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Ark 2 will be Primarily Primitive-themed


Joebl0w13

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On 6/5/2021 at 10:16 AM, Joebl0w13 said:

From Crunch 271

"So, what’s next? Not TEK, that's for sure 😏.  As we look forward to a primarily primitive-themed ARK 2, we'll continue to provide meaningful updates and experiences to our ARK 1 survivors.  "

primarily primitive-themed can mean many things. From the trailer we do see a hint of tek. The new creatures will probably act as a replacement for the majority of it.

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  • 3 weeks later...

While I do love to have a TEK Generator and Replicator, I don't mind it going away, was not using too much of it anyway.
I hated the suit that activated while building, and I just prefered to have other pieces to build with than tek stuff.

What I do hope, that ARK 2 will have, is proper and deadly AI.
We need to feel hunted, feel like we need to plan our moves and pay attention to behavior.
We need to see pack hunting and dinos moving around obstacles, instead of jumping off a cliff due to dumb ass AI follow behavior.

I really hope ARK 2 can push the AI the Next Gen, Graphic wise I don't really care on too much improvements, as ARK is already pretty good looking.
We just need it to feel more real, with plenty of behaviors on the dinos.

I also would love to have better options for the Alliance System, options to allow Alliance Member to be able to use dinosaurs, breeding to properly work as well.

Lastly, I would love them implement separate balancing for PvE and PvP, it shouldn't be too hard to have different settings linked to PvE mode and PvP mode.

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On 1/4/2022 at 8:30 AM, Diabolos said:

That's likely not going to happen. Unfortunately with Unreal Engine, which is what ARK is built off, AI is generally individually ticked, and it is a nightmare in terms of performance. There are ways to optimize, but a lot of that has to do with grouping, like giving a group calculation to a pack of multiple units as opposed to calculating each one individually on every tick.

Other optimizations such as reducing on tick frequency (running AI code every x.xxxx seconds).

Unfortunately AI is a tricky thing to code, and even trickier to optimize. Our technology is just not at the point where complicated AI's can be done on a large scale.

Think of it this way, How many dino's are on a map at once? Let's be generous and say 1 thousand. That's 1 thousand blocks of code, that need to be run on the server, likely between 1 to 200 times a second.

Tick = every time the code loops to move the game forward, be it rendering your scene to registering your input

Changes to the alliance system have been played with by ten cent studios, parent company of wild card, through ATLAS and other games. Many of the systems they have tried failed horribly, so you can be sure that when they do introduce new functionality to their beloved baby ARK, it will be something people loved.

As for seperate balancing for pve/pvp... that's a fourth wall issue. It breaks immersion to have things function differently for different servers. Players doing it to themselves through mods is one thing, but for a developer breaking the fourth wall intentionally is usually considered a cardinal no no.

Well, at least a form of more real behavior when in combat, should be possible.
Its kinda dull to be able to have something follow you right off a cliff.

Regarding the dinos on a map, you will be surprised to on the count of dinos a map has, its more in the range of 30-40k dinos (when checked on Lost Island), but most wont be active due to Stasis.

ATLAS, ah yes, a game which seemed more like an experiment related to ARK.
I was not too fond of that game, so I did not check much out from it, as it really had some wonky mechanics that made it not that great when it came out.
I just hope we get a bit more flexibility, or give modders a way of adjusting it, as they usually are far more creative at solving problems than the devs themselves.

Fourth Wall Problem? I never heard of that term before, looked it up and I don't really see how this is related.
It just has a few different stats, so dinos that are nerfed just for PvP Balacing, wont affect those already playing PVE with stats prior to being nerfed.
If it were nerfed for Gameplay Balancing, in general, it should act for both.
Imo, too much stuff in the game is nerfed or changed, just to please the PvP Balance, while imo negatively impacting PvE Fun.

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9 hours ago, gorboge said:

Tek should be more primitive instead of completely gone, imagine if a cave man finds a very strong material, he'd just slap it onto his spear or make arrows with it

in another thread i had suggested it at being more around the metal/industrial tier (or whatever replaces those, so basically midgame) and instead of being op weapons and structures it mainly focuses on dino upgrades (such as special saddles that give different abilities to give certain dinos more use)

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On 6/16/2021 at 12:44 PM, Darkholis said:

Although we have very little information as of now to properly make a judgement in that regard, I wouldn't mind if the game is 100% primitive.
There are plenty of ways to make a primitive gameplay more compelling without falling in the classic resource grind.

Let's take tools for example. We could see different materials, increasingly harder to get, but also better overall as you progress.
- Stone
- Copper/Bronze
- Iron
- Steel

Taking inspiration on the tier system seen in Primal Fear, it would be quite easy to implement it, so that you can't skip to the best quality tools immediately.
Besides, adding coal to force players to refine iron into steel (as in prim +) would be a good idea and justify the efforts in acquiring the tools as you could farm anything thereafter.

Aditionally, they could add different qualities, starting from "crude" -> "rough" -> "refined" -> "pristine".
- Crude tools would basicaly be made like our ancestors did by smacking rocks together in order to chip them.
- Rough tools would be built by grinding the components together with water (thus requiring containers) in order to shape/polish them.
- Refined tools would imply hammering down metal to shape, thus requiring primitive tools.
- Prisitine tools would require more advanced tools and even a proper smelter in order to achieve better quality of the required components.

Anyways, those are just some random ideas, but it clearly shows that with a bit of imagination, a more primitive gameplay is possible.

This was done in myth of empires whom allegedly stole code from ark and its an awesome set up. I read through most of the comments and alot of people are attached to the tec stuff mostly because of progression so this would appease that attachment. I look forward to a more primitive play style. The game would be more about the dinos which is cool and on top of that if they cleaned up the combat alot from original ark and made it a smooth combat system the melee combat would be fun too. 

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  • 1 month later...

Fantastic NO TEK, I hate it so much. was playing prim+ till well everything started not to work or go missing like the dino's on every map and many items. so we have gone to Conan with our server, until Ark 2 comes out and we are all hopeful that there will never be Tek at all in it. prim+ is totally ruined now. just hope WC keeps there word on Ark 2. NO TEK.

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  • 4 months later...
On 6/15/2021 at 4:37 PM, Infernal568 said:

You "think" ok xd

If it stays primitive with no simple turrets or heavies to soak and made the 1x PVP what it was, then no i don't THINK, I KNOW it will tank because despite what some say they want they HAVENT listened at least not to those who play the PvP side.

The biggest issue that really needed fixing was the meshing, its the biggest reason players from xbox fell off massively. No one wanted X amount of days weeks months ruined by cheats, and the fact many somehow look at it like the meta like its a normal thing to do is an absolute joke, It is NOT and NEVER will be a part of the game.

On top of that certain things like Titans and a few other needless tames, tools, weapons, that were introduced and i would say when extinction was introduced that the problems other than meshing really started. Not to mention the OP stats on dinos that changed the game to this cave dwelling BS we have today.

To my knowledge and the players that I have spoken to, NEVER said they wanted a full on primitive game, they wanted ARK 1 to work as it should without the BS meshing. And to bring back the outdoor building to where big tribes had  well big tribes and great wars (A time when the game was fun and had many many players).

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 6/26/2022 at 9:01 AM, OGOWAres said:

If it stays primitive with no simple turrets or heavies to soak and made the 1x PVP what it was, then no i don't THINK, I KNOW it will tank because despite what some say they want they HAVENT listened at least not to those who play the PvP side.

I wouldn't expect the pvp experience to be the same either. They haven't detailed it yet but I'd be very surprised if there were autos/heavies and soaking again. No one soaks most of the time as it is, most bases, even huge tek bases, can just be cheesed by rocket runs and such.

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23 hours ago, Tylanater said:

I wouldn't expect the pvp experience to be the same either. They haven't detailed it yet but I'd be very surprised if there were autos/heavies and soaking again. No one soaks most of the time as it is, most bases, even huge tek bases, can just be cheesed by rocket runs and such.

TBF if your build is shoddy or in a weird place that and stego & rocket combo has always been a thing. Racer runs with C4 quetz etc, that's just the way that has been for as long as i can remember, tbh though that is NOT a complaint i have its in the game, its legit and well i'll be honest i have done all as has probably everyone else.
The issue I have with the new ARK is the fact everybody still playing ARK SE PvP is playing because of how it plays and what it has, you take that out your blitzing half your player base who will have zero interest in moving over to ARK 2 and imo it will FLOP, it will NOT have the same impact and thus not have the same following in the PvP side and I actually feel quite confident saying so too.

To reiterate what i was saying from my OP, all everyone in PvP wanted was a meshing fix to stop it. And to stop adding the crap like extinction or at least the tames like TITANS that in part ruined PvP and somehow a fair nerf for the way OP soakers that pushed everyone into caves in the first place (This is WHY the PvP fell off).

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10 hours ago, OGOWAres said:

TBF if your build is shoddy or in a weird place that and stego & rocket combo has always been a thing. Racer runs with C4 quetz etc, that's just the way that has been for as long as i can remember, tbh though that is NOT a complaint i have its in the game, its legit and well i'll be honest i have done all as has probably everyone else.

No, not everyone else has done those things, as majority of the people who tried to do PvP never got to that point.
Never even been able to tame a quetzal because all my friends refuse to play Ark ever again.
PvE is absolutely horrible due to the clutter, and unofficial servers are fun, but how can you be sure the server will stay up?
There is no inbetween, well only 2 clusters, so 90% of the people who bought the game are out of luck.
 

10 hours ago, OGOWAres said:

The issue I have with the new ARK is the fact everybody still playing ARK SE PvP is playing because of how it plays and what it has,

That is a valid point, in that people play Ark SE PvP because of how it plays.
However it also maybe that there are so few people on there, making it safer for them.

10 hours ago, OGOWAres said:

you take that out your blitzing half your player base who will have zero interest in moving over to ARK 2 and imo it will FLOP, it will NOT have the same impact and thus not have the same following in the PvP side and I actually feel quite confident saying so too.

Maybe that's a good thing, as the majority of people who play PvP at the moment are the small fraction that managed to get beyond the bob stage.

10 hours ago, OGOWAres said:

To reiterate what i was saying from my OP, all everyone in PvP wanted was a meshing fix to stop it. And to stop adding the crap like extinction or at least the tames like TITANS that in part ruined PvP and somehow a fair nerf for the way OP soakers that pushed everyone into caves in the first place (This is WHY the PvP fell off).

Thats not all everyone wanted from PvP.
Perhaps thats what you may have wanted, and what many of the hardcore players wanted, but definitely not everyone.

I do love the free-for-all nature of the game, and how one can just capture somebody, and drain their blood for health packs.
Things like that are great.

Problem is the game is set up so that the players become so powerful they can quickly dominate the environment, therefor, feel no need to work with other Tribes with the exception of dealing with bosses and resources.
If Alpha Tribes had to coordinate to deal with an encroaching pack of Gigas (they are pack animals historically), then maybe the beach bobs would have time to build their base and not get raided by bored Alpha Tribe players.

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On 7/10/2022 at 11:39 AM, UltimatePowa said:

No, not everyone else has done those things, as majority of the people who tried to do PvP never got to that point.
Never even been able to tame a quetzal because all my friends refuse to play Ark ever again.
PvE is absolutely horrible due to the clutter, and unofficial servers are fun, but how can you be sure the server will stay up?
There is no inbetween, well only 2 clusters, so 90% of the people who bought the game are out of luck.
 

That is a valid point, in that people play Ark SE PvP because of how it plays.
However it also maybe that there are so few people on there, making it safer for them.

Maybe that's a good thing, as the majority of people who play PvP at the moment are the small fraction that managed to get beyond the bob stage.

Thats not all everyone wanted from PvP.
Perhaps thats what you may have wanted, and what many of the hardcore players wanted, but definitely not everyone.

I do love the free-for-all nature of the game, and how one can just capture somebody, and drain their blood for health packs.
Things like that are great.

Problem is the game is set up so that the players become so powerful they can quickly dominate the environment, therefor, feel no need to work with other Tribes with the exception of dealing with bosses and resources.
If Alpha Tribes had to coordinate to deal with an encroaching pack of Gigas (they are pack animals historically), then maybe the beach bobs would have time to build their base and not get raided by bored Alpha Tribe players.

In essence, and I am guessing you missunderstood what i was saying because literally every point i made, was in part to do with the current state of the game and how it effects all the players. It is indeed why you dont see any tribes build outside in the open anymore. Other than maybe towers or REALLY big megas that can afford to do so due to larger numbers etc, BUT even then I'd say probably not as its to easy to abuse with how OP raised tames such as stegos, carbos and gigas are. Not to mention shadow main dimounts its an absolute joke pair that with a blood stalker with its curreent stats and thats mega v mega never mind the small fry. 

So yes i was speaking for everyone when i made these statements / comments. 
That being said i do understand not everyone wants what a large portion of the PvP players want, in the end this world would be super boring if everyone wanted the same thing. Variety is the spice of life i guess BUT, it does not negate the fact the current direction of ARK 2 if all is to be believed, will flop if it indeed hard sticks to its prim only play style. 

As you said above you havent tamed quetzels, i find that odd because on 1x PvP even as a bob solo build or even with 3 of us we have managed to build and get a base with tames going before we ate wipe. But again everybody picks up the game / pace understanding of what and how needs doing at different speeds I have played ARK SE for about 4 and a half to 5 years on XBOX and PC as of late. 

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 7/11/2022 at 9:31 AM, OGOWAres said:

As you said above you havent tamed quetzels, i find that odd because on 1x PvP even as a bob solo build or even with 3 of us we have managed to build and get a base with tames going before we ate wipe. But again everybody picks up the game / pace understanding of what and how needs doing at different speeds I have played ARK SE for about 4 and a half to 5 years on XBOX and PC as of late. 

Never tamed a Quetzal because I had never played in a Tribe since they were added.
Though recently, I met somebody on Official and we teamed up on Unofficial, and I managed to tame a Quetzal by myself using a bat.
Its an Unofficial Server that operates exactly like Small Tribes, except with a bit better decorum.
The bat made it a breeze, as I could fly by myself and chase it down in the air with a longneck rifle and shocking tranq darts.

Honestly, Fjordur's 'dinosaurs' that were added make the game ALOT easier to play as a solo player.
I imagine the Andrewsarchus would make quick work of the broodmother with it's minigun saddle, haven't tested it though.
Not to mention all the hiding spots that exist on the map.
I've found several types of rare resources that aren't listed on any of the resource maps, but yet there they are, and sure enough a great base spot to boot. 
 

 

On 7/11/2022 at 9:31 AM, OGOWAres said:

Variety is the spice of life i guess BUT, it does not negate the fact the current direction of ARK 2 if all is to be believed, will flop if it indeed hard sticks to its prim only play style. 

The level of technology Ark 2 should have should be equal to the level of technology in Jurassic Park the movie, with the modern technology being the end-game stuff instead of Tek.
I have spoken.

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I love the idea of primitive theme. I always felt the game more interesting when everyone was stone tier and only the powerful few could aford the cementine paste to go for metal tier.( yeah we had no achatine or castoroid huts, only the good old frog dying from sarcos, titanboas and spinos in the swamp area). Also for what they're promising, a more souls like third person combat and consequent less FPS, tek is doable but primitive fits it better.

But tek came and alot of QOL was added to the game with it. Sutff like  incubator, tek storage, and many others are a must for the daylife of mid to end game of ark and its nice to have it. Would be great if they could add all this QOL from tek in a primitive theme. Also , please, I know people gonna hate me for this, but less supersonic flying creatures and spaceships please .

I find odd when people talks about immersion in a first person view when they fly over the maps in a maewing or wyver in gamma 4 and low ground detail.

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  • 1 month later...

Yes, please do not put this Tek garbage in Ark 2.  

Old returning player here.  PvP tek meta has completely ruined everything that made Ark awesome.   Powerful dino's and mythical creatures like Wyvern, Giga,  etc are fine.  But when you release unbalanced (and frankly outside the theme, I don't care how sci fi the story is, Ark is a dino game), it nullifies all the work that was put into design before that point.  It'd be fine if it was limited to a certain game mode..but it can be used in other maps.  Yuck.

Also - send your Atlas team some love. It's still a much cooler game than Ark. Just needs some real TLC to get it in a good release state.

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20 hours ago, Thayxen said:

Yes, please do not put this Tek garbage in Ark 2.  

Old returning player here.  PvP tek meta has completely ruined everything that made Ark awesome.   Powerful dino's and mythical creatures like Wyvern, Giga,  etc are fine.  But when you release unbalanced (and frankly outside the theme, I don't care how sci fi the story is, Ark is a dino game), it nullifies all the work that was put into design before that point.  It'd be fine if it was limited to a certain game mode..but it can be used in other maps.  Yuck.

Also - send your Atlas team some love. It's still a much cooler game than Ark. Just needs some real TLC to get it in a good release state.

if what that guy said in the stream is true tek is going to pay a minor role in ark 2 and people will not fly around in suits. so not like what it is in ark 1.

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On 6/5/2021 at 4:16 PM, Joebl0w13 said:

From Crunch 271

"So, what’s next? Not TEK, that's for sure 😏.  As we look forward to a primarily primitive-themed ARK 2, we'll continue to provide meaningful updates and experiences to our ARK 1 survivors.  "

No Tek mean also no Cryopods, no Cryo fridge so real cap on number of tames allowed and mean no holidays or longer off line. Hehe casual game play.  

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Funny how you guys talks about ARK2 as if it is exact same game as ARK1 but with tek and First person stripped away.

Guys, its a new game, not a  new map or a dlc, or so I believe( looking at Atlas).  They could easly add every single Ark 1 system without touching TEK, including crypods system.

On the current game we got a creature version for almost every Tech added to the game. Need a fridge? Got hyenas. Need an AC? Got Dimetrodon. Need a forge? Got Magmasaurs. Need turrets? Got velonas, golens, chalico, etc. They could do the same thing to the missing systems such as Crypods, but still we are looking to a NEW game for ark2, with new rules, values and points of interest.

Its pointless to discuss ingame systems if we havent seen anything on it yet. We dont know how different everything will be or how meaningful something was in ARK1 that isnt anymore in ARK2. All we got right now is aesthetics and theme intentions.

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