how would you rework kibble system

[OttoGrunf]

everybody is saying that kibble system is bad and need rework. so how would you rework it? lets brainstorm about it and wildcard will have starting ideas for it

[Echion]

I would use only the base eggs but change the crop requirements to produce each Dino's kibble.

 

For example in the current setting you tame a dilo to get the Anky, to get the Carno, to get trike, to get the sarco, to get the stego, to get the Argy you wanted.

That's at least 6 Dino's in a kibble farm to get an Argy.

 

'My new system' would mean you only need the dilo and a few more crop plots.

 

For example a dilo egg cooked with;

Rockcarrots tames an Anky

Citronal tames a Carno

Longrass tames a trike

Savoroot tames a sarco

*New seed 1* tames a stego

*New seed 2* tames an Argy.

 

Etc etc etc. That's one Dino in a kibble farm.

 

 

With this we will need much smaller kibble farms -which I feel is the biggest problem with the current system leading to high lag and tame caps - and farming gets a bit of rework to be more useful again.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest]

The kibble system needs to have some logic.

For example, it's unlikely that small wild dinos would have a chance to develop a taste for eggs from large dinos.  So size needs to be taken into account.

Herbivores are unlikely to get close to carnivores and survive, and they're unlikely to eat other creature's eggs.  So herbivores should prefer kibble that doesn't have eggs or meat in the recipe.

Creatures that live on the ground are unlikely to have access to nests that might be high off the ground, so (for example) quetz kibble might be preferred by other high flyers.

Creatures that live in dry or desert regions should prefer kibbles that have berries which have more liquid in them.

Ground based dinos might like kibble based on flowers or mushrooms instead of being egg based.

More common eggs (such as Dodo eggs) should be useable in more kibbles, perhaps to give a slightly smaller boost.

Rarer (or more difficult to obtain) eggs might produce kibble with a bigger boost (while still observing the other restrictions/observations above).

 

Bigger eggs should yield more kibble. 

 

Kibble required for imprinting should be the same as the creature's preferred kibble, but with a lesser imprint for more common kibble and a bigger imprint for rare kibble.

[Eanaya]

There was a statement that they were going to rework the kibble system over a year ago. Not like anything will happen, but here's my thoughts.

1, Imprinting

- make babies ONLY ask for their species' favorite kibble for imprint - Rex for scorp kibble, Thyla for boa kibble, etc. I always read "wants their favorite food..." (German setting). Random kibble is not their favorite food.
- some species don't have a preferred kibble. Make those ask for what you tame them with / what gives you the best effectiveness when taming them - Ovis for cake, Ravager for lamb chop, Lystro for rare flower, Tuso for black pearl etc.
- no need to keep a 50 dinos kibble farm when your tribe only breeds 2 or 3 species

2, Kibble for taming

- make more species (3-5) prefer the same kibble. Currently many have their own preferred kibble no other species wants, look at the Carno > Trike branch. While Carno kibble is used to tame 3 species (Trike, Bear, Wolf), it then goes Trike > Sarco > Stego > Argie > Spino > Shark.
- some don't even make much sense - why does it take Troodon kibble to ONLY tame Equus when Troodon is one of the hardest things to tame and Equus can be perfect tamed with simple carrots, or why does it take Quetz kibble to tame Dimetrodon when Dimet is supposed to be an early game AC unit and Quetz isn't quite early game.
- use kibble from species that are actually used, like Ptera, Anky, Quetz, Rex, Argent, Spino, Therizino etc. This may be a bit hard to say since many dinos that are used in PvP have no or close to no use in PvE, like Stego, Turtle, Troodon. This would have to be determined.
- maybe make it tiered and take 3 to 5 dinos per tier (early, mid and late game) whose kibble is used to tame others within their tier. Take one that is "in between" tiers that uses the lower tier kibble but produces kibble for the higher tier.

3, Kibble substitutes

We got mutton, which worked perfectly... then they nerfed it. Boost that back to what it was, and add something similar for herbivores (like cakes, honey or special fruits)

4, Wild egg drops

- make wild dinos lay a lot more eggs so it's worth to go on an egg hunt. Maybe even add a 20% chance of female creatures dropping an egg when killing it (should drop a bag with egg inside rather than putting it in the tame's inventory, which can quickly encumber your tame on a meat trip).
- give Oviraptor an ability to steal the eggs of wild dinos without being noticed per "go there" command or when set to wander (ie while being grabbed by a flyer), better weight stat and 75% weight reduction on eggs. Could also use the ability to collect eggs in your egg farm when on wander.
 

[Campi]

I would go with:

You can use eggs from any dino but have different recipies for groups of dinos (herbivore/carnivore and small/medium/large size). 
In addition I would make different grades for taming efficiency (high grade being the best)

Small Herbivore Kibble (for taming of small herbivore dinos) (e.g. dodo, shinehorn etc.)
made from 1 egg of a small dino
Low Grade: egg + berries
Mid Grade: egg + berries + vegies of one kind
High Grade: egg + berries + vegies of all 4 kinds

Medium Herbivore Kibble (for taming of medium herbivore dinos) (e.g. parasaur, anky, doed etc.)
made from eighter 10 eggs of a small dino or one egg of a medium dino
Low Grade: egg(s) + berries
Mid Grade: egg(s) + berries + vegies of one kind
High Grade: egg(s) + berries + vegies of all 4 kinds

Large Herbivore Kibble (for taming of large herbivore dinos) (e.g. bronto)
made from eighter 100 eggs of a small dino or 10 eggs of a medium dino or one egg of a large dino
Low Grade: egg(s) + berries
Mid Grade: egg(s) + berries + vegies of one kind
High Grade: egg(s) + berries + vegies of all 4 kinds

Small Carnivore Kibble (for taming small sized carnivores) (e.g. dilo, raptor)
made from 1 egg of a small dino
Low Grade: egg + raw meat
Mid Grade: egg + prime meat + vegies of one kind
High Grade: egg + mutton + vegies of all 4 kinds

Medium Carnivore Kibble (for taming medium sized carnivores) (e.g. kapro, carno)
made from 10 eggs of a small dino or 1 egg of a medium dino
Low Grade: egg + raw meat
Mid Grade: egg + prime meat + vegies of one kind
High Grade: egg + mutton + vegies of all 4 kinds

Large Carnivore Kibble (for taming large sized carnivores) (e.g. rex, yuti, giga)
made from eighter 100 eggs of a small dino or 10 eggs of a medium dino or one egg of a large dino
Low Grade: egg + raw meat
Mid Grade: egg + prime meat + vegies of one kind
High Grade: egg + mutton + vegies of all 4 kinds

For imprinting it could be asking for one low grade kibble/mid grade kibble/high grade kibble so you at least have to have stocks of each kind of kibble also

[Weiss]

Edit: awh I was still writing when the post above mine was submitted^^

If oviraptors would give the mate boost additional to their egg boost it would already be helpful. We could get rid of all the males that just sit around for that purpose.

I'd like to have kibble sizes or tiers. 

1 dilo egg = 1 very small kibble 

5 dilo eggs = 1 small kibble 

10 dilo eggs = 1 medium kibble 

And 

1 anky egg egg = 1 medium kibble

10 anky eggs = 1 big kibble

20 anky eggs = 1 very big kibble 

And

1 rex egg = 1 big kibble 

10 rex eggs = 1 very big kibble 

20 rex eggs = 1 epic kibble 

For imprints I like the idea of using tribute items (thyla claws and such), but not the really rare ones (spino sails on rag are ok, on the island not) , and only the ones available on the map ofc.

[Eanaya]

50 minutes ago, Echion said:

I would use only the base eggs but change the crop requirements to produce each Dino's kibble.

 

For example in the current setting you tame a dilo to get the Anky, to get the Carno, to get trike, to get the sarco, to get the stego, to get the Argy you wanted.

That's at least 6 Dino's in a kibble farm to get an Argy.

 

'My new system' would mean you only need the dilo and a few more crop plots.

 

For example a dilo egg cooked with;

Rockcarrots tames an Anky

Citronal tames a Carno

Longrass tames a trike

Savoroot tames a sarco

*New seed 1* tames a stego

*New seed 2* tames an Argy.

 

Etc etc etc. That's one Dino in a kibble farm.

 

 

With this we will need much smaller kibble farms -which I feel is the biggest problem with the current system leading to high lag and tame caps - and farming gets a bit of rework to be more useful again.

 

 

 

 

 

 

That is quite a nice thought. Maybe not only use one species, but fewer everybody uses anyway, and depending on ingredients you can make different kibbles from one egg ?

The biggest problem I see though is the cap mechanism itself and hoarders with hundreds of dinos on different servers. They'd not give up their kibble farms even if they became useless, they'll just have yet more spaceholders. Noone is willing to give up tames on a capped server for some random noob to tame 5 dodos and then disappear forever, when having them really means to have something to kill and open a slot for you or an ally to be able to tame or breed. From what I've encountered, I'd go as far as to say that egg farms make up a way smaller percentage of "useless" dinos than spaceholders do. After full release, It took 2-3 months for the first set of WAY TOO FEW officials to be capped, when everybody played normally with no worries about cap. It took 3 weeks for the 2nd set of officials and even *FRESH* servers to be capped, where you couldn't even bring existing tames in, because people knew they were going to cap sooner or later and thus tamed spaceholders. This would not be necessary at all if cap weren't a thing in the first place, but there'd have to be something else to make sure servers don't get overburdened with tames and tribes.

[eESTlane]

i've been outspoken on this very subject for the last month or two. it's become a prominent issue thanks to the many tame capped pve topics emerging on this forum. i do believe sorting out the kibble system will release a few slots. once we have done that, we can start looking into breeding and its affects.

 

anyways, using wiki as reference, i count 54 recipes, 6 of them not working and only 64 kibble eating creatures. first of all, any suggestion that would even more increase the number of recipes will have to go. not very user friendly being forced to use wiki as a cheat. each one of those 64 dinos should have 2-3 kibble that gives max TE. i wouldn't mind if the most preferable took 15 bites and the alternatives took 25 feedings, as long as the result is the same. 

the "10/100 eggs into 1" sounds interesting and it could be used as 2x or higher rate substitute. meaning you don't have to rely on wc 2x taming events but can instead cook up a mega-kibble that does the same thing. fabulous in theory but it'll put even more pressure on large egg farms to produce. so i don't like it. plus, it would take "power" out of wc hands and they'd have to result to 3x events, just to impress us.

herbivores need some love too. crops have better TE than regular berries but they don't tame faster. they should. something should. remember, carnivores have regular meat > prime > mutton > kibble. "mutton" being the main culprit why herbivores are frowned upon. when scorched came out, i crop tamed doedics and ankies for over 6 hours. of course i blamed the stupid wc and their half arshed attempt. 2 years have since passed and how do you tame those dinos now?  

 

 

[CitoaK]

Remove egg requirements altogether. Advanced crops plus special meats/jerky for carnivores. Crops plus berry combos for herbivores. Say no to kibble farms!

[LLOYD0102]

How about only 2 kibble total. dodo kibble for herb dinos and dilo kibble for meat eaters. it will be a lot more simple that way and people can get rid of the farm dinos they never use/want

[mjax42]

Create new system of meat acquired with a new item "skinning knife" (or similar)

Replace each egg with specific meat, or jerky from new meat

This way, you will have to go hunting and seek our your prey to kill and slaughter to get new "raptor meat"

Then use new meat / jerky in lieu of eggs.

(New meat is only available from wild dinos to prevent meat farms)

 

Just my 2cp

 

[ishootpaint]

 It may have been mentioned on this thread already but the best idea ive seen so far is to just have small/medium/large egg classes.

 For example large animals like the giga could still use Q eggs for kib but it could also be bronto, diplo or rex eggs. Should cut down on egg farms massively IMO

[Aylana314159]

The s+ new vivarium structure is a great idea.

 

I long ago suggested a structure to sacrifice tames to for egg production. This would remove the tames from the world and dino count.

 

There could be an industrial and tek version with a few upgrade levels based on number of females sacrificed.

[Moonie1]

Get rid of all of the egg kibble for herbivores and use the extra crops from Primitive Plus. I can see Carnivores requiring eggs/meat but why herbivores. If you wanted to get rid of eggs completely, then make carnivores required different meats from an array of the wild dinos out there. Primitive Plus started to do this with Fresh Spare Ribs harvested off of Trikes.

[Corrigan]

1) Just lessen the amount of kibble you need by increasing effectiveness and decrease food consumption on knocked out Dino's so the taming time remains the same.  Let's see if that reduces everyone's desire to have like 1 male and five females of everything.

2) Make Meat specific to the dino that's killed in the wild and make it more rare to obtain than argy claws, etc. Substitute eggs for the specific dino meat in the recipe.

3)  Make the kibble tree have thresholds and remove egg specific kibble. All small Dino's recquire X amount of dodo eggs  or Dilo eggs. All Medium dinosaurs require X amount of dodo/dilo eggs AND trike eggs/Xyz eggs, etc. The threshold and tediousness of the tree is taming the dinosaurs that you otherwise normally tame WITHOUT kibble or require special taming methods. Add tiers of thresholds.  Mix and match Dino's in the thresholds. Having 10 Dino's per threshold as egg layers seems better than 5-6 of each dino. 

[Mattomatic94]

I understand with the current system, they try to make it more difficult/tedious to gain the ability to tame these stronger creatures. Problem is that when more and more creatures were introduced, the harder it was to keep a variety going. Now the trees make no sense and there's too many creatures to keep that variety going. I think kibble making should be treated the same as titanboa taming. Where any egg works, but better eggs yield better results. Simple as that.

[Rattasaur]

16 hours ago, Echion said:

In the current setting you tame a dilo to get the Anky, to get the Carno, to get trike, to get the sarco, to get the stego, to get the Argy you wanted.

That's at least 6 Dino's in a kibble farm to get an Argy.

 

 

 

 

 

Why cant you just tame a low lvl stego to get eggs for kibble?

Does the lvl or stats at taming of the female who lays the egg make a difference?

[GoreGuts1]

All the dinos should drop the the kibble they make when you kill them or even a chance to drop.

[Corrigan]

4 hours ago, Rattasaur said:

Why cant you just tame a low lvl stego to get eggs for kibble?

Does the lvl or stats at taming of the female who lays the egg make a difference?

I'm Not sure if that's a statement or a question. If it's a question, no, an egg is an egg. A level 20 steggo will lay an egg just as much as a lvl 150 and so the levels of the egg layers do not matter. It's far too common for players to skip tiers of Dino's in the kibble tree by taming low level egg layers just below the desired dino on the kibble tree. For example I Prime time low level female meglos as egg layers to make kibble for therizinos. I do not tame XYZ just to get kibble for meglos in order to tame theriznos.

However even still, my egg farm is huge despite me skipping tiers of Dino's in the tree.

If anything your statement/question proposes a good solution. Higher level female tames should lay eggs more often or in quantities of x2, x3, x4, or even x5 at lvl 145+. 

To be honest I don't mind the kibble tree or having an egg farm, I just dislike that I feel like I need so many egg layers at first in order to tame things in due time. I'm not trying to wait a month off 1-3 egg layers for enough eggs to make 40 kibble, for example. I will however tame ONLY 2 higher level dinos so I can generate enough eggs/kibble in a reasonable amount of time; given my proposed system above is in play. 

People don't want to kill off their tames unless they have to sue to reaching the tribes tame cap. Therefore if their going to keep this system then they need to give us a reason to not need to tame more than 1-2 female egg layers for any dino, and my proposed system does seem to support that. Idk..

The only counter argument I can think of is that, well, if it's easier to tame many low level egg layers for a X1 quantity then why would I want to tame 1-2 higher level female egg layers for a x3-x5 quantity? The only solution I can think of at the top of my head would require a long explanation that I know WC won't even bother reading so I'm going to spare myself typing for 10 more minutes.

 

 

 

[Jonathanasger]

I think the best solution would be a complete rework that made it so dinos dont want THAT much kibble to begin with. And the kibble that you do need should be fun to get, and not just egg farm grind.

 

With that bein said, a simple solution could be make three (maybe more) kibble lines that somehow reflect the tier of the dinos and the challenge to actually tame them.

Right now yoy can easily get a ptera (level 34 saddle) within the first few hours, using dodo eggs. That is 2EZ.

 

My proposal is thw following kibble structure:

Dodo --> Dilo --> Parasaur --> Trike --> Raptor --> Stego --> Argent --> Carno --> you get the idea. 

Each dinos produced kibble tames something a little harder. Nw this could make more sense if one were to make several lines.

Birds:

Dodo --> Dimorphodon --> Hespergonis  --> Microraptor --> Pteranodon --> Argent --> Tapejara --> Quetz 

Herbivores:

Lystro --> Parasaur --> Trike --> Stego --> Iguanodon --> Diplodocus --> Bronto

Carnivores:

Compy --> Dilo --> Raptor --> Carno --> Allosaurus --> Rex --> Giga

Weird swamp creatures:

Titanoboa --> Kaprosuchus --> Sarco 

Mammals: (not eggs, but milk)

Sabertooth --> Direwolf --> Direbear --> Chalico --> Megatherium -->

 

This ofc is just examples. But you get the idea.

[DESTROYER]

A bit off topic but I think herbivores deserve something special like how carnivores have different grade meat the herbivores deserve some love.

Possibly a high quality fertiliser that's a bit costly but produces higher quality veggies.

Maybe a fresh from the garden effect so the fresher more flavorful veggies would have better taming effectiveness.

Or just give every herbivore the chance to be passive tamed and make it more effective.

And last idea for now add rare fruit that can be harvested from tree's that have a somewhat better taming effectiveness.

[HiImZech]

I think the rework should be made to put all and any eggs to form kibble, and the amount of kibble produced varies with the egg used.

like 3 dodo egg to make a kibble

a rex egg can make 2 kibble

giga egg can make 6 kibble

 

the kibble needed to tame a dino should increase to a fair point, like 100 kibble for a 150 rex or something

if kibble becomes a common item to make and get then we should also be aware there will be more reports of servers reaching the tame cap, and that's not the best thing to face.

so on top of just eggs for kibble we might need to have some kind of rarer item in each kibble making session. so...maybe like...you need pearls to make kibble? pearls are technically edible if its in powder form :p

[DanOWar]

Get rid of it and have the corresponding food do as much as the kibble did.

Yeah, it's casualization, but this is a game where it can take up to half a day in real time just to tame pixels. Think about that.

[ZyraSeedling]

I don't like the idea of removing eggs from kibble recipes entirely, as a kibble should need egg to act as a binder.

Maybe spilt these eggs into size classifications based on weight (tiny, small, med, large, xlarge).

Add more plants to the base game (primitive plus already has a bunch, and maybe a couple cannot be garden grown, only wild) and maybe some different meats. Use more than one sometimes (2 different plants or 2 different meats)

Use honey in a couple recipies.

Add salt to all maps.

Then make recipes that require a blend of different things according to the animal and their size. meat in recipes for carnivores and only plants in herbivore kibble. Omnivores can have a mix. Label them as flavors: savory, spicy, bland, etc

Raptor might eat kibble that has a 3 basic meat+2basil+2 small eggs+1 salt+fiber+water

 

Bronto might eat kibble that has a few different berries or spice plants+ 1 large egg+1honey+fiber+water. 

 

With more plants and meats available and utilizing other edible items in game you can mix things up to make many recipies.

[Everybody]

Eggs are now parts of grops that produce one kibble

 

E.x. Dodo egg, hespa egg, argy egg, featherlight egg ect. = bird egg kibble

dilo egg, trodon egg, oviraptor egg, ect. = small dino kibble

raptor egg, iguana egg, pterandon egg, pachy egg, ect. = medium dino kibble

carno egg, trike egg, anky egg, stego egg, ect. = medium-large dino kibble

rex egg, giga egg, bronto egg, therizino egg, aloo egg ect. = large dino kibble

araneo egg, mantis egg, althropleura egg ect. = insect egg

titanoboa egg, sarco egg, kentro egg ect. = lizhard egg

special kibbles not part of groups (for specific dinos):

wyvern egg kibble (lightning/ice/fire/poison)

golden hespa egg kibble

Rockdrake egg kibble

Ect.

 

This would reduce lag, as less kibble farms, while some dinos get more usage, also fixes things like ”abby megalo need ovirap kibble but no abby ovirap”