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22 Gathering Thatch

About killkrazed

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  1. The calculation is based around how long my Rexes took to get killed in a genuine battle against her, despite not hitting all Rexes at once (we surrounded her but didn't get her glitched) it still only took 2 minutes to get wiped. The scenario I posted is what could potentially have happened if her attack pattern and damage remained exactly the same but my Rexes stats were superior - although in my calculations all 20 Rexes had imprinting bonus, when in actuality only 10 of them would, so it's even more grim. I genuinely want to see someone beat her without glitching her or getting her stuck, unfortunately as of now every single vid I've seen where she is beaten is only with the above 2 methods (or due to some seriously overpowered dino stats on private servers). Even some of my favorite youtubers like H.O.D, Skism and members of Stray Cats have only beaten her with those 2 strategies. But remember, this is a glitch - it's not intended. So to everyone I pose this very important question: How will you beat her WHEN she eventually gets patched.
  2. 20 rexes will get smothered by her pretty quick, unless you push them into her until she glitches and stops attacking. People are so used to that glitch by now you could swear they don't know how much damage she actually does. She was hitting my rexes for 6k damage on Saturday, and that's with 47 armor saddles under mate boost. Any boss (easy-medium): 20 *Good* rexes (25k hp+, decent saddles) will be enough for any boss on medium or below. Bring guns to the Dragon fight so you can keep damaging him while he's in the air. Do not under any circumstances ride a rex to the Megapithecus on any difficulty, his rock-throw can hit you even while you're on your rex and it will 1-shot you - whistle the rexes to attack and keep your distance (maybe use some guns too). Broodmother (Hard): 1) Try to glitch some rexes into her so she can't attack, OR get her stuck in the crevice below. 2) Have the Rexes auto-attack while everyone unloads as many bullets into her as they can using their highest dps weapons (Assault rifles, Shotguns, compound bow - best blueprints you have etc.). Rexes alone will simply not have enough dps to kill her in time, you absolutely must have people shooting her at all times, and preferably a lot of people (8+). Some people don't even bother with rexes, they just go in on foot with 10+ people with guns and lure her into the crevice by sprinting to the side as soon as they enter the arena. It's really risky though. Megapithecus (Hard): Send in all unridden rexes to fight him. Stay back and snipe with your best weapons. Oddly enough he doesn't hit as hard as the (Hard) Broodmother, and he has less health so this is an easier fight. Wearing Ghillie armor can make his minions less likely to aggro onto you, but be aware that his arena is COLD so it may not be worth it. Dragon (Hard): Same as the Megapithecus, send your rexes in to attack and stay back and snipe. You may need some slightly stronger rexes though as his fire attack can deal a lot of damage, and it's damage is based on % of max health. Wearing Ghillie armor can make his minions less likely to aggro onto you, going prone under one of the rock formations can further lessen the chance.
  3. I think that was a typo from when I initially posted, Rex dps is 62, not 63. The typo has since been fixed.
  4. @Jostabeere Actually, on my end the Rex does show the exact number for both DPS and damage when testing on a training dummy, point for point (2061/2061) - on the online server anyway (with about 40 ping). When testing on a singleplayer world they both seem to have the same attack speed of 1.4... and their damage is substantially higher (Lv1 Rex was hitting for over 6k despite my dino's online having much higher stats). I have no mods that affect dino's in anyway, only mods being S+ and ACM. I don't know what is going on with these numbers anymore. I personally don't trust the singleplayer numbers as server settings can play an important role, and we know that Rexes should not have the same attack speed as a Therizino. The numbers from online servers will give more relevant results in my opinion, since that is where you will be using them. In the end depending on what server you are on the numbers may be skewed somewhat, but the results will ultimately end up being the same.
  5. I was also using an autoclicker to test. Set to 1ms.
  6. You may want to test that again, I think something may be screwing with your numbers. Besides, at those attack speeds the Theri still has higher dps (if using it's claw attack exclusively) against wild dino's, although negligibly so. Also, getting a 1.19 in attack speed shows that there may be a discrepancy in the way the game rounded your damage (it rounds damage down to the nearest whole number since it doesn't show decimals), it is almost certainly a 1.2 if you knew the decimals (devs wouldn't program a weird number like 1.19 would they? I mean, i suppose it IS Wildcard, so who knows?) After double checking attack speed a second time on my server I have confirmed that the Rex still has an attack speed of 1, and the Therizino still has an attack speed of 1.2 It's important to note that I tested this on an online server, not in my single player world. I don't know why there is a discrepancy in our numbers. The bottom line is that regardless of the target, the Therizino will do more dps than a Rex - if and only if it is using it's claw attacks (which it may alternate from unridden). This is something I actually would really like to test myself, if *tamed* dino's do indeed attack slower when unridden, and if so by how much. Unfortunately I'm not exactly certain how to test this accurately, any suggestions? I'd also like to see what the chance of them using alternate attacks are, and if there may be a way to prevent it. Also uncertain how to test. Actually, I never once said the Rex had higher dps than the Therizino against wild targets. I did say the Therizino has higher dps, but it's a very small difference. The armor penetration formula is one I created myself after running many, many tests. I have tested on a variety of saddles ranging from 25 armor up to 177.5 armor (my awesome Paracer saddle, non platform unfortunately) and the calculation has thus far never been inaccurate (you can test it yourself if you'd like to confirm, just be wary of mate boost when testing). For example a 314.1% Therizino of mine hits for 95/138 against the Paracer and 139//156 against a 43.7 armor Rex, which my formula/s confirm (remember, damage numbers are rounded down when being shown on screen): 52*3.141*100/(100+177.5/2.5) = 95.51 52*3.141*100/(100+177.5/10) = 138.71 52*3.141*100/(100+43.7/2.5) = 139.02 52*3.141*100/(100+43.7/10) = 156.49 Thanks, the typo in 3.3 has been fixed. Was a copy-paste oversight since I was tired. The cooldown is actually only 10 seconds after it's finished, but the time to heal is 30 seconds - so 40 seconds total. This results in an average of 0.025% health being restored per second up to a maximum of 2100hp. Anyway, not going to be doing another long test like this again soon. Want to focus on playing the game again and my eyes are straining. I have a lot more discoveries I know aren't on the wiki but verifying and compiling it is a task I currently don't really want to take as I would be unable to play for a while. I was thinking of maybe compiling an Arkive of sorts with actual, proper, accurate data (freaking useless wiki) if anyone would bother using it anyway.
  7. On another thread I noticed some arguments over which is better for bosses and have decided to give an in-depth analysis of the 2. Who would win if a Therizino and a Rex where to verse each other in mortal combat? Let's start by using this post by one person claiming that Rexes have higher dps and are better in every way to a Therizino and deconstruct the information provided: Keep in mind that I have tested all information I am about to provide on my own server and have confirmed the numbers and formula's presented to be true. Feel free to test yourself to confirm. Also, I am not doing this to insult the guy, it's just that after reading the above comment I came to realize that the community does not have much information on either the Therizino or the effectiveness of Sweet vegetable cakes in a pvp (or even pve) scenario and as I have done some testing on both myself I figured I would do a complete analysis and lay down as much information as I can. 1) "Therizino's do less damage than a Rex in every way": This was actually the comment that made me want to make this analysis. I realized that many people are unaware of the Therizino's interaction with saddle armor and as I have created a formula that can accurately calculate the damage it will do vs different saddle armors, this is where I decided to start. 1.1) Base damage Therizino base damage = 52. Rex base damage = 62. Winner = Rex. 1.2) Damage vs saddled (25 armor) opponents at 100% melee Therizino damage dealt = 47*. Therizino bonus** damage = 50. Rex damage dealt = 31. Winner = Therizino. *The Therizino uses a different calculation than normal against saddle armor which results in it ignoring much of the armor: BaseDamage*100/(100 + Armor / 2.5). **At random the Therizino will use a different formula for damage calculation: BaseDamage*100/(100 + Armor / 10) I do not have the % chance of this happening as of yet so will mostly ignore it going forward. It is not after a set number of attacks either, and affects large and small dino's alike. No effect on wild dino's. 1.3) Conclusion While having less base damage than a Rex, Therizino's ignore a percentage of armor when attacking. Rexes Deal more damage against wild Dino's. Therizino's deal more damage than a Rex Vs Saddled opponents. 2) DamagePerSecond: "Even the slightly better attack speed does not help them reach a Rex's DPS" 2.1) Attack speed The training dummy has weird damage multipliers so you can't trust it's dps or damage, you can however use it to get attack speed by dividing dps by damage per hit. I tested on my own training dummy as exact numbers were not provided and I wanted to be 100% certain before going on. These are my results. Rex = 1 attacks per second. Therizino = 1.2 attacks per second. *note that at the time of writing I did not have the damage numbers of the dummy in front of me (and my memory sucks), and as they are unimportant (only important information being the attack speed) and I did not write them down I have opted to leave them out for now. I can re-test and post the damage numbers as well if people would really like to see them. 2.2) Dps calculations Rex vs Wild: 62*1 = 62dps Rex vs 25 armor saddle: 32*1 = 32dps Rex vs 100 armor saddle: 62*100/(100+100*4)*1 = 12.4dps Theri vs Wild: 52*1.2 = 62.4dps Theri vs 25 armor saddle: 47*1.2 = 56.4dps Theri vs 100 armor saddle: 52*100/(100+100/2.5)*1.2 = 44.57dps 2.3) Conclusion The Therizino has higher dps at all times. The Therizino has negligibly higher dps against wild dino's, 76% higher dps against saddled (25 armor) dino's, and 359% more dps against saddled (100 armor) dino's. 3) Rex vs Therizino stat comparison: To test this I had to fabricate some dino's, as spawning exact stat-distributed dino's is next to impossible. The Rexes I had, for the Therizino's I matched their stat distributions to the Rexes. I used the "Ark smart breeding" app to compare their stats. I am only comparing Health vs Damage as for this example they are the only relevant stats. They had 45 wild levels into HP, and 39 wild levels into Damage. 3.1) Stats prior to breeding (100% TE) Rex hp: 11000 Rex damage %: 355.2 Therizino hp: 8700 Therizino damage %: 355.2 Rexes have about 26% more hp to start than Therizino's, Damage% is equal. 3.2) Stats after breeding (100% imprint) Rex hp: 13200 Rex damage %: 424.5 Therizino hp: 10440 Therizino damage %: 424.5 Rexes still have about 26% more hp to start than Therizino's, Damage% is equal. 3.3) Stats after 30 levels in each (100% imprint) Rex hp: 34584 Rex damage %: 641 Therizino hp: 27535 Therizino damage %: 641 3.4) Conclusion: With equal stat distribution, Rexes will always have about 26% more health than a Therizino. Damage% will be equal. 4) Which is better against bosses? Now, Therizino's have considerably lower HP than Rexes, and their "armor negating" attacks don't affect the bosses at all. This means that by default the dps of both dino's against bosses are roughly the same (Therizino has slightly higher), but the Rexes will have considerably more HP. This means that without using Sweet Vegetable Cake, Rexes are objectively better at fighting bosses. Since Therizino's can use sweet vegetable cake I feel it is an advantage that should not be overlooked, so how much of an advantage is Sweet Vegetable Cake exactly, and can it make the Therizino viable against bosses? The answer is... complicated. The short of it is that the longer the battle lasts, the bigger the advantage. This means that the Therizino can be tankier than a Rex when facing a dps that is sufficiently low enough that it has enough time to utilize the sweet veggie cake. Sweet veggie cake is more effective the longer the battle drags on and has the advantage of being used autonomously. Force feeding meat is faster at healing (if you have an autoclicker / macro), but can only be used on the Rex you are riding on (during which time the rex is not attacking) so each has it's pro's and cons. I cannot give anything conclusive at this point due to lack of information - the viability of the Therizino against bosses will ultimately depend on getting accurate dps numbers from the bosses. I just don't have enough quality information on the bosses to do a comparison there. I can give one valuable piece of information however that could help you decide for yourself: With Sweet veggie cake, if your Therizino's can survive longer than 2 minutes against whatever boss you're fighting - the Therizino can actually tank an equal amount of damage as the Rex (based on a 30k hp rex, time is lessened with lower hp due to the difference in hp being lower). It is important to note however that in order to get the full effect of sweet veggie cake you need at least 21k hp on your Therizino. At times of longer than 2 minutes, the Therizino can actually have higher effective hp due to the prolonged healing. 5) Tamed Rex vs Therizino, which one wins in a Battle to the Death? One thing I do have enough information on to do a full comparison on is to pit them against each other in a virtual battle to see which comes out tops in a 1v1 fight: Going to use a Rex I actually have for this comparison, and fabricate a Therizino with the same wild stats. The rex has 45 wild levels into hp and 39 into melee. I will give myself 55 domestic levels to play with on each of them: With 24 levels into Hp and 31 into melee, the Rex has 30k hp and 648% while the Therizino has 24K hp and 648%. Now for some veggie cake calcs: Veggie cake healing/s (2100 over 30 secs, 10 seconds cooldown): 2100/40 = 52.5hp/s. Hp difference: 30307-23970 = 6337 Time needed to heal: 6337/52.5 = 121 seconds. 3 cakes) So um yeah, if you survive longer than 2 minutes and have at least 3 sweet veggie cakes per Therizino they actually can tie Rexes for survivability and will have higher dps. If you live longer than that, they will actually have more survivability which increases exponentially with the time taken to kill them. So, let's see who wins the fight: 5.1) No mate boost, no imprinted rider, 25 armor saddle: Theri Damage: 52*6.48*100/(100+25/2.5) = 306 Theri DPS: 306*1.2 = 367.2 Time to kill Rex: 30307/367.2 = 83 seconds Rex Damage: 60*6.48*100/(100+25*4) = 194 Rex Dps = 194 Time to Kill Theri (no cake): 23970/194 = 124 seconds Effective dps with cake: 194-52.5 = 141.5 Time to kill Theri (cake): 23970/141.5 = 170 seconds With no cake, Therizino wins with 7868 hp remaining. With cake, Therizino wins with 12225 hp remaining. 3 cakes used during battle. 5.2) Same as above. 100 armor saddles. Theri Damage: 52*6.48*100/(100+100/2.5) = 240 Theri DPS: 240*1.2 = 288 Time to kill Rex: 30307/288 = 106 seconds Rex Damage: 60*6.48*100/(100+100*4) = 78 Rex Dps = 78 Time to Kill Theri (no cake): 23970/78 = 308 seconds Effective dps with cake: 78-52.5 = 25.5 Time to kill Theri (cake): 23970/25.5 = 940 seconds With no cake, Therizino wins with 15702 hp remaining. With no cake, Therizino will still win even with a 25 armor saddle equipped with 3406 hp remaining. With cake, Therizino ROFLSTOMPS with 21267 hp remaining. 3 Cakes used during battle. With cake , can beat at most 2 same-stat Rexes with them hitting simultaneously and you only hitting 1 at a time and still have 10296 hp remaining. With cake, can beat up to 3 same-stat Rexes if you hit all 3 simultaneously and survive with 4731 hp remaining. 5.3) 55 Levels into hp only, 100 armor saddles Theri Damage: 52*4.24*100/(100+100/2.5) = 157 Theri DPS: 157*1.2 = 188.4 Time to kill Rex: 52404/188.4 = 279 seconds Rex Damage: 60*4.24*100/(100+100*4) = 50 Rex Dps: = 50 Time to Kill Theri (no cake): 41447/50 = 829 seconds Effective dps with cake: 50-52.5 = LOL NOPE Time to kill Theri (cake): 41447/LOL NOPE = LOL NOPE With no cake, Therizino wins with 27497 hp remaining. With cake, The healing from the cake outraces the Rexes Dps - effectively making the Therizino have infinite hp. With cake, Rex needs at least 439% melee (2 extra levels) before it can start damaging the Therizino (at a very slow rate). With cake, can beat at most 3 same-stat Rexes with them hitting simultaneously and you only hitting 1 at a time and barely survive with 991 hp remaining (after 2nd dies). With cake, can beat up to 4 same-stat Rexes if you hit all 4 simultaneously and barely survive with 294 hp remaining. 5.4) HP Therizino, Melee Rex, 100 armor saddles Theri Damage: 52*4.24*100/(100+100/2.5) = 157 Theri DPS: 157*1.2 = 188.4 Time to kill Rex: 13200/188.4 = 71 seconds Rex Damage: 60*8.21*100/(100+100*4) = 98 Rex Dps: = 98 Time to Kill Theri (no cake): 41447/98 = 423 seconds Effective dps with cake: 98-52.5 = 45.5 Time to kill Theri (cake): 41447/45.5 = 911 seconds With no cake, Therizino wins with 34489 hp remaining. With cake, Therizino wins with 38216 hp remaining. With cake, can beat at most 3 same-stat Rexes with them hitting simultaneously and you only hitting 1 at a time and survive with 10880 hp remaining. With cake, can beat up to 6 same-stat Rexes if you hit all 6 simultaneously and survive with 3426 hp remaining. 5.5) HP Rex, Melee Therizino, 100 armor saddles Theri Damage: 52*8.21*100/(100+100/2.5) = 304 Theri DPS: 304*1.2 = 364.8 Time to kill Rex: 52404/364.8 = 144 seconds ***Cake effective healing/s: (10440*0.1)/40 = 26.1 Rex Damage: 60*4.24*100/(100+100*4) = 50 Rex Dps: = 50 Time to Kill Theri (no cake): 10440/50 = 209 seconds Effective dps with cake: 50-26.1 = 23.9 Time to kill Theri (cake): 10440/23.9 = 437 seconds With no cake, Therizino wins with 3240 hp remaining. With cake, Therizino wins with 6998 hp remaining. ***The cake is not able to get it's maximum healing/s due to having less than 21k hp, and it heals 10% of max hp (max of 2100). 5.6) Conclusion With equal stat distribution and levels the Therizino will always beat a Rex with or without cake. The effectiveness of Sweet veggie cake is compounded with good saddle armor (and increased hp), as the more you lower the opponents dps the more time you have to heal with sweet veggie cake, and the longer you heal the more damage you output. You can see the gap in HP widening dramatically as saddle armor increases. Although the gap in dps is small at first when taking into account the Therizino's "armor-negating" attacks and faster attack speed, the gap between the Therizino's dps and the Rex's dps widens dramatically as saddle armor increases due to the Rex having a greater penalty to damage. The effectiveness of saddle armor is also compounded due to the Therizino's "armor-negating" attacks, which reduces even ascendant saddles to be less effective than a base primitive saddle. A Therizino in a primitive saddle (25) will still beat a Rex with an ascendant saddle (100) even without cake due to this advantage. The Therizino in general gets greater benefit from HP and saddle armor than it does from melee damage. 5) In closing Against bosses it still isn't certain which is better to use, as a Therizino will only be on equal footing to the Rex if the boss has a low enough dps for it to take advantage of the healing from Sweet vegetable cakes. When versing other player tamed dino's however, the Therizino is hands-down the winner. It obliterates the Rex utterly, with or without cakes and seemingly regardless of saddle armor or stat optimization. It's advantage is widened dramatically as both HP and Saddle armor are increased, even with the Rex being afforded the same stats (with 26% higher hp) and saddle armor. The Therizino simply gets much higher benefit per point into HP and saddle armor due to the healing from the sweet vegetable cakes, while negating the advantage the opposing Rex may have from it's own saddle armor. The only thing more dangerous to a tamed dino than a Therizino is a Giganotasaurus. Who knows, maybe even the Giga is threatened by the Therizino (not likely, Giga ignores both armor and health thanks to it's bleed. I should test sometime). I haven't tested Imprinting or damage/resistance bonuses yet (such as mate boost) as I don't know how they would stack 1v1 and need to test, which will require a tribe mate of mine to have some spare time (and be willing to leave the tribe for a couple hours while I test). They could just effectively cancel each other out, but they could also yield a different number either higher or lower than the damage without imprinting depending on stacking order. My initial thoughts on how it would work based on current results though are that the Therizino will have it's advantage widened even further as it tends to get greater benefit from both damage resistance and increased damage due to the combination of healing from the veggie cakes and the armor negating attacks it possesses.
  8. The hell kind of weak pansy cupcake addict tree-hugger of a Broodmother are you guys fighting!? We lost 20x fully imprinted 30K Hp rexes with decent saddles in barely 2 minutes, with the first casualty being in under a minute. She was hitting for just over 5k damage to mate-boosted rexes with 45 armor saddles with her regular attacks (had damage numbers enabled), she didn't even get to the point where she used the acid spray. After some calculations I pegged her base damage for her regular attacks at around 20k (it's eerie how perfect these numbers turned out to be btw): Damage reduction multiplier (saddle + mate boost): 100/(100 + 4*45)*0.7 = 0.25. Therefore damage before reductions: 100/25*5000 = 20 000 I honestly don't believe she is beatable using "legitimate" means, using what I would consider a best case scenario of 50k hp rexes all imprinted AND ridden with 100 armor saddles. And I have the math to prove it: Base time to wipe at 30k hp with 45 armor saddles and no riders = 180 seconds. Therefore time to wipe at 50k hp: 180*(1+ 30000/[50000-30000]) = 298 seconds. Old damage reduction multiplier = 0.25 New multiplier: 100/(100+4*100)*0.7*0.7 = 0.098 Effective damage decrease: (0.25-0.098)/0.25*100 = 60.8% Therefore new time to wipe: 298*1.608 = 479 seconds (About 8 minutes) So yeah, even in that scenario your rexes would only survive till slightly past half her timer. And of course, there is 0 chance you will have the dps to kill her in that time since your rexes have basically all their points into hp and no one is using guns. She will be still be hitting for about 2k damage per attack. Obviously there will be some fluctuations as every battle does not go exactly the same, but you see the point. I sincerely hope this gets tweaked by the devs as I find it hard to believe that they are OK with the only methods of beating her being an assortment of cheese tactics such as glitching her so she doesn't attack, or getting her stuck in the ridge below and using only guns to bring her down. These cheese tactics will no doubt be patched out one day, and if by then she hasn't been tweaked she will literally be unbeatable on hard.
  9. Keep these 4 Links handy, I have used them multiple times and they have as of yet never been wrong: From that you can see that the possible places to get Carbonemys saddles are: Swamp cave (Blue, Yellow, Red) Ice cave (Yellow + Blue only) (red gives deep sea drops instead) Generic caves (non Ice, swamp cave) (Blue, Yellow, Red) Regular beacons (Blue, Purple, Yellow, Red) Basically Deep sea drops, underwater caves, red drops from the ice cave, Green or lower drops, Scorched Earth caves and fishing will not get a Carbonemys saddle - so start ignoring those if you want to focus solely on the Carbonemys saddle.
  10. bug

    Stews and such currently (at the time of posting as well) cannot be used on tamed dino's, so it must have been a while since you last used them. Anyway, since then I've had some friends test it on an online server and have confirmed that it is the same for everyone - Battle Tartare and Enduro Stew are now completely useless (their secondary effects are not worth it without melee increase).
  11. Had this happen to me on a Ptera, relogging fixed the issue. Interestingly enough, my other tribe members could ride it fine (only I was unable to ride), with some seriously hilarious animations.
  12. Just as an FYI, Enduro stews are supposed to be increasing melee damage - but due to a bug that has existed more than a year now, they do not. The same is also true for Battle Tartare - it increases your damage resistance, but not melee damage. In it's current state the only consumable that correctly increases melee damage is Beer (40%, tested), which is crap. No idea when they actually stopped working but it was around the time of Beer's release that I first noticed that they do not increase melee damage as per their in-game descriptions as I was testing how viable Beer was compared to them. They definitely used to increase melee damage as I have used them to boost melee damage in the past - way back when you could still stack Battle Tartare and Enduro Stew, and even after the patch that stopped them from stacking they were still working correctly.
  13. bug

    Bump. Could anyone else confirm that this is a legitimate bug? The lack of response is worrying.
  14. The short of it is that neither Enduro Stew nor Battle Tartare increase melee damage when consumed. Had no way to effectively test their other effects, so for all I know they're not working either. That's it. A simple bug that renders both essentially useless, and it's been around for a very long time. I have tested this on both a training dummy and a tamed dino to be sure and with either food there is 0 change in melee damage upon consuming them. FYI: Beer works, but it sucks. Pretty sure I reported this about a half a year ago (August last year I think), and yet it still exists as a bug in game. Surely this is like a 15 minute fix, why is it still broken?
  15. From what I've seen the Lumber, Reinforced stone, and Glass door all have the same durability and they all can be damaged by tools - so is there any reason to use one over the other? Also, will we be getting stronger doors any time soon since it's a pretty glaring weak-point in any base design? It's a bit disappointing that I can encase my base in brick and someone with metal tools and a few minutes to spare can still easily break through. The Dino and Behemoth gates also have the same weakness.