamber will be unlockable with the hardest boss so the risk will still be there, and it'll likely use a lot of element to run. 

[Twoapplesnbanana]

35 minutes ago, Casanova said:

We've always said that Tek Tier is part of our End-Game content, however it's NOT our FULL and COMPLETE End-Game content. So when the OP said we have killed our End-Game - "WILDCARD DESTROYS THE ENDGAME CONTENT ON PURPOSE" - I wanted to correct him in the fact that it's barely in the builds that you are playing now, so do not judge our End-Game Content as it's not in yet. 

That's quite different then what you previously said..

"Your biggest mistake is that we haven't even added our end-game content yet."

So Tek tier isn't even end game content, good to know. 

Do not judge it yet.. What the heck?  People can and should judge the current endgame content as is (with constructive feedback), regardless of what is to come, since an opinion can't be made on unreleased content. 

It's completely understandable that there is more to come that we don't know of and stuff we do know (like Tek caves), so once it's all out things might make more sense and be easier to balance.  But there is clear design flaws in the current boss fights when you need glitches/exploits (like pinning broodmother) so you can beat them, regardless of how good you've bred 20 rexs 100% imprinted with ascendant saddles.