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Seeds change?


TargetOne

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love the fact that i spent the last week building a gacha farm then yesterday literally all day farming seeds and now over 1million seeds gone ark is something thats for sure! the little helpful tips need to change. this is no longer a simulator lol. the 2 most infinite lasting things on earth has the fastest spoil times in ark roflmao.

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3 hours ago, Alessio89 said:

than you cut the distance about gacha debuff :) ... or change the seeds efficiency on gachas...

nah, that would just double or triple the # they put out.  This way, there's a loss of time should people over produce using iguanodon, it can't be stored forever and setup to farm w/ little to no input.  This makes it so that if you scale up, the time cost will scale up as well.

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10 hours ago, TargetOne said:

Did seeds NEED a spoil timer, though?

I personally think that no, they didn't. I agree with the wipe, though. And, in my opinion, they should rather have fixed the Iguanodon exploit instead. I mean, it really makes no sense that 15000 berries produces 15000 seeds but only consume 100 berries leaving you with 14900 berries effectively allowing players to basically infinitely trade 100 berries for 15000 seeds as long as they re-add 100 every time they convert to seeds. I can already see mass dust farmers simply converting their dedicated storage into many fridges instead, which will only result into more load on servers due to amount of structures increasing with it (18 fridges, instead of 1 storage).

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18 minutes ago, invincibleqc said:

I personally think that no, they didn't. I agree with the wipe, though. And, in my opinion, they should rather have fixed the Iguanodon exploit instead. I mean, it really makes no sense that 15000 berries produces 15000 seeds but only consume 100 berries leaving you with 14900 berries effectively allowing players to basically infinitely trade 100 berries for 15000 seeds as long as they re-add 100 every time they convert to seeds. I can already see mass dust farmers simply converting their dedicated storage into many fridges instead, which will only result into more load on servers due to amount of structures increasing with it (18 fridges, instead of 1 storage).

Just tell them to make gachas eat up 40 on the dino count per gacha.  That cuts people down to 6 pairs out, problem solved.  They make alt tribes to get around it, bam - CoC violation - one less problem per server.

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1 hour ago, Alessio89 said:

the fact is, this will NOT stop ugly giant gacha towers around maps. gacha gameplay is simply broken, from breeding to farming. Anyway, our tribe that uses only 2 couple of gachas without towers of any kind in 2 tribemate different bases, always used things better than seeds and more cheaper to get.

Realistically, there isn’t much that would stop  gacha towers aside from straight up nerfing them into the ground, and even that is likely to have more gameplay consequences than adding spoil timers on seeds.

At the very least this doesn’t really affect anything significantly outside of gacha farming, and adds a fair bit of extra effort to keeping towers running. It might not stop them altogether but the extra time needed might cut down a bit on the number of towers people can run.

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I dont know, I might be noob, but those gachas producing whatever is just worthless anyway. Any run for whatever mat will get you way more bulk then any gacha will ever produce?

You want dust, just do a few bloody vein runs or just farm benches and tables. Both of those gave me way more in 1 run that I could ever collect watching and running around my gatchas all freaking day...

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I see the point in restricting the gacha/seed farms but ...

personally i used to keep a stack of each type of seed for in case i need to replant or move a plot. Now that back-up is gone.

if you want to avoid the massive gachas farms with people feeding seeds then simply make the gacha not eat seeds to convert into dust. It's just pathetic to add a spoil timer to an item that for the last six years had none and in RL actually lasts for decades (as honey does but that's a different story).

 

In addition to that it's just lame to push out another stealth nerf. Wildcard Style !

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12 hours ago, SunsetErosion said:

Also those Aberration seeds (plant Z?) Are damn hard to get in quantities. Are spoil timers also on those? Please exclude at least that one or decrease the 1m on collecting those...

theres no spoil timers on the x,y,z seeds.  Those give no nutritional value to gachas therefore they don't need the timer.

 

13 hours ago, Kizmiaz said:

if you want to avoid the massive gachas farms with people feeding seeds then simply make the gacha not eat seeds to convert into dust. It's just pathetic to add a spoil timer to an item that for the last six years had none and in RL actually lasts for decades (as honey does but that's a different story).

 

This won't really fix the problem, before seeds, it was stone, or y-traps, before that it was war maps.  End seeds and it will be stone or something else easy to fill.  The solution is to make them count as if they are platform animals on steroids.  That would end the towers.

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The fact I can find 15+ towers just as ridiculous as this on any map I go to explains why most the servers run like poop now.   The sheer # of wasted structure pieces on aesthetics and gacha towers on public servers is killing them all.  People want to play on a public server, but they want to play their way as if they are alone on the map.  Something has to give, and stability is it.

 

THe way to end it is make gacha chew up tribe dino counts w/ just a few out, and if they want to really kill them, make dust non-transferable.

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I see a couple different paths to take here that would help.....First one no one will like, eliminate their production of dust....Im fairly naïve here at the gotcha dust farming, however Im much like sunset and kiz in the comments. There are much quicker and efficient ways of getting dust, right? And if it is an obvious problem, then maybe it needs to be hit hard. 
Next idea would be a set limit of dust a gotcha can produce. Maybe per day, maybe per lifespan of the gotcha, but either way, make it ridiculous stupid to try and turn a pure profit from the gotcha farms instead of going out and collecting it as a resource or doing a boss battle. This way when you move on to the next map, yeah you can still get dust to help get going, but its not going to supply all your element needs.

Adding a spoiler timer to seeds doesn't really do much but change what type of food you feed a gotcha farm

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How manies bugs on alpha boss that Wildcard never fix? Over 2 years for the same tickets/reports on Valguero alpha encounters - Loosing tons of elements/dinos because of bugs that WC never fix - So, Why today, fixing the farming tower and in the same time killing honest players that try to compensate the numberous bugs in boss encourters, with gachas "farm"

 

I agree to try balancing economy on servers, but you all know who distrub this economy, you all know done well, who put tons of pillars everywhere on pve servers and selling base over Social Networks / Google.

 

Why giving penalities to legitime players?

 

I quitely prefer fixing long time bug/exploits, even if it has a little impact on the way they are farming. We all know who build more and more and more gachas towers and their purpose. 

 

These type of players will never do a boss encounter. Just a simple look of the General topic on forum and you immediatly got the reply at this question : all topics that has spammed the General - How manies Bans since the "patch"

 

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- Also, WildCard could have the decence to have a loud and clear message about seed on dedibox by sending a general message over servers at multiple times - Because of this negligence, that a good way to open a ticket (that i recall "high volume ticket") when you open your dedibox and seeing this message "Outgoing reliable buffer overflow" getting disconnect to reconnect and see 0 instead of 140k seeds on dedibox - That a good definition for the one, like me, like bunch of players, that don't look forum, either patch note, tired of seeing their loving Ark being what it's begun.

  

So i don't know the "priority" of WildCard, but slowing down a "bit" the system of seeds in dedi storage, wil not eleminate main problems. Long time players on a map will perfectly know one or 2 names of tribes that put pillars everywhere, and build these "famous" gachas towers.

 

Fighting a violation of CoC by fire isn't a so good way i think. Just open battemetrics or your internal system to see theses accounts connected 24H/7Days without moving in their "gachas tower".

 

by the way, i would like to "thanks" again Wildcard Studio, now i have to open 12 dedibox and getting 12 times disconnected with a perfecty understable message "Outgoing reliable buffer overflow" - Even that, you SHOULD have anticipate by clearing all dedibox that containts seeds with the patch- You have chossen another way, as always, standing under "internal policy" that discharge Wildcard from legitimate players. As always eternal same copy/paste.

 

Great Job!

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23 hours ago, SunsetErosion said:

I dont know, I might be noob, but those gachas producing whatever is just worthless anyway. Any run for whatever mat will get you way more bulk then any gacha will ever produce?

Not really. It's true for some stuff, but let's for example take me. My base is in White Cliffs on Valg, meaning lots of metal near, lots of crystal, but largest spot if pretty far away, not a lot of obsidian, closest oil source (not counting golems and tek dinos) being underwater, closest pearl (there are some close pearl spots. But still) and black pearl sources being pretty far (and, naturally, underwater), and element dust being... Nowhere (but I don't have a dust gacha, so killing tek dinos or sending it from my sidebase on Ext is the only way for me, so that's the only time dust will be mentioned in this comment).

So. What does that mean? Well, it means that with:

1. Metal. An actual metal run is more effective. I can use gacha when I'm lazy, but yeah, anky+argy beat the giant crystal sloth there.

2. Crystal. Small spots near me, bigger - pretty far, and my argent can carry almost 4000 weight which is great for metal, but nothing for crystal, so it requires a lot of trips, each farther than the last. Can do either way, but gacha is more convenient.

3. Obsidian. Small spots of it. 2 gachas set to obsidian are much easier than going all over Chalk Hills and White Cliffs. Crystal sloths 1 : Anky+Argy 0 - sure, it's about 30 pieces of obsidian per crystal, but it's 30 pieces per crystal in the comfort of my own base.

4. Oil. I cooooould harvest it from tek dinos. Or take an anylo or a golem underwater. Or I could give my gacha some stone and get same amounts of oil safely, instead or risking my ankylo's life because going underwater with her is just asking for a disconnect to happen.

5. Pearls and black pearls. Well, pearls I can get either way - they're fun to harvest, lightweight, I can just go underwater with my basilo and gather them by hand after taking care of all the danger nearby, and I would even enjoy it! But Black Pearls are heavy. I can't carry a good amount myself. I can't even carry a good amount with my basilo. So that's when the Black Pearl gacha comes in and gives me hundreds of Black Pearls that I can carry when they're in crystals and unpack only as I'm about to put them into the vault. Gachas win this one.

Also, not all resources are readily available on all maps in all places. What would you rather do: go across half the map for some fungal wood (IF that's even available at all on the map you play on), while being limited by your tame's weight capacity, or go across half your base to get same wood, about 100 pieces per crystal? Pretty sure "across half the map, or to the other map if that doesn't even exist on yours" wouldn't be the answer in that situation.

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20 hours ago, AllOfTheAllos said:

Not really. It's true for some stuff, but let's for example take me. My base is in White Cliffs on Valg, meaning lots of metal near, lots of crystal, but largest spot if pretty far away, not a lot of obsidian, closest oil source (not counting golems and tek dinos) being underwater, closest pearl (there are some close pearl spots. But still) and black pearl sources being pretty far (and, naturally, underwater), and element dust being... Nowhere (but I don't have a dust gacha, so killing tek dinos or sending it from my sidebase on Ext is the only way for me, so that's the only time dust will be mentioned in this comment).

So. What does that mean? Well, it means that with:

1. Metal. An actual metal run is more effective. I can use gacha when I'm lazy, but yeah, anky+argy beat the giant crystal sloth there.

2. Crystal. Small spots near me, bigger - pretty far, and my argent can carry almost 4000 weight which is great for metal, but nothing for crystal, so it requires a lot of trips, each farther than the last. Can do either way, but gacha is more convenient.

3. Obsidian. Small spots of it. 2 gachas set to obsidian are much easier than going all over Chalk Hills and White Cliffs. Crystal sloths 1 : Anky+Argy 0 - sure, it's about 30 pieces of obsidian per crystal, but it's 30 pieces per crystal in the comfort of my own base.

4. Oil. I cooooould harvest it from tek dinos. Or take an anylo or a golem underwater. Or I could give my gacha some stone and get same amounts of oil safely, instead or risking my ankylo's life because going underwater with her is just asking for a disconnect to happen.

5. Pearls and black pearls. Well, pearls I can get either way - they're fun to harvest, lightweight, I can just go underwater with my basilo and gather them by hand after taking care of all the danger nearby, and I would even enjoy it! But Black Pearls are heavy. I can't carry a good amount myself. I can't even carry a good amount with my basilo. So that's when the Black Pearl gacha comes in and gives me hundreds of Black Pearls that I can carry when they're in crystals and unpack only as I'm about to put them into the vault. Gachas win this one.

Also, not all resources are readily available on all maps in all places. What would you rather do: go across half the map for some fungal wood (IF that's even available at all on the map you play on), while being limited by your tame's weight capacity, or go across half your base to get same wood, about 100 pieces per crystal? Pretty sure "across half the map, or to the other map if that doesn't even exist on yours" wouldn't be the answer in that situation.

Maybe Im playing this all a little different...

I have a lot of bases, something not everyone has I think maybe?
Maybe Gatchas are "semi-big tribe" like dinos because I dont really farm any of those. Im solo though :)
I have bases (with open transmitter and teleporter and conveniences for "new" players on SE 373 AB 221 and Island :D) on almost all maps (IS/SE/Rag/AB/Ext/Gen/Val)

Taming I do from my Ragnarok server or Valguero bases. Levels are higher on average on those maps.
Metal: I dont really farm it, but if I do I farm it for bulk on Island. Rest comes from massive amounts of Behemoth Gates I get from Extinction OSD's, or GEN tier3 loot crate loots, Forges etc I just place and destroy) Not really farmable but though time I collected plenty.
Crystal: I farm it on Extinction also, turn it into whatever before I opload it to other maps. Goes well with the pretty decent amounts of CP you get from OSD's. Crystal for repairing Hazard Suits is somewhat a pain on Aberration but a good run or 2 will get me supplies for weeks.
Obsidian: Never farm it, unless you have to go for BIG stuff like meks or mek stuff. The amounts you get from Gatchas are useless, same with polymer. If I go for 
Polymer: I use my Pelagornis to get (organic) amounts to like 5k per run, stock it up in achatinas and go for 2nd run.
Oil: Watch and stand by to get some shots at placing a oilpump. Did that some time ago, sucked them dry for a week, got plenty of oil probably for ever. I make gas on SE and just transfer out all the oil or gas I need to my other bases.
Pearls/Black pearls:  Pearls Island with my Angler all the way, massive amounts. Black pearls, Extinction OSD's all the way. For real big bulk, maybe Valguero oceans...
Dust/Element: Veins and OSD's all the way...

For the real big amounts for stuff like Meks or other ascendant stuff, those gatchas are useless in my eyes anyway, you just need to farm.
For lower quantities, why not just farm and get the same bulk and store it for later? Only Polymer (and thus Obsidian) can be a pain...
I dont need to fly all around the map, I use Teleporters, A trip to whereever is never long :) So maybe gatchas are indeed "semi-big tribe" dinos, For me thay are just poop...

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I think dust Gachas are overrated for regular players... but are bread and butter for the black market sellers.

Dust is great... because it is transferable. But, my time to setup a huge farm, then load it out, then babysit it... would be more rewarding by doing a boss run or Vein.

I don't like to pee on someone's cornflakes, but I like the idea of unpodded Gachas effecting the tribes tame count disproportionately. Like... 100 each. 

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I don't think most of the people here understand why gacha towers are used, or why people run gacha farms instead of going out to actually farm resources. The difference is that most of you are thinking of farming those resources to progress and play the game.

The reason Gacha Towers are used is that someone can stick a character in the center of the tower and run a script/macro to passively collect crystals. It's not a player sitting there for hours instead of going out and farming. Yes actively farming is more efficient with time, but that doesn't really matter when you can leave the game running overnight or while afk to passively collect an inventory full of crystals. If you have a spare machine you can even let it run while you're doing an ele vein, running a boss fight, or farming dust in ext city.

The change to seeds is important because it was the easiest option to keep a tower of gachas fed. All you need to get dedi boxes full of seeds is an Iguanodon, your berry gatherer of choice and 15-30 minutes. Run a few inventories of berries through the Iguanodon and you'll have 10's of thousands of seeds ready to go to keep your tower running. They weigh almost nothing so you can easily move a slotcap at a time, are a decent food option for gachas in general, and don't really have any downsides.

Sure people can use other food options, like stone, y traps, warmaps, or electrical cables, but each of those are far less efficient than seeds were. Stone is much heavier and takes more work and time to farm and move around. Y Traps are a technically a better food but have a much smaller stack size, also have a spoil timer, and require having a full greenhouse set up to keep growing them. Even then you really can't keep up with a tower full of Gacha eating non-stop. Structures no matter if it's warmaps, cables or anything else all require a lot more time and effort to craft bulk batches. Warmaps have a much smaller stack size, cables are heavier and mean you need to be farming enough metal and paste to keep everything fed.

No other option is as easy and efficient as seeds were. Other commonly suggested fixes also don't really take into account the reality of how players use towers. Changing the radius you can keep gacha in would only result in larger or redesigned towers, which if anything would probably only serve to exacerbate the issue. Increasing the dino count for gacha doesn't really matter since most towers are set up off of the players main/home server so if they use the entire tame limit on just gacha and owls it doesn't really matter. Too harsh a limit might stop gacha towers but would also make gacha in general useless, some people might be ok with that, but you're still only swapping one issue for another. Making dust lighter would only be a buff to dust, it might make it easier to farm dust on ext but it also makes it easier to move dust around when farming from gacha as well and does absolutely nothing to discourage gacha towers. Making dust non-transferable is such a bad idea that I don't understand how people still think it would help. The only thing that would do is hurt legitimate players, and essentially you might as well entirely remove dust from the game at that point. All that would change with regard to gacha towers is that instead of moving straight dust around that dust would be converted to tek structures and transferred that way.

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On 4/27/2021 at 8:49 AM, carbonark said:

I don't think most of the people here understand why gacha towers are used, or why people run gacha farms instead of going out to actually farm resources. The difference is that most of you are thinking of farming those resources to progress and play the game.

The reason Gacha Towers are used is that someone can stick a character in the center of the tower and run a script/macro to passively collect crystals. It's not a player sitting there for hours instead of going out and farming. Yes actively farming is more efficient with time, but that doesn't really matter when you can leave the game running overnight or while afk to passively collect an inventory full of crystals. If you have a spare machine you can even let it run while you're doing an ele vein, running a boss fight, or farming dust in ext city.

The change to seeds is important because it was the easiest option to keep a tower of gachas fed. All you need to get dedi boxes full of seeds is an Iguanodon, your berry gatherer of choice and 15-30 minutes. Run a few inventories of berries through the Iguanodon and you'll have 10's of thousands of seeds ready to go to keep your tower running. They weigh almost nothing so you can easily move a slotcap at a time, are a decent food option for gachas in general, and don't really have any downsides.

Sure people can use other food options, like stone, y traps, warmaps, or electrical cables, but each of those are far less efficient than seeds were. Stone is much heavier and takes more work and time to farm and move around. Y Traps are a technically a better food but have a much smaller stack size, also have a spoil timer, and require having a full greenhouse set up to keep growing them. Even then you really can't keep up with a tower full of Gacha eating non-stop. Structures no matter if it's warmaps, cables or anything else all require a lot more time and effort to craft bulk batches. Warmaps have a much smaller stack size, cables are heavier and mean you need to be farming enough metal and paste to keep everything fed.

No other option is as easy and efficient as seeds were. Other commonly suggested fixes also don't really take into account the reality of how players use towers. Changing the radius you can keep gacha in would only result in larger or redesigned towers, which if anything would probably only serve to exacerbate the issue. Increasing the dino count for gacha doesn't really matter since most towers are set up off of the players main/home server so if they use the entire tame limit on just gacha and owls it doesn't really matter. Too harsh a limit might stop gacha towers but would also make gacha in general useless, some people might be ok with that, but you're still only swapping one issue for another. Making dust lighter would only be a buff to dust, it might make it easier to farm dust on ext but it also makes it easier to move dust around when farming from gacha as well and does absolutely nothing to discourage gacha towers. Making dust non-transferable is such a bad idea that I don't understand how people still think it would help. The only thing that would do is hurt legitimate players, and essentially you might as well entirely remove dust from the game at that point. All that would change with regard to gacha towers is that instead of moving straight dust around that dust would be converted to tek structures and transferred that way.

yes but if i fly near a gacha tower then my xbox is likely to explode, i flew next to one on my pc and it started making noises at me. they make the game laggy if you go near them, and if you have render distance on high then you're probably f*cked. its not that im saying that gacha towers are useless, it just affects the gameplay of other players. I know its a pvp game and the best tribe wins sorta thing, but you gotta make the game enjoyable for everyone and not just yourself, which is why i raid toxic people and assist in helping poorer tribes.

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