Fishman2323 Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 While the rest of the tribe was offline, we had a tribe member unclaim our 154 Quetz and high level mammoth, destroyed and stole all the good materials (about 4 vaults worth) and then destroyed all power to our turrets and destroyed plant X. He then left the tribe and claimed the Quetz and Mammoth for himself and flew off into the sunset joining a rival tribe. I don't mind being raided and losing things, but an inside job like this? Is there anything that can be done about this other than revenge? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SallyAnn Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 I would ensure that the tribe settings are set up so only admins can destroy buildings or unclaim dinos. http://ark.gamepedia.com/Tribe:Tribes#Tribe_Governance If it's actually an admin that's done it then that's unfortunate but maybe in the future the Tribe rankings and per rank privileges that are coming will enable more control. From the patch notes: Quote - Tribe Member Rankings with Customizable Per-Rank Privileges Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fishman2323 Posted March 13, 2016 Author Share Posted March 13, 2016 It was an admin...and yes, very unfortunate. He will get his. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SallyAnn Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 Sadly unless he broke Wildcards rules and was harassing or abusive there would be no way to deal with him on an Official server. Revenge is a dish best served cold I've heard, so hopefully some of our more devious community members can come up with some fun plans to help you out. I believe cages and handcuffs + over encumber seem popular for this type of player right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danouk Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 3 hours ago, Fishman2323 said: It was an admin...and yes, very unfortunate. He will get his. Revenge is best serve cold. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xopha Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 He was an admin in your tribe, but this new tribe will see him as a disgrace and a necessary evil. They know that they themselves cannot trust him to be an admin because he could just do what he did to you to them. Maybe you'd be better off reminding them that. Plant the seeds of doubt in their mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Volunteer Moderator GP Posted March 13, 2016 Volunteer Moderator Share Posted March 13, 2016 2 minutes ago, Martyn said: Only one side of the story here, for all we know he had good reason and you deserved it. Seems abit extreme, unless he has an axe to grind. This is always true in situations like this, but as it was the tribe admin if they had an axe to grind they could have just kicked him from the tribe and be done with it. But in my mind there's nothing wrong with backstabbing. It creates drama and livens things up a bit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SallyAnn Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 1 minute ago, Martyn said: Nothing wrong with backstabbing? lol. seriously. omg. Well whether we agree with it or not, it's the heart and soul of some games *cough* EVE online The OPs simply asked for advice on how to deal with players that rip off their tribe so there's no need to go into any blame games/who deserved what, we can offer choose to offer advice or choose not to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Volunteer Moderator GP Posted March 13, 2016 Volunteer Moderator Share Posted March 13, 2016 Just now, Martyn said: Well, whilst I accept that an the right to an opinion is one thing, there is never a time when backstabbing in any way, shape or form is ever acceptable. And for a community moderator to make that statement. Shocked to be honest. Lol lets drop the Moderator badge for a sec because that's all you guys do when you want to make a dig, you point out the badge. This is a game right. If you "kill" another player or creature, do you think that's ok? It's not ok in real life because its murder, but its ok in a game. Backstabbing may not be ok in real life because it's morally wrong, but in a game its a gameplay mechanic. It's also known as strategy. So yes I stand by my claim that backstabbing in the game is fine and is a strategic tactic. The OP has a few choices, he can forget it and move on, he can try and get revenge and fight back, he could try and make the new tribe aware of such treason etc. Plenty of choices. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SebastianB Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 Backstabbing ain't black and white in RL either most of the time, theres always two sides to a story, and sometimes the bad guy becomes the good guy if you get the complete picture instead of one side of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woden Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 33 minutes ago, Martyn said: Well, whilst I accept that an the right to an opinion is one thing, there is never a time when backstabbing in any way, shape or form is ever acceptable. And for a community moderator to make that statement. Shocked to be honest. I think it's completely acceptable. It puts some risk in these tribes who come online and invite 40 members just to be alpha by numbers. When some people are playing in smaller tribes with close friends, (they know won't betray them), trying to hold their own. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xopha Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 7 hours ago, caastor said: We'll i see u don't se the meaning of primitive animals gangs/packs/tribes they won't see him as evil they see him as a hero destroying his old tribe and taking supplys he problably share with the new tribe. remember the tribes wer rivals Until a better tribe comes along and he betrays THEM for the better one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coggage Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 Backstabbing and insider scams are part and parcel of Player vs Player games. Every player, tribe-mate (guild-mate, corp-mate, whatever) is a potential risk, and to even think otherwise is naive. Always watch your back, even when your back is made up of merely pixels. Oh, and choose Admins more wisely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Volunteer Moderator ciabattaroll Posted March 13, 2016 Volunteer Moderator Share Posted March 13, 2016 If backstabbing in a game wasn't fine then every single thief/rogue/assassin class and the spy from team fortress would all be very sad pandas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xopha Posted March 14, 2016 Share Posted March 14, 2016 What you have to remember and accept is that this in not just a game, but a social experiment of sorts. Freedom like this is very rare in a game and we should appreciate it tbh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panteni87 Posted March 14, 2016 Share Posted March 14, 2016 20 hours ago, GamerPerfection said: Lol lets drop the Moderator badge for a sec because that's all you guys do when you want to make a dig, you point out the badge. This is a game right. If you "kill" another player or creature, do you think that's ok? It's not ok in real life because its murder, but its ok in a game. Backstabbing may not be ok in real life because it's morally wrong, but in a game its a gameplay mechanic. It's also known as strategy. So yes I stand by my claim that backstabbing in the game is fine and is a strategic tactic. The OP has a few choices, he can forget it and move on, he can try and get revenge and fight back, he could try and make the new tribe aware of such treason etc. Plenty of choices. And you don't think this way of looking at things will only deter people from playing. I already advise everybody in my surroundings not to play this game due to the state the game is currently in. If i tell 'm that this game is more f-ed up than real life, and i will. I can garantuee nobody will want to play this. And the worst part, if i want to play privately with my friends i have to pay a server. When i told them that they said: if that's the only way we can play together and have fun, i'll leave it. And as long as people that think and play like you, i will keep advising people not to buy the game. Especially if "game braking" features like the handcuffs are being introduced without the proper counter-play. I know this is alpha, but the devs should have known that people are bastards and will abuse this system as a mofo. And traitors, they should be known around the server, with an emblem besides their name. Why not brand a thief? That was possible, like that anybody can recognize the thief and not accept him anywhere close. Please, if people want a cutthroat game, there's 10 games out there where you can get scrwed over that are better than this one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panteni87 Posted March 14, 2016 Share Posted March 14, 2016 Just now, Martyn said: Actually irl if you tell someone something is bad at any level, there's probably a higher chance that they'll want to try it, if only to find out what bad things they can do themselves. Corruption draws the corrupted. Ark is a neutral playground. There's nothing wrong with having cages or handcuffs, if they are used responsibly. But that's really the case in point. We all know that 99.99% of people, never act responsibly. Exactly, building a game assuming people will act responsibly is wishfull thinking. And you can't build a good game that everbody can enjoy around wishfull thinking. So when they release something into the game, they would have to assume people will abuse it, and how they will abuse it. But if i tell my friends that other people can keep them from playing for over 36 hours, and they don't even need a reason beyond "i felt like it", they won't play. It's easy as that. You release a good game with poopty mechanics, well then it's not a good game. Done. And there's 6 friends waiting for release and my "final verdict". If things keep going the way they go? My verdict will be: do not buy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hornedfrog85 Posted March 14, 2016 Share Posted March 14, 2016 13 minutes ago, panteni87 said: And you don't think this way of looking at things will only deter people from playing. I already advise everybody in my surroundings not to play this game due to the state the game is currently in. If i tell 'm that this game is more f-ed up than real life, and i will. I can garantuee nobody will want to play this. And the worst part, if i want to play privately with my friends i have to pay a server. When i told them that they said: if that's the only way we can play together and have fun, i'll leave it. And as long as people that think and play like you, i will keep advising people not to buy the game. Especially if "game braking" features like the handcuffs are being introduced without the proper counter-play. I know this is alpha, but the devs should have known that people are bastards and will abuse this system as a mofo. And traitors, they should be known around the server, with an emblem besides their name. Why not brand a thief? That was possible, like that anybody can recognize the thief and not accept him anywhere close. Please, if people want a cutthroat game, there's 10 games out there where you can get scrwed over that are better than this one. So why stay and comment? If you not playing and driving people not to play... Go away and be about your business? To come on just to comment about this is rather sad. On topic backstabbing is a tactic just like offline rades its not a tactic i would use or be happy having it done but its free will how you play. If i were you I'd get revenge take their stuff and leave them with nothing. We had a guy empty all our stuff onto the floor to time out, he then took my op rex and ate another tribe literally everything. We hunted him every day till he gave up. its just part of the game and makes it more interesting. Sorry for you loss!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panteni87 Posted March 14, 2016 Share Posted March 14, 2016 Just now, Hornedfrog85 said: So why stay and comment? If you bot playing and driving people not to play... Go away and be about your business? To come on just to comment about this is rather sad. On topic backstabbing is a tactic just like offline rades its not a tactic i would use or be happy having it done but its free will how you play. If i were you I'd get revenge take their stuff and leave them with nothing. We had a guy empty all our stuff onto the floor to time out, he then took my op rex and ate another tribe literally everything. We hunted him every day till he gave up. its just part of the game and makes it more interesting. Sorry for you loss!! Yeah, that's nice for you man! I play the game because of the potential. But atm, the potential is being wasted. I play my game in single player, and undedicated. so go away with your comment and just bend over for every game developer. Its fine and dandy for you, but hey, my friends obviously don't want this kind of game. We just want a local game where people can go more then 300 meters away from each other. But hey, in the meanwhile i'll just abuse an exploit where i can move around 5000 weight within 20 minutes from one side of the map to the other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Volunteer Moderator GP Posted March 14, 2016 Volunteer Moderator Share Posted March 14, 2016 15 minutes ago, panteni87 said: And you don't think this way of looking at things will only deter people from playing. I already advise everybody in my surroundings not to play this game due to the state the game is currently in. If i tell 'm that this game is more f-ed up than real life, and i will. I can garantuee nobody will want to play this. And the worst part, if i want to play privately with my friends i have to pay a server. When i told them that they said: if that's the only way we can play together and have fun, i'll leave it. And as long as people that think and play like you, i will keep advising people not to buy the game. Especially if "game braking" features like the handcuffs are being introduced without the proper counter-play. I know this is alpha, but the devs should have known that people are bastards and will abuse this system as a mofo. And traitors, they should be known around the server, with an emblem besides their name. Why not brand a thief? That was possible, like that anybody can recognize the thief and not accept him anywhere close. Please, if people want a cutthroat game, there's 10 games out there where you can get scrwed over that are better than this one. As i have said it is a legitimate war tactic. For all you know, using this threads example as an example, this tribe admin and the other tribe could have planned and staged this all the long. He could have set-up a tribe, invited others with the sole intent of getting them to do all the hard work taming and building etc., to then at some point steal it all and join back up with his tribe mates. This tactic is absolutely fine in the game. Do I agree with such a tactic? No. Would I carry out such a tactic? No. Would I endorse such a tactic if someone came to me and told me that's what they were planning? No. BUT, I do feel that such a tactic is ok in this sort of game. PvP is all about player vs player, which usually consists of wars. Tribes declaring war on tribes. War is a dog eat dog world, and you need to do what you can to survivor. If that means deceive and steal then go ahead and do it. If we shift this to the other side, i.e. the victim side, you can ask them what checks did they do before they joined someones tribe? What checks did they do before they accepted someone into their tribe or made them admin? I can guarantee you most of the time there are no efforts made. Therefore when you are recruiting into a tribe, or joining a tribe there may be consequences that will be unforeseen. Am I deterring people from playing? No, because I believe people can make up their own minds as to what they want to do or what they want to play. Are you deterring people from playing? Yes because you are directly telling them not to play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panteni87 Posted March 14, 2016 Share Posted March 14, 2016 Just now, GamerPerfection said: As i have said it is a legitimate war tactic. For all you know, using this threads example as an example, this tribe admin and the other tribe could have planned and staged this all the long. He could have set-up a tribe, invited others with the sole intent of getting them to do all the hard work taming and building etc., to then at some point steal it all and join back up with his tribe mates. This tactic is absolutely fine in the game. Do I agree with such a tactic? No. Would I carry out such a tactic? No. Would I endorse such a tactic if someone came to me and told me that's what they were planning? No. BUT, I do feel that such a tactic is ok in this sort of game. PvP is all about player vs player, which usually consists of wars. Tribes declaring war on tribes. War is a dog eat dog world, and you need to do what you can to survivor. If that means deceive and steal then go ahead and do it. If we shift this to the other side, i.e. the victim side, you can ask them what checks did they do before they joined someones tribe? What checks did they do before they accepted someone into their tribe or made them admin? I can guarantee you most of the time there are no efforts made. Therefore when you are recruiting into a tribe, or joining a tribe there may be consequences that will be unforeseen. Am I deterring people from playing? No, because I believe people can make up their own minds as to what they want to do or what they want to play. Are you deterring people from playing? Yes because you are directly telling them not to play. I have said: introduce mechanics without counter mechanics. I'm not saying to listen to the victim's side. I'm saying to be a bit sensible when introducing mechanics. And not a mechanic that can get you wiped just because somebody felt like it because you cannot do anything. And i'm advising my friends, they have agency of their own. They just trust my decision regarding games. And good for them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Volunteer Moderator GP Posted March 14, 2016 Volunteer Moderator Share Posted March 14, 2016 2 minutes ago, panteni87 said: I have said: introduce mechanics without counter mechanics. I'm not saying to listen to the victim's side. I'm saying to be a bit sensible when introducing mechanics. And not a mechanic that can get you wiped just because somebody felt like it because you cannot do anything. And i'm advising my friends, they have agency of their own. They just trust my decision regarding games. And good for them. The tribe mechanics are absolutely fine. It is the human element that becomes the problem. You get a rotten apple for a tribe admin then it doesn't matter what the tribe mechanics are like they will still cause problems and betrayal because they are the human element. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
isaackingraven Posted March 14, 2016 Share Posted March 14, 2016 well my clan just did the same thing to the alpha tribe in there server not cause we were lazy or mean because they were ruining the server they had stopped all the giga spawns and most of the metal spawns they were trying to extort RENT out of tribes and had a prison with over fifty people in it just random people not for any other reason yes we felt bad cause we shouldn't have had to resort to this kind of tactic but hey all there 6 gigas and ten quetz plus loads of other animals were lost to them for 1 there own stupidity and 2 there complete and utter lack of human decency and with that we wiped the whole server all 9 other alpha tribes for the same reasons. the server went from a dead one to a burnt and dead one and now there are loads of new start out tribes building everywhere it breathed new life into the server so yes its a valid tactic and I believe it was just in our case so maybe they shouldn't warrant this kind of attack by being so mean to people like these clans building with metal in a primitive server and going around blowing up peoples houses with grenades and permanently blocking off caves and spawns ect ect Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hornedfrog85 Posted March 14, 2016 Share Posted March 14, 2016 53 minutes ago, panteni87 said: Yeah, that's nice for you man! I play the game because of the potential. But atm, the potential is being wasted. I play my game in single player, and undedicated. so go away with your comment and just bend over for every game developer. Its fine and dandy for you, but hey, my friends obviously don't want this kind of game. We just want a local game where people can go more then 300 meters away from each other. But hey, in the meanwhile i'll just abuse an exploit where i can move around 5000 weight within 20 minutes from one side of the map to the other. You do that! Enjoy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Volunteer Moderator Jerryn Posted March 14, 2016 Volunteer Moderator Share Posted March 14, 2016 Betrayal, like KOS, PVO, thievery, etc., are all part of the sandbox, unless you play on a server with settings and/or rules against such. If this was PVE, then the chance for payback would be nearly nill as the player could hide behind the protections of PVE like egg thieves and other griefers. However, it is PVP, so the option for retribution is there, so long as the other party doesn't strike first. So, the best thing is to change up the base layout and defenses, rebuild, scout that player out, and rain destruction on the tribe the is harboring them and continue to do so until they give him/her up, preferable in handcuffs, so you can take them back to your base to server out their time for their betrayal. Or, you accept that you got played and move on with life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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