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Logan96

What will we become (PvP)

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What will we become (PvP)

I made a topic a few weeks ago asking others why they think we fight amongst ourselves. Some said that it is because we need to continuously challenge ourselves. Others said for fun, and a few people said that they still fight because they feel like it is essential to their survival. Lastly some people claimed that it is just Human nature and/or we are toxic psychopaths that have no boundaries. Regardless of why we fight I think it all ties into a greater theme that this game presents us with, which is evolution. But what will this community as a whole evolve into as the years pass? Will we become a barren wasteland like rust or dayz, with small groups that kill each other on sight? Will we continuously stay in a state of war with the top tribes battling for alpha status? Or maybe the player base will become so isolated from the official servers, to the point that when we come into contact with one another we simply die from the awkwardness of having human interaction with one another. (This is where my bet is placed) Jokes aside what do you all think the state of official servers will look like within the coming years? Personally I believe that as players slowly move on and find new games the servers that wildcard hosts will start to get smaller and smaller until we are down to just a handful, with a community that knows one another, much like the days before server transfers. So in a way we will evolve, but also revert. Hope you all enjoyed my sermon, hopefully I hear some of yours ;)

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We will all be playing Ark 2 AKA Atlas by then and  the political landscape will be one that is identical to how it is now. Humans imho don't evolve. We optimize. The distinction might be just semantics but we will only change in so much as we play the most effective way within the rule set given to us by the devs. And if current trends hold that will be the mega tribe META.

 

 

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6 hours ago, johnm81 said:

We will all be playing Ark 2 AKA Atlas by then and  the political landscape will be one that is identical to how it is now. Humans imho don't evolve. We optimize. The distinction might be just semantics but we will only change in so much as we play the most effective way within the rule set given to us by the devs. And if current trends hold that will be the mega tribe META.

 

 

I doubt even half of the players would move to atlas with state of mess its currently. And ppl liking dinos wont be moving to pirate setting anyway.

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3 hours ago, Luewen said:

I doubt even half of the players would move to atlas with state of mess its currently. And ppl liking dinos wont be moving to pirate setting anyway.

The question posed in future tense from the thread author. Atlas was a disaster. Atlas is much improved to a mess now. Will be decent in future. I'd say its just on current Ark's heels in terms of quality of product. IMO ofc...

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On 11/9/2019 at 12:22 PM, Logan96 said:

What will we become (PvP)

I made a topic a few weeks ago asking others why they think we fight amongst ourselves. Some said that it is because we need to continuously challenge ourselves. Others said for fun, and a few people said that they still fight because they feel like it is essential to their survival. Lastly some people claimed that it is just Human nature and/or we are toxic psychopaths that have no boundaries. Regardless of why we fight I think it all ties into a greater theme that this game presents us with, which is evolution. But what will this community as a whole evolve into as the years pass? Will we become a barren wasteland like rust or dayz, with small groups that kill each other on sight? Will we continuously stay in a state of war with the top tribes battling for alpha status? Or maybe the player base will become so isolated from the official servers, to the point that when we come into contact with one another we simply die from the awkwardness of having human interaction with one another. (This is where my bet is placed) Jokes aside what do you all think the state of official servers will look like within the coming years? Personally I believe that as players slowly move on and find new games the servers that wildcard hosts will start to get smaller and smaller until we are down to just a handful, with a community that knows one another, much like the days before server transfers. So in a way we will evolve, but also revert. Hope you all enjoyed my sermon, hopefully I hear some of yours ;)

You must be new to the game. Players in ARK have been slaughtering each other furiously since 2015. Nothing will change in the future apart from there being maybe less people to kill as the game will be 5 years old next year (which is why I have suggested many times that the devs halve the servers to remove the dead servers and force more interaction between players).

I can't speak for others but I bought this game because it offered open world PVP with no laws and rules. You could swap the dinos for tanks or butterflies it wouldn't bother me so long as the fundamentals remain the same.

Also a large amount of PVP players like myself enjoy the tactical/full PVP aspect of the game. There are games like Battlefield/COD which offer PVP but those games only last 30 minutes and then all your efforts amount to nothing. ARK offers a multi year continuous campaign to wage total war against all enemies real and imagined. It takes real time to build bases and tame/breed so when you come along and push the reset key on the enemy base you can feel satisfied knowing that they won't have it all back in 20 minutes, it will take them days or weeks or even months. It is that real impact that the game lets players make that sets it apart from other game.

There is also diplomacy and politics which one can utilize to their advantage in place of combat. It's a total package PVP game if you ask me.

 

Edited by ForzaProiettile
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55 minutes ago, ForzaProiettile said:

You must be new to the game. Players in ARK have been slaughtering each other furiously since 2015. Nothing will change in the future apart from there being maybe less people to kill as the game will be 5 years old next year (which is why I have suggested many times that the devs halve the servers to remove the dead servers and force more interaction between players).

I can't speak for others but I bought this game because it offered open world PVP with no laws and rules. You could swap the dinos for tanks or butterflies it wouldn't bother me so long as the fundamentals remain the same.

Also a large amount of PVP players like myself enjoy the tactical/full PVP aspect of the game. There are games like Battlefield/COD which offer PVP but those games only last 30 minutes and then all your efforts amount to nothing. ARK offers a multi year continuous campaign to wage total war against all enemies real and imagined. It takes real time to build bases and tame/breed so when you come along and push the reset key on the enemy base you can feel satisfied knowing that they won't have it all back in 20 minutes, it will take them days or weeks or even months. It is that real impact that the game lets players make that sets it apart from other game.

There is also diplomacy and politics which one can utilize to their advantage in place of combat. It's a total package PVP game if you ask me.

 

I agree with your assessment, however I find that there is just one issue with PvP when it comes to new players who have just joined. I find that too many people "press reset" on individuals who are just starting out and trying to get into the game. I think that players should consider challenging others that are the same level and development as themselves. What will happen is that newer players will quit and the population will decrease leaving just the high level players to PvE with each other. <- that's where PvP will end up.

Edited by CaptCrunch

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20 hours ago, johnm81 said:

The question posed in future tense from the thread author. Atlas was a disaster. Atlas is much improved to a mess now. Will be decent in future. I'd say its just on current Ark's heels in terms of quality of product. IMO ofc...

Hopefully but still i doubt ppl that were attracted to dinos on ark will move over.

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8 hours ago, ForzaProiettile said:

You must be new to the game. Players in ARK have been slaughtering each other furiously since 2015. Nothing will change in the future apart from there being maybe less people to kill as the game will be 5 years old next year (which is why I have suggested many times that the devs halve the servers to remove the dead servers and force more interaction between players).

I can't speak for others but I bought this game because it offered open world PVP with no laws and rules. You could swap the dinos for tanks or butterflies it wouldn't bother me so long as the fundamentals remain the same.

Also a large amount of PVP players like myself enjoy the tactical/full PVP aspect of the game. There are games like Battlefield/COD which offer PVP but those games only last 30 minutes and then all your efforts amount to nothing. ARK offers a multi year continuous campaign to wage total war against all enemies real and imagined. It takes real time to build bases and tame/breed so when you come along and push the reset key on the enemy base you can feel satisfied knowing that they won't have it all back in 20 minutes, it will take them days or weeks or even months. It is that real impact that the game lets players make that sets it apart from other game.

There is also diplomacy and politics which one can utilize to their advantage in place of combat. It's a total package PVP game if you ask me.

 

I've been off and on since 2016 ;) I agree that there is no other PvP experience like it, but I disagree that the state of the game will not change. I'd personally like for servers to stay the way they are in terms of quantity as few players can actually hide the way it is now. Sadly i think that your solution to lessen servers is inevitable simply because of the cost to run a server. To that end, is the reason why I believe future ark will start to feel a little more like classic (2016) ark. Sure there will be still be server transfers but everyone will start to recognize the big contenders and maybe even play a little more cautious knowing that the big boys are just a few doors down. Those are my thoughts anyways. 

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7 hours ago, CaptCrunch said:

I find that too many people "press reset" on individuals who are just starting out and trying to get into the game. I think that players should consider challenging others that are the same level and development as themselves. What will happen is that newer players will quit and the population will decrease leaving just the high level players to PvE with each other. <- that's where PvP will end up.

A fine sentiment. Unfortunately, benevolence is not a luxury that players serious about their defense can afford.  When survival has been prioritized, it's either conquer or be conquered.  Once you've seen a few wolves make it to the gates in sheep's clothing, the sheep start dying too.

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10 hours ago, ForzaProiettile said:

You must be new to the game. Players in ARK have been slaughtering each other furiously since 2015. Nothing will change in the future apart from there being maybe less people to kill as the game will be 5 years old next year (which is why I have suggested many times that the devs halve the servers to remove the dead servers and force more interaction between players).

I can't speak for others but I bought this game because it offered open world PVP with no laws and rules. You could swap the dinos for tanks or butterflies it wouldn't bother me so long as the fundamentals remain the same.

Also a large amount of PVP players like myself enjoy the tactical/full PVP aspect of the game. There are games like Battlefield/COD which offer PVP but those games only last 30 minutes and then all your efforts amount to nothing. ARK offers a multi year continuous campaign to wage total war against all enemies real and imagined. It takes real time to build bases and tame/breed so when you come along and push the reset key on the enemy base you can feel satisfied knowing that they won't have it all back in 20 minutes, it will take them days or weeks or even months. It is that real impact that the game lets players make that sets it apart from other game.

There is also diplomacy and politics which one can utilize to their advantage in place of combat. It's a total package PVP game if you ask me.

 

not sure what ark u played but back when ark was young and official was decent, pvp was more forgiving, you only broke into a base and not rip it apart, u only stole what u needed, not what steal everyhting, u only killed the things that attacked you, not slaughter everything in sight, and people were chill with being raided because it was not extreme, on the rare ocasion there was a base wipe due to a full throttle tribe war,

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On 11/11/2019 at 12:28 PM, Kodking194 said:

not sure what ark u played but back when ark was young and official was decent, pvp was more forgiving, you only broke into a base and not rip it apart, u only stole what u needed, not what steal everyhting, u only killed the things that attacked you, not slaughter everything in sight, and people were chill with being raided because it was not extreme, on the rare ocasion there was a base wipe due to a full throttle tribe war,

There was more passive players back then, that much is true and a lot of players were still inexperienced at survival games and unaware of its multi facets.

That said I and my group have always adopted a total war mentality. I don't believe in half measures, when you raid you should raid properly and leave them with nothing. If you leave them tames, gear or important structures then they will only use that to get back at you faster.

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On 11/9/2019 at 2:52 AM, Logan96 said:

I made a topic a few weeks ago asking others why they think we fight amongst ourselves. Some said that it is because we need to continuously challenge ourselves. Others said for fun, and a few people said that they still fight because they feel like it is essential to their survival. Lastly some people claimed that it is just Human nature and/or we are toxic psychopaths that have no boundaries.

We all have the choice to either be social or social-darwinistic. Both biases have advantages and disadvantages, and both have the right to exist. It can't be said that one of them is the "right" one and the other the "wrong". Both ways in the extreme lead to doom. If all would be social, we would all starve after a while. If all would be social-darwinistic we would end up in a hardcore nazi world.

Keeping the balance is the best way.

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On 11/8/2019 at 8:52 PM, Logan96 said:

What will we become (PvP)

PVP community will continue to be bitter and toxic toward PVE'ers because PVE is widely regarded by the PVP community to be a "safe space".

A wide spectrum of PVP players consider themselves above PVE players and are willfully ignorant of the reasons players prefer to play a different mode than them.

It is widely known that a vast majority of PVP players exploit the best tames and glitches in order to compete against other tribes.

The constant glitching and need to "one up" eachother on PVP forces WC to nerf useful tames and fun mechanics into the ground screwing over PVE players in the process.

Not much will change for PVP. Everything will change for PVE.

Edited by Demerus
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1 hour ago, Demerus said:

A wide spectrum of PVP players consider themselves above PVE players and are willfully ignorant of the reasons players prefer to play a different mode than them.

It is widely known that a vast majority of PVP players exploit the best tames and glitches in order to compete against other tribes.

Not much will change for PVP. Everything will change for PVE.

I use to be guilty of looking down on PvE myself. Mainly because many of my friends switched to PvE after being raided a few times. Later on when they would talk about their super cool rexes I was still struggling to get out of my metal 2x2 and they started treating me like a noob because I'd never ridden a wyvern, or fought a boss, or because I didn't know a lot about breeding etc...                                                                                                                                                           What changed my perspective was when I finally got out of that 2x2 and needed advice on how to breed correctly because guess who had the best information? The PvE guys who had been doing it since the day it was introduced. I think that if a lot of players from the pvp community accepted that their is a wealth of information from the other side then we could all start getting along but for now..."You play PvE therefore your advice is useless to me". (Looking at you @ForzaProiettile)

Edited by Logan96
Correcting format
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On 11/10/2019 at 11:18 AM, CaptCrunch said:

I agree with your assessment, however I find that there is just one issue with PvP when it comes to new players who have just joined. I find that too many people "press reset" on individuals who are just starting out and trying to get into the game. I think that players should consider challenging others that are the same level and development as themselves. What will happen is that newer players will quit and the population will decrease leaving just the high level players to PvE with each other. <- that's where PvP will end up.

Its the fault of people who are against wipes. Servers need to wipe periodically, say once a year to keep tribes on even footing. Every decent unofficial does this, all the other good survival games like rust and dayz does this. Because it makes sense, you cant get competitive pvp when day 1 fresh spawns are fighting clans that have been grinding for 3 years.

But too many people on ark official PVP scene dont want that, they want official PVP to be basically a PVE game where you sit in an unraidable cave and play PVE. And thus we have the present situation on officials where new tribes can not form, and existing tribes can not be wiped. You have a few dying megatribes in unraidable bases playing PVE and doing meaningless griefs. Official servers are completely dead, most servers are averaging a population of 5-7. The devs are paying enormous amount of money keeping hundreds of dead servers alive. All this just to satisfy demands of a handful of megatribe players who dont want a real challenge but instead sit on past accomplishments. And also real money traders, a lot of people against wipe are trading lines for cash and dont want their side income wiped.

Edited by covenantgrunt

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17 hours ago, ForzaProiettile said:

There was more passive players back then, that much is true and a lot of players were still inexperienced at survival games and unaware of its multi facets.

That said I and my group have always adopted a total war mentality. I don't believe in half measures, when you raid you should raid properly and leave them with nothing. If you leave them tames, gear or important structures then they will only use that to get back at you faster.

not if u are generouse, when ever we raided we only took what we needed and we made sure it would not be something that takes forever to make like hard polymer. we were rarely ever rebound raided, and on the few times they only stole back resources. yes i played on multiple official servers and un-official servers back then so it was wide spread. the problem now is that we have too many OP resources at our disposal. so because we are givin OP weapons we think we need to use it to completely destroy things and cause havoc.

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9 hours ago, Demerus said:

PVP community will continue to be bitter and toxic toward PVE'ers because PVE is widely regarded by the PVP community to be a "safe space".

A wide spectrum of PVP players consider themselves above PVE players and are willfully ignorant of the reasons players prefer to play a different mode than them.

It is widely known that a vast majority of PVP players exploit the best tames and glitches in order to compete against other tribes.

The constant glitching and need to "one up" eachother on PVP forces WC to nerf useful tames and fun mechanics into the ground screwing over PVE players in the process.

Not much will change for PVP. Everything will change for PVE.

I can only speak for myself, but my bitterness towards PVE stems from the fact that they get all of the rewards with less of the risks. 

PVP players are above PVE players, because we face both the easy, programmed opponents and the more difficult human ones.

One man's exploit is another man's common sense.

That "one up" thing you're talking about has been driving the advancement of human civilization for quite a while now.  Without it, we're playing with rocks, not virtual dinosaurs.

No idea what #5 means.

 

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21 minutes ago, SMP said:

I can only speak for myself, but my bitterness towards PVE stems from the fact that they get all of the rewards with less of the risks.

Bitterness? Because of a game? Really?

Sounds like for you there is no difference between work and a game. Your POV would be valid if Ark would be a job ... but hey, it's a game! The problem here is not PvE or PvE-players, the problem is you who thinks that real-world social-darwinism should be also applied to a game. Seems like you have lost the abilty to play, all what's left for you is fighting. I think the real reason for your bitterness is that you lose in real-life, like me and most others of the 8 billion people on the planet. Pointless how good you are, there will always be hundredthousands who are better than you.

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56 minutes ago, SMP said:

I can only speak for myself, but my bitterness towards PVE stems from the fact that they get all of the rewards with less of the risks. 

PVP players are above PVE players, because we face both the easy, programmed opponents and the more difficult human ones.

One man's exploit is another man's common sense.

That "one up" thing you're talking about has been driving the advancement of human civilization for quite a while now.  Without it, we're playing with rocks, not virtual dinosaurs.

No idea what #5 means.

 

pve is the same ark, just without the constant fight, trolls and wiping. it gives us time to not only focus on core of the game but also do other things aswell

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3 hours ago, Kodking194 said:

pve is the same ark, just without the constant fight, trolls and wiping. it gives us time to not only focus on core of the game but also do other things aswell

Except there are still trolls in PvE, as evidenced by weekly forum posts.  As for wiping, I haven't been wiped in 2 years of playing PvP, and have plenty of time to do everything including bosses, even as a solo tribe.

What else ya got?

Edited by SMP
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I could never imagine playing PvE in the long run. In PvE i can build cool tjings along with breeding super dinos but what would i even use them for? Just fighting the same bosses over and over? No, I think I would maybe reach ascension then probably leave the game. It's totally cool if someone prefers PvE but I also think that PvP servers will outlast PvE in the long run.

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