wildbill Posted May 25, 2023 Share Posted May 25, 2023 12 minutes ago, ladymarina said: Um nooo..... Petition websites don't show just that and it's not just YouTube It's Game informer etc other gaming reviewers as well. Also as I said there are two petition websites that are showing all of the Ark players names that have signed the petition. change.org etc. so no it's not always the case. Even if the media companies were trying to hype things up. all the information that they have been saying is factual. People were saying that wc/sg was an independent company they were once were, but now they have made over a billion dollars and revenue which means that they should be able to do something about Ark SE instead of just trying to drop it. The gaming companies and community and people are waiting for them an answer to all of problems that have arisen and what they're going to do about it. Ya, not quite accurate. It is Snail Games that is in control, as it is the owning company. WC did not make over a billion dollars even if that much money was made from ARK. Petitions are great, I have no problem with them. Even 10,000 signatures for a very popular game like ARK is not even close to how many people are playing the game every hour of the day. No idea what percentage of the total player base that is, maybe somewhere around 0.1%? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frack Posted May 25, 2023 Share Posted May 25, 2023 2 hours ago, wildbill said: it is youtube's algorithm for what content they show you that makes youtube an echo chamber. Did a incognito search for ARK Survival Evolved in YouTube, so it had no data on my searches, or who I am. Over 160 replies I looked at, oldest was over 4 years, newest 30 min. 6 about ASA, Snail Games, 3 of them were what could be called nasty, 2 Good Job WC , 1 was info. The the 140 or so others were all how to's, how to build, how to tame, where to go, why to do what they told you to do..... The algorithm showed no large selection of 'enforced polarized beliefs' of any kind, no rah rah go ASA, no boo hiss ASA sucks, no ASE better than ASA, no WC bad people, no Snail Games are slugs The only echo that could be heard was 'wanna learn how too?' We show you! Watch us , be sure to subscribe, don't forget to like us, and be sure to comment!! The few that had an opinion of what has been done, gonna be done, what is wrong, what is right, where is it all going were saying the same thing, we have no clue what is going to happen till it happens, all we know is the vehicle is going over the cliff, just have to wait see if it is a flying car or bus with the driver asleep Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ladymarina Posted May 25, 2023 Author Share Posted May 25, 2023 1 hour ago, wildbill said: Ya, not quite accurate. It is Snail Games that is in control, as it is the owning company. WC did not make over a billion dollars even if that much money was made from ARK. Petitions are great, I have no problem with them. Even 10,000 signatures for a very popular game like ARK is not even close to how many people are playing the game every hour of the day. No idea what percentage of the total player base that is, maybe somewhere around 0.1%? Actually no it's WC I've seen proof the head dev has it posted 😒. I don't just take YouTubers comments. I also went and research myself. And yes they are a billion-dollar company. Wild card not snail games. It's both them at this point. Wild card has had its up and downs. Even if it's now snail games. What the both of them are trying to do to the ark community is unfair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Volunteer Moderator Joebl0w13 Posted May 25, 2023 Volunteer Moderator Share Posted May 25, 2023 1 hour ago, Frack said: Did a incognito search for ARK Survival Evolved in YouTube, so it had no data on my searches, or who I am. Over 160 replies I looked at, oldest was over 4 years, newest 30 min. 6 about ASA, Snail Games, 3 of them were what could be called nasty, 2 Good Job WC , 1 was info. The the 140 or so others were all how to's, how to build, how to tame, where to go, why to do what they told you to do..... The algorithm showed no large selection of 'enforced polarized beliefs' of any kind, no rah rah go ASA, no boo hiss ASA sucks, no ASE better than ASA, no WC bad people, no Snail Games are slugs The only echo that could be heard was 'wanna learn how too?' We show you! Watch us , be sure to subscribe, don't forget to like us, and be sure to comment!! The few that had an opinion of what has been done, gonna be done, what is wrong, what is right, where is it all going were saying the same thing, we have no clue what is going to happen till it happens, all we know is the vehicle is going over the cliff, just have to wait see if it is a flying car or bus with the driver asleep The echo chamber is built by the algorithms on these sites based on your search and watch history. Without that initial data, say from an incognito hit, the algorithms don’t start to work their magic. Try another test. Use a fresh browser on a fresh VM and let them track (like any normal user) what you are searching for and your watch history. See what happens. https://www.thesocialdilemma.com/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ladymarina Posted May 25, 2023 Author Share Posted May 25, 2023 45 minutes ago, Frack said: Did a incognito search for ARK Survival Evolved in YouTube, so it had no data on my searches, or who I am. Over 160 replies I looked at, oldest was over 4 years, newest 30 min. 6 about ASA, Snail Games, 3 of them were what could be called nasty, 2 Good Job WC , 1 was info. The the 140 or so others were all how to's, how to build, how to tame, where to go, why to do what they told you to do..... The algorithm showed no large selection of 'enforced polarized beliefs' of any kind, no rah rah go ASA, no boo hiss ASA sucks, no ASE better than ASA, no WC bad people, no Snail Games are slugs The only echo that could be heard was 'wanna learn how too?' We show you! Watch us , be sure to subscribe, don't forget to like us, and be sure to comment!! The few that had an opinion of what has been done, gonna be done, what is wrong, what is right, where is it all going were saying the same thing, we have no clue what is going to happen till it happens, all we know is the vehicle is going over the cliff, just have to wait see if it is a flying car or bus with the driver asleep What did you research exactly? Cause LoadedCrysis vids etc have a lot of comments on there about what they are doing and a bit of people are un. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frack Posted May 25, 2023 Share Posted May 25, 2023 28 minutes ago, Joebl0w13 said: The echo chamber is built by the algorithms on these sites based on your search and watch history. Without that initial data, say from an incognito hit, the algorithms don’t start to work their magic. Try another test. Use a fresh browser on a fresh VM and let them track (like any normal user) what you are searching for and your watch history. See what happens. https://www.thesocialdilemma.com/ Okay went to a friends apt, used my 3rd account there that I only use when playing with the group (it has no online accounts besides Stream, email)) , their ISP, on PC that I am the only person on it, been there I would say about 4 years all told, did the same search , went to youtube, keyed in search box 'ARK Survival Evolved', almost exactly the same results, in different order, but was only 3-4 hits that were not on the first one. While there had my friend do the same search on his PS4, again almost identical, less than 5 different hits.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frack Posted May 25, 2023 Share Posted May 25, 2023 41 minutes ago, ladymarina said: What did you research exactly? Cause LoadedCrysis vids etc have a lot of comments on there about what they are doing and a bit of people are un. I just keyed in YouTube search box 'ARK Survival Evolved' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Volunteer Moderator Joebl0w13 Posted May 25, 2023 Volunteer Moderator Share Posted May 25, 2023 6 minutes ago, Frack said: Okay went to a friends apt, used my 3rd account there that I only use when playing with the group (it has no online accounts besides Stream, email)) , their ISP, on PC that I am the only person on it, been there I would say about 4 years all told, did the same search , went to youtube, keyed in search box 'ARK Survival Evolved', almost exactly the same results, in different order, but was only 3-4 hits that were not on the first one. While there had my friend do the same search on his PS4, again almost identical, less than 5 different hits.. Did you fully watch a few videos? Then click on and watch a few more that were offered up to you? If you didn’t, you aren’t testing like a real person. If you haven’t watched the documentary, you won’t understand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirkInSA Posted May 25, 2023 Share Posted May 25, 2023 You guys are now debating exactly how intrusive the big "search" engines are and the googlebytes (yeah I can spell) of history companies that back those things keep. And how possible it is to get "vanilla" result out of that lot ....... And I ain't sure that this forum can give a good answer to that. Even @Joebl0w13's good answer of a clean VM is not adequate because the source IP of the query will be known and WILL skew the answers. So to be somewhat incognito (or some other small town in mexico), one would need a clean VM, a clean browser, and NEW vpn to somewhere in the world. And even that ain't brilliant, because inevitably the VPN will assign you an pre-used IP - so there will be history! But yeah - that is no an answer that can come (or perhaps legitimately be used) in this forum. Short of direct phone calls or somesuch a "clean" poll of content or opinion is not possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frack Posted May 25, 2023 Share Posted May 25, 2023 9 hours ago, Joebl0w13 said: Did you fully watch a few videos? Then click on and watch a few more that were offered up to you? If you didn’t, you aren’t testing like a real person. If you haven’t watched the documentary, you won’t understand. unfortunately on some accounts I've watched hours of video's , I've heard 'please subscribe' thousands of times, and having being involved on the coding side of the web since the 90's (back when html was in it's infancy), I know how it's used to 'enhance' results. Beautiful Soup. If you have to ask, you don't understand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirkInSA Posted May 25, 2023 Share Posted May 25, 2023 9 hours ago, Frack said: did the same search , went to youtube, keyed in search box 'ARK Survival Evolved', almost exactly the same results, in different order, but was only 3-4 hits that were not on the first one. Fair enough - But why were the answers different AT ALL? You done your searches (I ain't gonna go subtract post times now) fairly close to each other. And I would bet LOTS of $ that the differences you saw was not new content - simple re-ordered content ? As per my post above, your mate's IP address has history - and that will bend the answers ...... How significant that "bending" of result is - I really dunno, and I also really dunno how to get a "vanilla" answer. I have taken particular effort to not be a guy that is "tracked" by the googlebytes. But I have seen that when my kid (using the same internet connection) searches for graphics cards (for example), then ANY damn search has something to do with that in the results ........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frack Posted May 25, 2023 Share Posted May 25, 2023 The answers were different because of simple timing (some new links were just 20 min old), different ISP's (one friend uses cell tower (T-Mobile for internet) , the location and ip address changes every connection by several states), some of us use VPN's. But back to the issue, yes there are some discussions about bad stuff from Snail, some from WC, some good also, but basically we are in limbo, waiting to see what is next. All we know for sure now (until it changes, if it does) is ASE is dead, not dying, but dead, going through some death throws, jerks, but dead. All those who want ASE to go on, not to have to spend $$ to play it in a new look, new systems, are not going to be served, simple case of not enough $$ to maintain it, and ASA, while making ARKII. Now we wait, will ASA release Sept 1? Time will tell. Will the code be fixed? Will the cost be reduced? How will cross play work? Those questions will be answered in ... time.. And Youtuber's will be on the leading edge of showing what is happening - be it good, be it bad ... Count Days 99 days May 25, 2023 - September 1, 2023 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Volunteer Moderator Joebl0w13 Posted May 25, 2023 Volunteer Moderator Share Posted May 25, 2023 1 hour ago, Frack said: unfortunately on some accounts I've watched hours of video's , I've heard 'please subscribe' thousands of times, and having being involved on the coding side of the web since the 90's (back when html was in it's infancy), I know how it's used to 'enhance' results. Beautiful Soup. If you have to ask, you don't understand. Anyone refuting how these social media platforms work hasn’t watched The Social Dilemma. Speaking of, this thread needs to get back on topic. People can debate social media and search engines in another off-topic thread. I’ll start. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wildbill Posted May 25, 2023 Share Posted May 25, 2023 2 hours ago, Frack said: The answers were different because of simple timing (some new links were just 20 min old), different ISP's (one friend uses cell tower (T-Mobile for internet) , the location and ip address changes every connection by several states), some of us use VPN's. But back to the issue, yes there are some discussions about bad stuff from Snail, some from WC, some good also, but basically we are in limbo, waiting to see what is next. All we know for sure now (until it changes, if it does) is ASE is dead, not dying, but dead, going through some death throws, jerks, but dead. All those who want ASE to go on, not to have to spend $$ to play it in a new look, new systems, are not going to be served, simple case of not enough $$ to maintain it, and ASA, while making ARKII. Now we wait, will ASA release Sept 1? Time will tell. Will the code be fixed? Will the cost be reduced? How will cross play work? Those questions will be answered in ... time.. And Youtuber's will be on the leading edge of showing what is happening - be it good, be it bad ... Count Days 99 days May 25, 2023 - September 1, 2023 Yes, back to the subject. I only brought up the Media Echo Chamber because some people here are using posts and video from that media as proof of some kind of consensus of opinion. And my point is, there is no real consensus, just an imaginary one provided by media echo chambers. For instance, you are saying ASE is dead. I'm going to disagree, since the majority of us play ARK with mods (sorry about you console players, ASE will not have mods, but ASA is expected to). Modders should be able to update existing mods running on ASE and even develop new mods for this platform. Really the ultimate experience of ARK (in my opinion, and also the opinion of some youtubers I watch) is ARK with mods. I have literally played maybe 1k hours of ARK with no mods and over 7K hours with mods. No proof, but I'm thinking I'm in the majority, that most people playing ARK play it with mods. Mods should extend the content available for ASE for quite a few years. It won't matter one bit if no updates are made to ARK ASE itself after September 1, 2023. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noffek Posted May 25, 2023 Share Posted May 25, 2023 Personally, I prefer console without mods. It may be harder, less late, and more pleasant, but without the complex combinations. In conjunction with PC and PS servers, mods will come faster for PC users, I doubt you can even apply x mod on pc and ps at the same time. Which in some cases creates a dilemma for the console player: yes, he already has a mod with such functions. He writes a lot about game balance and this? Isn't that balance? Soory use Googlebajt xD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frack Posted May 25, 2023 Share Posted May 25, 2023 mods are one of the biggest things that made unofficial servers popular, right along with changing ini settings for exp, harvesting etc. and most likely they will be the biggest driving force of ASA unofficial servers , and with cross play they will suck in consoles like quicksand which kills the dead ASE even more, because $$$ , since modders will be able to make $ on ASA mods , why make any thing for ASE they will be bitching and hollering and screaming about Overwolf, but $$$ will rule as it always does Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Volunteer Moderator Joebl0w13 Posted May 25, 2023 Volunteer Moderator Share Posted May 25, 2023 3 minutes ago, Frack said: mods are one of the biggest things that made unofficial servers popular, right along with changing ini settings for exp, harvesting etc. and most likely they will be the biggest driving force of ASA unofficial servers , and with cross play they will suck in consoles like quicksand which kills the dead ASE even more, because $$$ , since modders will be able to make $ on ASA mods , why make any thing for ASE they will be bitching and hollering and screaming about Overwolf, but $$$ will rule as it always does That’s a pretty good take. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirkInSA Posted May 25, 2023 Share Posted May 25, 2023 mmmmm - this thread has drifted from @ladymarina's topic. The thread is directed (if I understood correctly) mostly at the loss of time spent on official servers (which as it stands is not easily retained for console peeps) And the loss of "friends" that one has played with for many years which is an unstated but real issue. So to revert to (my view on) OP's "intent" - I personally think that some statement of intent out of Wildcard around save games for console is REQUISITE. Further, it would be great if there were published a "dummy's guide to running a console server" by Wildcard. This would "show willing" and maybe take away some of the pain felt by long term console peeps ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wildbill Posted May 25, 2023 Share Posted May 25, 2023 56 minutes ago, Frack said: mods are one of the biggest things that made unofficial servers popular, right along with changing ini settings for exp, harvesting etc. and most likely they will be the biggest driving force of ASA unofficial servers , and with cross play they will suck in consoles like quicksand which kills the dead ASE even more, because $$$ , since modders will be able to make $ on ASA mods , why make any thing for ASE they will be bitching and hollering and screaming about Overwolf, but $$$ will rule as it always does Yes, I agree, mods are one of the biggest things that made unofficial server popular. Right now, you can only play ARK modded with unofficial servers. Also you can only play ARK modded with a PC, not consoles, as no mods for consoles. ASA will have Overwolf to allow for cross-platform play. So mods will run on consoles. But all mods, and which mods will be ported to ASA and when? A large number of mods work fine with ASE even though they haven't been updated in a year and most will just keep on working on ASE. But NONE of the existing mods will work with ASA without some kind of modification and submitting them to Overwolf. Also you have to assume not all mods will work with consoles, so those mods would be rejected by Overwolf. For instance many of the modded maps. I have written mods myself, not for ARK, but for Minecraft. Money was never a driving factor, in fact not a factor at all. Money alone isn't going to get all of these mods ported over to Overwolf. There are lots of reasons people write mods, but I would guess making money from them is no where near the top of the list for most modders. I'm actually predicting just the opposite affect. That the lack of mods equal in number and quality that are available for ASA will be one of the factors that slow the adoption of ASE. Another factor that could slow adoption is cross-platform. We have yet seen how the cross-platform requirement of ASA (assuming it is a requirement) will affect the ability of modders to create mods for ASA. If I was modding for ARK and I could chose between writing a mod for cross-platform Overwolf and a PC version for ASE, I'd choice the PC version. Modders often make mods they themselves will use. The modder is using a PC to develop the mod. So PC will often be their preferred platform. I'd like to hear from some ARK modders in here. I might just check out some of their discords to see what they are thinking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Temperedmedic Posted May 25, 2023 Share Posted May 25, 2023 A lot of old games don’t just go away. And it is a lot of time invested. I get it they want to update and upgrade their stuff to keep it fresh. The the fact remains you have the price of the game and the add ons then… oop we are shutting it all down so now you can play solo or go to an unofficial pc session. Well not all unofficial sessions are gonna allow you to upload your stuff character maybe but not stuff. So your options are to play alone on a solo session or start over on an unofficial server. Then have to buy Ark2 and still start over some people have more than 5 years in and to lose it all is a joke Ark can see what you have and give it back to you. They just don’t care and won’t until they see the lack of players after the BS! I can’t tell you have many have called it quits already and don’t want the second game. I took a week and a half hiatus and stuff was auto decayed and I didn’t even try to fix it I messaged ppl to see if they wanted my stuff. Such a crap shoot . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frack Posted May 25, 2023 Share Posted May 25, 2023 1 hour ago, wildbill said: ASA will have Overwolf to allow for cross-platform play. So mods will run on consoles. Cross-platform is in UE5, OW is not required Quote Yes, with Unreal Engine 5's built-in cross-platform capabilities, you can develop mods or game content that can run on both PC and consoles simultaneously using a single code base. Unreal Engine 5 provides a unified development environment and toolset that allows you to create games and modifications that can be deployed across multiple platforms, including PC, consoles, and even mobile devices. By using Unreal Engine's cross-platform features, you can write code, create assets, and design gameplay mechanics that are compatible with various platforms without the need for significant modifications. This means you can develop mods or additional content for a game and have them work on both PC and console versions with minimal additional effort. However, it's worth noting that while the underlying engine technology facilitates cross-platform development, there may still be some platform-specific considerations and optimizations you need to take into account. Different platforms have unique hardware configurations and performance characteristics, so certain adjustments may be necessary to ensure optimal performance and compatibility across all targeted platforms. In summary, Unreal Engine 5's cross-platform capabilities make it possible to develop mods for a game that can run on both PC and console simultaneously using a single code base, streamlining the development process and enabling broader compatibility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frack Posted May 25, 2023 Share Posted May 25, 2023 2 hours ago, DirkInSA said: mmmmm - this thread has drifted from @ladymarina's topic. The thread is directed (if I understood correctly) mostly at the loss of time spent on official servers (which as it stands is not easily retained for console peeps) And the loss of "friends" that one has played with for many years which is an unstated but real issue. So to revert to (my view on) OP's "intent" - I personally think that some statement of intent out of Wildcard around save games for console is REQUISITE. Further, it would be great if there were published a "dummy's guide to running a console server" by Wildcard. This would "show willing" and maybe take away some of the pain felt by long term console peeps ? Had to look it up, probably the biggest roadblock to console save files being available for use is "Licensing and Certification: Console game servers often require certification and approval from the console manufacturers to ensure compliance with their platform guidelines and security measures. This certification process is not typically required for PC game servers." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ladymarina Posted May 26, 2023 Author Share Posted May 26, 2023 6 hours ago, DirkInSA said: mmmmm - this thread has drifted from @ladymarina's topic. The thread is directed (if I understood correctly) mostly at the loss of time spent on official servers (which as it stands is not easily retained for console peeps) And the loss of "friends" that one has played with for many years which is an unstated but real issue. So to revert to (my view on) OP's "intent" - I personally think that some statement of intent out of Wildcard around save games for console is REQUISITE. Further, it would be great if there were published a "dummy's guide to running a console server" by Wildcard. This would "show willing" and maybe take away some of the pain felt by long term console peeps ? Thank you 🙏 that's one thing to help with the concerns. Like how is this all going to work. They haven't said a word. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pipinghot Posted May 26, 2023 Share Posted May 26, 2023 47 minutes ago, Frack said: Cross-platform is in UE5, OW is not required That's true, but WildCard plans to use OW anyway. The thing to keep in mind is that WildCard (which in reality means Snail Games, which in reality means Shi Hai who basically owns everything) wants to move into the world of web3 (translation: microtransactions) for PC gaming. They'll never call it microtransactions, they'll never admit it's microtransactions, they'll deny it's microtransactions, but really it's microtransactions. If you look at the announcements that started all of the fracas you'll see they talk about using Overwolf as part of their plan to add mods to consoles, but more importantly to enable premium mods that you have to pay money to use. They're pretending that this is for the benefit of content creators who can get 50% of the revenue from their mods, but that they're not saying is that they're only paying 50% when it should be more like 70% or 80%. For comparison, if you sell a game on Steam or GoG they only take 30%, but WC is going to take 50% from content creators. Also, Shi Hai doesn't dislike RMT's (real money transactions) like most players do, the only thing he cares about is that he wants WildCard to get cut of the action when players sell things to each other for money. Most of us think of it as cheating, he just thinks of it as additional profit for himself. Shi Hai and others like him will talk-talk-talk a bunch about how its for the benefit of content creators when really it's for the game company because web3/blockchain/NFTs makes it possible for the company to make money whenever players sell things to each other. What they're trying to do is use the same methods they use in mobile games (make players pay extra money in order to progress faster, or in PvP pay-to-win) and bring those methods to PC games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St1ckyBandit Posted May 26, 2023 Share Posted May 26, 2023 She Hai can eat a dilo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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