Theif's on PVE

[arkark]

1 hour ago, sjskdjkfa said:

I used to be exclusively a pvp player, and reading the forum, I had this totally false falsidical view that pve was super full of griefers. I read multiple threads comparing pve to pvp and loads of pve players complaining about how awful pve was due to the griefing. Having switched about halfway through my ark career to now being pretty much exclusively pve... I was shocked at how tame pve was. Sure some of my stuff got stolen here and there, but lol it is no where near as bad as people make it seem based on all the salt that has been poured into these forums over the years. Sure there is probably some ways to make it more pve than it already is, and sure wild card maybe ought to look into them if they have the time, but personally I don't care if they do.

Your personal experience does not represent what is happening in the PVE cluster related to griefing.

I could also say there is no griefing in extinction because in my server, for a full year, nobody took advantage of corrupted dinos to break and steal from other tribes. However after that in just 15 days window a tribe came, raided like most of the active bases and leaved the server with the work of more than a year of a lot of people. Luckily here WC listened and prevented wild dinos teleport and also reduced to 10 secs the timer for ORP.

1 hour ago, Joebl0w13 said:

A lot of the problem is most if not all greifing in PVE can be prevented by players playing the game like the dangerous world it's supposed to be.

If you played it like it's PVP, PVE players really can't do much to you. Body dragging? Log off in your bed in the middle of your base away from walls.

You shouldn't have to do that in PVE you say? Well I shouldn't have to keep my doors locked in real life since entering my home when you don't live here is illegal. Expect and prepare for the worst in people and they can't do much to you.

Partially agree but what happen when its not the player fault. I mean im doing some thing like farm or scout for OSD's and my game crash or I get dc from server. Its not my fault and my body gets there to the desire of someone that could have noticed my body is there.
And the example of the door I think its not good here. In real life the people do not magically tresspass brick walls when the door is closed.

 

What I know, cause I've seen multiple times is that there is people whose playstyle is disturb all they can the others, and they do every single time they can. And sure the ppl that do that is a very small % of total players the problem is that this kind of ppl learn a new griefing method and keep exploiting it until patched.

[Joebl0w13]

3 minutes ago, arkark said:

and my game crash or I get dc from server

These are the real problems here.

At this point in the development lifecycle, the game shouldn't be this fragile.

[Pipinghot]

3 hours ago, Aylana314159 said:

WC did provide players a PvE mode completely free from griefing, its called single player mode.

That would be funny if it wasn't such a sad answer. Obviously no, you're completely wrong.

3 hours ago, Aylana314159 said:

I doubt any open world multiplayer game has 100% eliminated griefing. 

But the good ones try harder than WC does and that's the point. WC is bad at it. Still. After all this time.

No one is expecting perfection, what they're expecting is that WC should fix the problems with PvE that have been around since the first year of the game. There is no excuse for those PvE failures to still be here.

[Pipinghot]

2 hours ago, Joebl0w13 said:

The wild dino pickup by flyers was widely abused in PVE before they disabled it.

Which is a good example of WC doing the right thing.

They made a change to the game that was specific to PvE because PvE and PvP have different logic for how the world needs to operate, and sometimes you have to make changes in PvE to prevent griefers from griefing, that's what a good game developer does. This was a great move by WC, they need to do more.

The logic of PvE must needs be different from the logic of PvP, that's the only way to make a good PvE version of a game.

2 hours ago, Joebl0w13 said:

There's no way to make a game this "free" and make it people proof at the same time.

No one's asking for people "proof", that's a silly argument, perfection is not the goal. Perfection is not attainable in any facet of life, what players want is excellence, which is the standard that any company should strive for.

The goal is for WC to consider PvE to be of equal value to PvP (which from a financial point of view is definitely true) and to do the work of keeping PvE more honest. For example, here's no reason to allow players to steal from each other in PvE, that's nothing more than cowards-PvP. It should be the default in PvE that only tribe members can open any form of container that you can imagine, from a small box to a characters' body to a smithy to a tame, any form of container.

That's something that PvE players have wanted since the first year of the game, basically half of their player base has always wanted containers to be inviolable, something that should be a no-brainer for PvE, and yet it's never been done.

2 hours ago, Joebl0w13 said:

Each open, persistent-world mechanic allows for griefing by clever players. If you removed each and every mechanic used to bother other players you would have a game that looks nothing like Ark with the creative freedoms it provides.

Not even close to being true. That's an intellectually lazy answer.

[Pipinghot]

2 hours ago, Joebl0w13 said:

If you played it like it's PVP, PVE players really can't do much to you.

That's the opposite of a solution, it's exactly the kind of problematic thinking that most PvE players explicitly object to.

They don't want to play PvE like it's PvP, which is exactly why they're playing PvE.

The issue underlying almost all griefing complaints is time. The large majority of people who play PvE do so because they don't want other people to be able steal the time they've spent doing things in the game, building, harvesting, taming, etc. Tames = time. Materials = time. Each and every time that another player in PvE takes something from you they are stealing time, and that's precisely what people don't want to have happen to them in PvE.

Did a giga walk over your fence and kill a bunch of tames? That's ok, that's the Environment, the "E" in PvE, sometimes the Environment does bad things to you.

On the other hand, was that giga kited to your base by another player? That's not ok, that's another player stealing your time by griefing. Anything done by other players is not PvE, it's a simple concept that WC refuses to learn, and it's the reason that they have never made their PvE players fully happy with PvE mode, because WC doesn't understand the basic underlying concept that PvE players are there because they don't want other players to be able to steal their time.

[Pipinghot]

2 hours ago, Joebl0w13 said:

You shouldn't have to do that in PVE you say? Well I shouldn't have to keep my doors locked in real life

That is your worst argument yet, it's a failed argument in every game, ever. This is a game, it's not real life, people don't pay for games and play games to experience real life, they can already do that for free in their... real life.

People spend money on games as entertainment, as something unreal, not as a bizarro-world proxy for real life on their computer.

A game that's like real life is not a game, it's not a form of entertainment. it's a training simulator, and that's not what people buy ARK for.

Edit: You can "Facepalm" all you want, it doesn't change the fact that your "real life" argument is a failure, it was DoA as you were typing it.

[Joebl0w13]

7 minutes ago, Pipinghot said:

That's the opposite of a solution, it's exactly the kind of problematic thinking that most PvE players explicitly object to.

They don't want to play PvE like it's PvP, which is exactly why they're playing PvE.

The issue underlying almost all griefing complaints is time. The large majority of people who play PvE do so because they don't want other people to be able steal the time they've spent doing things in the game, building, harvesting, taming, etc. Tames = time. Materials = time. Each and every time that another player in PvE takes something from you they are stealing time, and that's precisely what people don't want to have happen to them in PvE.

Did a giga walk over your fence and kill a bunch of tames? That's ok, that's the Environment, the "E" in PvE, sometimes the Environment does bad things to you.

On the other hand, was that giga kited to your base by another player? That's not ok, that's another player stealing your time by griefing. Anything done by other players is not PvE, it's a simple concept that WC refuses to learn, and it's the reason that they have never made their PvE players fully happy with PvE mode, because WC doesn't understand the basic underlying concept that PvE players are there because they don't want other players to be able to steal their time.

You say tomatoe, I say tomato.

I'm glad the game leaves us both the ability to enjoy it. Cheers.

[Pipinghot]

1 minute ago, Joebl0w13 said:

You say tomatoe, I say tomato.

No, I say "that game tomato is rotten" and you say, "yeah, tomatoes are rotten in real life too."

1 minute ago, Joebl0w13 said:

I'm glad the game leave us the ability to both enjoy it. 

And yet you try to deny other people the right to be unhappy about the aspects of the game you don't agree with them, because their complaint is "old".

[Joebl0w13]

1 minute ago, Pipinghot said:

No, I say "that game tomato is rotten"

Must be hard going through life like that.

[Pipinghot]

1 hour ago, Joebl0w13 said:

Must be hard going through life like that.

Another silly and pointless response that has absolutely nothing to do with the topic at hand. One hopes you didn't imagine that to be clever.

 

[yekrucifixion187]

4 hours ago, Joebl0w13 said:

A lot of the problem is most if not all greifing in PVE can be prevented by players playing the game like the dangerous world it's supposed to be.

If you played it like it's PVP, PVE players really can't do much to you. Body dragging? Log off in your bed in the middle of your base away from walls.

You shouldn't have to do that in PVE you say? Well I shouldn't have to keep my doors locked in real life since entering my home when you don't live here is illegal. Expect and prepare for the worst in people and they can't do much to you.

This isn't covering that stuff though. 

There is no prevention to dcing, to someone killing or stealing your Titan tame, to stealing the loot from the King Titan loot crate. 

For the last 2, there could be. Even for the first one, making a players death cache only accessible by the player (an option on private servers I've played on) it would at least prevent item lost to a griefer making it unrewarding to drown a player.

Overall, I'm not bothered either way. I keep items in my dino in case of dc and if someone steals my tame/loot I just carry on. I'll get it done eventually but the ability is there to prevent it and WC should enact it to make PvE more PvE.

[Joebl0w13]

1 minute ago, yekrucifixion187 said:

There is no prevention to dcing

I'm with you on this one.

[Pipinghot]

2 hours ago, Joebl0w13 said:

Must be hard going through life like that.

Ahh yes, another witty facepalm from you rather than a cogent reply based on reasoning and critical thinking. Brilliant move, well played.

[BertNoobians]

non tribes members should not be able to pick up eggs,
females should have an option in the action wheel that says, allow public baby claiming.
males and females should have an option in the action wheel that says, allow public mating

i have to build a base to protect my babies from being claimed.
now people are able to glitch inside, so 1 layer is not enough, how many layers of walls and ceilings will be enough to keep those people outside.

i have to build a super laggy multilayered base to keep people out......?

those dino gates are anti kiting protection, happens while i handfeed babies.

[Aylana314159]

2 hours ago, BertNoobians said:

non tribes members should not be able to pick up eggs,
females should have an option in the action wheel that says, allow public baby claiming.
males and females should have an option in the action wheel that says, allow public mating

i have to build a base to protect my babies from being claimed.
now people are able to glitch inside, so 1 layer is not enough, how many layers of walls and ceilings will be enough to keep those people outside.

While WC should be doing a better job of preventing players from glitching through structures, you still should need to build a base to protect you breeders.

 

Honestly WC should work on dino AI and have dino raids in PvE. It shouldn't be a safe simulation game after you build a base. 

[Aylana314159]

2 hours ago, LEDminer said:

They also wanted to prevent outsiders from picking up eggs from your creatures. And prevent claiming.

I can already see people using this to grief, filling other tribes bases with eggs and having them hatch. Since it's PvE you can't do anything with these, since you also cannot claim these.

Nearly every suggestion for preventing griefing leaves some loophole that would also be used for griefing.

[BertNoobians]

3 hours ago, LEDminer said:

They also wanted to prevent outsiders from picking up eggs from your creatures. And prevent claiming.

I can already see people using this to grief, filling other tribes bases with eggs and having them hatch. Since it's PvE you can't do anything with these, since you also cannot claim these.

you can put the ac units on a seperate generator, which i have. then this is not possible.
right now you can uncryo animals in someones base until server hits the tame cap, but this is also not abused much.

[sjskdjkfa]

On 8/28/2020 at 5:31 PM, arkark said:

Your personal experience does not represent what is happening

I gota base on extinction and have even had griefs kite corrupts to it... and had my neighbors wiped out. Believe me. While this type of behavior causes me a little anxiety, it is NOTHING. IT DOES NOT COMPARE TO PVP, yet I've had people on this forum tell me not to bother switching to pve because it is just as bad as pvp, just in different ways. This is my point, people on this forum complaining about the grief in pve would have you believe that it is sooooo bad, it is TAME.

[sjskdjkfa]

Don't get me wrong, I am super stoked when I hear they have fixed problems of pve, and fairly dismayed at news of further ways to grief pve. I just don't see it as a fundamental problem like the ongoing official server instability, and my freaking main server being down for weeks.

[sjskdjkfa]

On 8/28/2020 at 4:31 PM, Joebl0w13 said:

A lot of the problem is most if not all greifing in PVE can be prevented by players playing the game like the dangerous world it's supposed to be.

If you played it like it's PVP, PVE players really can't do much to you. Body dragging? Log off in your bed in the middle of your base away from walls.

You shouldn't have to do that in PVE you say? Well I shouldn't have to keep my doors locked in real life since entering my home when you don't live here is illegal. Expect and prepare for the worst in people and they can't do much to you.

Exactly. Maybe it was my pvp background, but most of the time in pve I never really left a target for the griefers. Always dump important stuff in fridges and vaults before logging out, double layer your hatcheries, try to log out if something realy bad is goin down like a swarm of corrupted in the center of ext, and you have no other plans. Don't put all your eggs in one basket (I have 4 main bases so even if one gets griefed id be okay)

[GrumpyBear]

Tek force fields.   Don't need to have them on 24/7, just during important times.