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Separate PvE and PvP balances


DauntedVenus
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There should be a way to separate the balances made to dinosaurs and game mechanics between PvE and PvP.

Multiple balances have made PvE nothing but hard. Managarmr being a recent example, in PvE they're useless now thanks to the many balances made to make PvP better.

Flier nerf was a huge change in PvE making fliers and transportation harder by forcing us to land since PvP was taking to the skies too often and the game tried to "ground" the fight

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I would very much like to see them bring back the ability for flyers to carry wild animals in PvE. I know it was removed to prevent griefing, but there's gotta be a better way. 

I think the best way to go about it would be to force flyers to automatically drop wild animals if they fly within enemy territory, and the dropped creature ignores any players or tames for a limited amount of time or unless it is attacked first. I don't know much about programming, but I imagine it could easily be done by tweaking the same code used for placing structures near enemy territory and offline protection.

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On 4/23/2019 at 11:11 PM, DauntedVenus said:

There should be a way to separate the balances made to dinosaurs and game mechanics between PvE and PvP.

Multiple balances have made PvE nothing but hard. Managarmr being a recent example, in PvE they're useless now thanks to the many balances made to make PvP better.

Flier nerf was a huge change in PvE making fliers and transportation harder by forcing us to land since PvP was taking to the skies too often and the game tried to "ground" the fight

I highly disagree with what you saying about nerf to flying tames. 
This was a big step in the right direction, finally some other tames was worth using, before the nerf it was like: Can it fly? If not, can't use it. 

Also nerfing flyers means that less massive bases has to be loaded in PVE at the same time and therefore causing less stress stress on the server. What would be the point of having teleporters then, if I can fly there in a second?

But in general, the game should have been a PVE game only. Trying to balance PVE and PVP at the same time is a massive fail, PVP will always be broken in a game like this and the majority of players are playing PVE anyway.  
If it was only made for PVE, this game could have been 100 times better. 

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On 4/24/2019 at 1:50 AM, AleXtreme1 said:

Oieru is right!!! At first , extinction creatures were the best in the game (managarmr ,velonosaur , gacha , etc) . After several updates the abilities of those creatures were reduced at half or eaven lower. When managarmr appeared on ark for the very beginning i killed a giga from high range with no problem. Now , i have to move close to a dino just to freeze it a little. Same thing with gacha : when extinction map was released , a gacha fed with proper food dropped crystals with mastercraft or ascendant items very easy. Now , i have to open a lot of crystals to get maximum a mastercraft item at it's lowest quality. I think no-one cares on PvE if you kill a wild dino with a primitive pick or an ascendant rifle. 20190304174504_1.thumb.jpg.f39609ebca95b2e207436790cc6d7a72.jpg 

i wasn't happy with the gacha nerf either, but getting high tier loot is very much possible, my gachas skill is at about 160% and id say 35% of my loot crystals are ascendant, with the other 65% being mastercraft, along with getting max resources from every resource crystal

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On 4/23/2019 at 5:22 PM, Oieru said:

As the title says, we need SEPARATE buffs/nerfs/balance tweaks for PVE and PVP. 2 completely different game modes with completely different strategies, objectives and player types need different tweaks to the game.

This has become especially evident in the cases of the extreme and repeated nerfs of the Managarmr, a new and versatile creature that quickly became as useful as throwing small feces at a wild Giga... All because of the outcry of a portion of PVP players, while completely ignoring, disregarding the PVE community. While PVP was focused on griefing fellow players with Manas, PVE players needed that versatility to focus on boss taming/killing. You can see the frustration on both sides. PVP is still and will be forever complaining about Manas, while PVE clings to being able to still play with that creature. This is only one example.

For two game modes you need two game settings. It is only logical, as a famous saying goes.

So please, for the sake of the PVE and PVP communities, revert those extreme tweaks and focus on implementing them completely different in PVE and PVP game modes. This might be the most urgent game balance.

 

PS: DO NOT, I repeat, DO NOT make this a discussion over PVE/PVP supremacy. If you want to know, they both suck equally bad for different reasons!

 

VDju8kp.jpg

 

Certain creatures like Gigas and Manas are outright useless now for PvE because of the extreme nerfs done to them. Games like Destiny do this same thing where a small portion of PvP players cry about certain weapons or armor because someone is better than them, so the company makes it worthless to everyone, rather than just to PvP. Back to the creatures of ARK, the giga specifically is a cool creature in need of some TLC, but is quite literally nothing more than a waste of time and valuable resources on every map besides Extinction, and even then you need to have a good high level male and female, and selectively breed multiple generations, which depending on server stats can take hours to literal months, all because a handful of neckbeards were mad that someone beat them in a video game

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I didn't read the whole thread, so i dunno if its been suggested, but for us who play SP, why not give us an option to turn off nerfs for EVERYTHING? I mean, if i wanna go around one shotting everything with a Giga, or traveling the across the map in 30 seconds with a Wyvern or Mana, that should be for me to decide, since im only playing by myself. 
Then why not u just spawn a very high lvl tame like lvl 10000 and do what u want in sp?
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If this ever gets implemented, I want to suggest this : 

ALLOW CARRYING WILD DINO IN PVE, the rules can follow placing structure for releasing the creature. So if I want to release a creature I cannot release it near enemy structure, but still have to modifiy height, can probably set not to allow release at xx height. That way we can safely pickup wild dino for taming. 

Now if the carrier needs to rest for stam, it is also allowed even near other people's base, BUT the carried dino is tethered to its feet and the dino cant move, both or the carrier is ok but would not make sense grabbing animal and walking. IF when stam the carrier dc, there's 15minutes time before the carried dino will despawn. 

That should allow carry wild dinoes in PVE. I hate not to be able to carry in PVE because taming small dinoes from faraway places needs extra preps and take real estate just for random structures for trap.

 

Or add MOBILE TRAP PLATFORM ADDON for flyer dinoes : SMALLer dino like argentavis maybe 2x2 and 3x3 for bigger dino like quatz , the idea is like this image below, but instead of a helicopter, it is an argentavis/quetzal/wyvern etc, and instead of a house, it is a 2x2 or 3x3 platform, cannot be dropped too near to enemy structure, but has less range from normal structure, and has quick decay rate like maybe 6h just enough for taming, unless put on our own ceiling/foundations.

nu-da-check-the-largest-transport-helico

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WC still don't get what pve is.  This is the problem.  This game was made by pvp'ers and they just don't understand pve'ers.  We need violent mad angry out to get us mobs THAT ARE NOT ANNOYING.  That is a hard balance to make and the true sign of a pve creator.  You cannot overcome and feel proud if the mob can be easily outsmarted.  At the same time you don't want your hard work ruined every five seconds either.

The mobs in this game are to easy. 

This is still a pvp game when people say comments like, "I had to leave pve to go to pvp cause it wasn't exciting enough."

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I have a problem with this, I do support the idea in general, but I feel like if WC implements this, it(meaning PvP or PvE)may be left behind , similar to Prim+ and not updated anymore. I have my bets on which side, but I don’t wanna start to big a fight.

Edited by Dinobros2000
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On 4/24/2019 at 1:50 AM, AleXtreme1 said:

Oieru is right!!! At first , extinction creatures were the best in the game (managarmr ,velonosaur , gacha , etc) . After several updates the abilities of those creatures were reduced at half or eaven lower. When managarmr appeared on ark for the very beginning i killed a giga from high range with no problem. Now , i have to move close to a dino just to freeze it a little. Same thing with gacha : when extinction map was released , a gacha fed with proper food dropped crystals with mastercraft or ascendant items very easy. Now , i have to open a lot of crystals to get maximum a mastercraft item at it's lowest quality. I think no-one cares on PvE if you kill a wild dino with a primitive pick or an ascendant rifle. 20190304174504_1.thumb.jpg.f39609ebca95b2e207436790cc6d7a72.jpg 

Extinction had the most game breaking dino's to date they all needed nerfs.

I know im gonna get a lof of flack for saying it but needs to be said

Mana freeze breath range was rediculous even in that SS you could of been on the ground under the desert titan by the water there and hit it. Personally i think its still cheesy that it has this ability and should be removed. It needed a big nerf regardless of PVP.

Snow owl heals about 5 times faster than a deadon and consumes 1/50th less food, personally the freeze heal and freeze wild dino's should be removed. If not then this still needs a nerf to be more in line with the deadon in terms of healing and food consumption.

Velo had rediculous range and if not ridden was a unlimited firing turret that didnt need food because it never used stamina.

Gacha dumbest dino introduced into the game, feed it stone and it has a saddle so its a rideable armoire and gun shop if you jack up crafting level thus never needing to leave your base to go find a drop/loot crate, or just sit around and collect whatever material your after.  Personally would like to see the armor, weapons, and materials removed. Side note then the god awful gacha towers dont need to exist anymore :)

The whole flier nerf i'm assuming everyone is talking about happened atleast 4 years ago or more yes that was because of PVP. They were able to fly pteranodon's threw walls get the agro of the dino's in side and kite them back threw the wall outside the base to kill them they were doing that during the beta of the game. So while i miss the days of being able to put points into speed on fliers its no longer needed, now that they have added wyvrens, crystal wyvrens, gas bags, skiff.

And the mana is far from useless as most claim on here, its just like any other dino it has its uses with how it was introduced it was a god dino and needed the nerf hammer.

 

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I agree that PvE balancing should be different from PvE... But like how should that be done is uncertain. And the flyer nerf is needed not only it is b/c the game is better when flyers have fixed movement speed but also 1 less waste attribute for breeders to worry about.

Speaking of flyers, most flyers especially Quetz are completely obsolete at this point especially in PvE when there is hover skiff in the game with easy element source in Gen 2... 

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On 7/8/2021 at 12:18 AM, Courage15 said:

I agree that PvE balancing should be different from PvE... But like how should that be done is uncertain. And the flyer nerf is needed not only it is b/c the game is better when flyers have fixed movement speed but also 1 less waste attribute for breeders to worry about.

Speaking of flyers, most flyers especially Quetz are completely obsolete at this point especially in PvE when there is hover skiff in the game with easy element source in Gen 2... 

well for starters, PvE doesnt need the upload decay timer, that's meant to keep people from hiding stolen goods without people being able to get it, a personal vault, while in PvE this just hurts players who either A) are not able to get cryopods yet or B) are trying to store unpoddable tames such as the stryder or titans, now, that being said a player should only be able to have 1 titan in upload, but the stryders are a big problem
next, quetzal are not obsolete, i use them quite often, the genisis 1 boss fight is probably the hardest fight of all of them (except maybe king titan, but even then king titan isnt really hard, just needs a lot of prep) yet gamma final test is too hard, from the gigas in the arena being able to bleed to the fact you HAVE to go on foot and survive the mob in order to even progress, quetzals only become obsolete after you beat that and even then, a good quetzal will easily surpace the skiffs weight and health, as well as if you want to store things on it you can put it on passive flee to have a better chance, quetzals are also breedable, so while a skiff is cheap, a quetzal is cheaper, and the only thing it loses is speed and the ability to pick up things larger than mammoths,
 

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On 4/23/2019 at 5:12 PM, d1nk said:

I agree with the topic but not the flier nerf bit. It was needed and shouldnt be put back in.

Sorry but I agree and Disagree.  For example Pteranodon's  have litle melee compared to other flyers (Argies, wyverns) they should be able to have speed increases. just make sure the melee is lowered. I used to have a lot of fun flying around on my Pteranodon's years ago before the fly patch.  Also they should give them backpacks to carry more. I used to love them but now never use them. It does make sense however for other dinos such as wyverns to not have speed increases

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