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Mutation stats Question


Strop

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Hi All

Just cant get my head around this breeding and Mutations thing

Ive got a Male rex with 0/20 muts on Patrilineal side and 13764 on the matrilineal

Im mating with a Female rex with 13764/20 on Matrilenial and 0/20 on Patrilineal.

Offsping come out with 13764 on both sides. Not ideal. 

Q1. What do I do to remove the Muts to get less than 20 on the female so I can get better offspring?

Q2. how do I rotate better offspring in?

Thanks 

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55 minutes ago, Strop said:

Hi All

Just cant get my head around this breeding and Mutations thing

Ive got a Male rex with 0/20 muts on Patrilineal side and 13764 on the matrilineal

Im mating with a Female rex with 13764/20 on Matrilenial and 0/20 on Patrilineal.

Offsping come out with 13764 on both sides. Not ideal. 

Q1. What do I do to remove the Muts to get less than 20 on the female so I can get better offspring?

Q2. how do I rotate better offspring in?

Thanks 

The only way you can get new mutations on a Dino when the parent has 20 or more mutations is to breed a line and stats separate from the mutation maxed line and then later breed the desired stat into the line.  You can’t clear mutations as far as I am aware.

 

PS sweet Daggerfall profile pic, I love that game.

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25 minutes ago, Strop said:

RipRavage thanks for your help. Both of these are fresh lines bred in. With 0/20 on one side. When i breed them together i keep getting the 13764 on both sides on the offspring. I cant figure what im doing wrong

That sounds like a pretty serious glitch, are you using any mods that might be causing this? Or are you saying you are breeding a parent with 13764/20 mutations with a parent with 0/20 mutations, because that won’t result in a mutation.

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2 minutes ago, RipRavage said:

That sounds like a pretty serious glitch, are you using any mods that might be causing this? Or are you saying you are breeding a parent with 13764/20 mutations with a parent with 0/20 mutations, because that won’t result in a mutation.

I'm pretty sure it does, but the chances that it happens is lower... 

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11 minutes ago, Paroxyde said:

I'm pretty sure it does, but the chances that it happens is lower... 

Heres what the wiki says, the mutation counter line seems to be linked to gender.

When an egg hatches, its stats are randomly selected from either parent, with a 55% chance to get the better of the two. Regardless of this though, a mutation from one parent can still affect a stat taken from the other. This means a Fully Mutated Dino (≥20/20 on both sides of inheritance) with higher stats bred with a Non-Fully Mutated Dino (≤19/20 on the respective gender's lineage) can still receive mutations on the stats from the Fully Mutated Parent, allowing you to further increase breeding potential. This is because the stats are chosen first, and then the mutations (if any are to occur), are selected and applied.

The Mutation counter is the number shown on your ancestry tree. This is represented by a 0/20 score at base and increases with concurrent breeding.

A +1 on the patrimonial/matrimonial side of the mutation counter is based on which parent the mutation "came" from, but for the purpose of advanced breeding it’s not too important.

The only important thing is that new mutations will not occur if the Parent Dino has 20+/20 inheritance from their respective gender's lineage.

This means that in order to breed new mutations, a Male Dino would need ≤19/20 mutations on only the patrimonial side, while a Female Dino would need ≤19/20 mutations on only the matrimonial side. (For example, a Male Dino with 12/20 patrimonial mutations and 20/20 matrimonial mutations would still be viable for breeding)

The counter on mutation inheritance works on its own accord, and does not actually show the actual number of mutations on a Dino. What the counter does do is take the sum of mutations of BOTH inheritances, adding them together and then placing them on the respective inheritance of the Parent Dino.

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Just now, RipRavage said:

Heres what the wiki says, the mutation counter line seems to be linked to gender.

When an egg hatches, its stats are randomly selected from either parent, with a 55% chance to get the better of the two. Regardless of this though, a mutation from one parent can still affect a stat taken from the other. This means a Fully Mutated Dino (≥20/20 on both sides of inheritance) with higher stats bred with a Non-Fully Mutated Dino (≤19/20 on the respective gender's lineage) can still receive mutations on the stats from the Fully Mutated Parent, allowing you to further increase breeding potential. This is because the stats are chosen first, and then the mutations (if any are to occur), are selected and applied.

The Mutation counter is the number shown on your ancestry tree. This is represented by a 0/20 score at base and increases with concurrent breeding.

A +1 on the patrimonial/matrimonial side of the mutation counter is based on which parent the mutation "came" from, but for the purpose of advanced breeding it’s not too important.

The only important thing is that new mutations will not occur if the Parent Dino has 20+/20 inheritance from their respective gender's lineage.

This means that in order to breed new mutations, a Male Dino would need ≤19/20 mutations on only the patrimonial side, while a Female Dino would need ≤19/20 mutations on only the matrimonial side. (For example, a Male Dino with 12/20 patrimonial mutations and 20/20 matrimonial mutations would still be viable for breeding)

The counter on mutation inheritance works on its own accord, and does not actually show the actual number of mutations on a Dino. What the counter does do is take the sum of mutations of BOTH inheritances, adding them together and then placing them on the respective inheritance of the Parent Dino.

Exactly what I said. As long as there is 1 parent with less than 20 mutation count, the mutation still happens even if the other one has 948382927380 mutation count. 

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If I can help by putting it in my words. 0. ( to the unasked but implicit question you answered yourself) you cannot get a mutation from mating these dinos for certain. So your desire for a less than 20 mutations on the maternal side is well founded. The mother must have less than 20 on the maternal side 1. tame new females. 2. It might be smarter to tame all new females, rather than breeding females. Or, as I do, tame a few new females and a male. From that, since breeding each generation yields a compounding amount of creatures,  I get a set of females without mutations on either side by the end of a few breeding rounds. Their stats are not my concern. I would not try to get a set of moms from this pool with the stats of your line. Hopefully, from below, I hope you can understand why I would not. 

Simply put:

The moms provide the potential for the mutation, low total mutation count, no stats. 

The dads provide the stats to be mutated. Virtually infinity total mutation count. 

In breeding, you want the highest potential for mutation to occur -----> lots of females without mutations.

In breeding, you want to mutate one stat, the highest stat for each trait. ---->one male. 

The father needs to have less than 20 on his paternal side. This is definite. Now, I've heard two accounts on total mutations of the father. Wiki seems to say the father's maternal side can get lost, doesn't matter. Other breeders I've discussed this with, have said that both the father's paternal mutation count and maternal mutation count sides need to be less than 20. So father's mutation count total less than 40, (or infinity).

The mother needs to have less than 20 on her maternal side. This is definite. As above with the father, so too here with the mother.

So. Mommy needs less than 20 on her mom mutation count and father needs less than 20 on his dad mutation count. The total mutation count of each of the parents could be either less than 40 or infinity. ( I thought I got muts from parents with greater than 40 mutation count, but haven't verified since I knew breeding well enough to ask the question). 

But, here's the deal. Every parent is, based on your facts, going to have a total mutation count of greater than 20. Therefore, every child is going to have both a maternal and paternal mutation count of greater than 20. You have to start with fresh new females. 

So, we have to get new females, but can we "start a new line for the maternal side?"

Likely no, or, I would not do it.  Remember above, we could have either a total mutation limiter of 40 or infinity for the parents of the offspring for a mutation to occur in the offspring. 

If the total mutation count limiter is infinity (or virtually infinity), you could breed one generation of females from your original tames. Therefore you'd simply get 1x your original tames per round of breeding. Again, supposing that the 1x offspring per round of breeding is allowed to have a total mutation count of greater than 40. This way, and I think this is your concern, you would be able to have some mothers who have the stat and can mutate that stat. 

If the total mutation count limiter is 40, you must tame all new females. Or, tame new females and a new male, then breed females with the new male. But this way, you would not get your new stat on the offspring you raise. 

This thought process, along with efficiency, playing the odds with mutations, and other reasons, I've approached breeding with a "screw the father's total mutation count, have one stud with the best stats" mentality. Then, have females with total mut count less than 40, and very low on maternal side. I say forget the stats on the mom's side. I will breed a large amount of females with the lowest mutation count as possible rather than taming the total amount of females as possible. (this requires taming a new male too).

The moms provide the potential for the mutation, low total mutation count, no stats. 

The dads provide the stats to be mutated. Virtually infinity total mutation count. 

In breeding, you want the highest potential for mutation to occur -----> lots of females without mutations.

In breeding, you want to mutate one stat, the highest stat for each trait. ---->one male. 

Anyways, that's the approach I've taken to breeding. Right now, in fact, I'm trying to get that minimum amount of points to find a trader on this site. I've bred a good amount of ab spinos females with a 0 or 1 mutation count and want to find a good stud. So, I'm hoping this post does some good. Oh, I can post a question about whether you need the total mutation count for the parents to be less than 40 or infinity. That would be good for me to know and anybody who learned something from this post. 

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9 hours ago, gustafvschmidt said:

 

Simply put:

The moms provide the potential for the mutation, low total mutation count, no stats. 

The dads provide the stats to be mutated. Virtually infinity total mutation count. 

 

The mutation count is not infinite. There is a hard limit on the number of times a Dinosaur's stat can be upgraded - either through Mutation or a Level, and that's 255.

Essentially you want to stop when you have up to 183 Mutations in a Stat, as beyond that point, a Dinosaurs natural 72 levels will give more per stat than the mutations will, due to level by points being calculated by a percentage of the base stat.

If you have a line of Rexes that have (if you've been counting) 255 Mutations in their Health stat, for example; any further mutations in the Health stat will not increase it. Same if you put levels in to that stat.

9. Stop if you reach 184 Levels in a specific stat -– stat values are capped at 255 Levels, 255-71 (Dino Level Cap) = 184. After that the stat resets; you get more stats if you add the level manually because you get a percentage of the base stat on the level up of tamed Dinosaurs rather the a flat value like in a mutation.

^Straight from the Gamepedia (but before the level increase from 71 to 72.)

Edit: It's also limited if you're on an Official server, as a Dinosaur's maximum level (base or levelled) cannot be at or exceed 450, or the Dino will be automatically destroyed by the game engine.

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