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Upcoming Tribe Size Limit?


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Just now, Inigo said:

Welp

Definition of tribe

1a : a social group comprising numerous families, clans, or generations together with slaves, dependents, or adopted strangers

I'm not sure how you're going to get a Tribe out of 5-10 people. It's realistically not a Tribe at that point, or one that's about to be extinct. 

The realistic problem with this whole scenario is Devs pandering to small groups crying about Megatribes. 

 

 

This will not be an across the board change based on what I read on twitter. It will be a specialty case at first that may later turn into its own cluster according to Jat. This is just ark giving people with a different preference of play style the ability to enjoy the game as well. If you are a fan of the current mega tribe play style then you will be fine staying in your current situation while those that are not will leave to the specialty servers. It's ok for everyone to have different ways that they want to play, and to be honest ark needs to do something since it is having a massive exodus of players on official pvp due to a common complaint of megatribes, cheats, and glitches. All 3 of those need to be addressed equally or else the downward trend will continue. 

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Guest DJRone89
31 minutes ago, Inigo said:

Welp

Definition of tribe

1a : a social group comprising numerous families, clans, or generations together with slaves, dependents, or adopted strangers

I'm not sure how you're going to get a Tribe out of 5-10 people. It's realistically not a Tribe at that point, or one that's about to be extinct. 

The realistic problem with this whole scenario is Devs pandering to small groups crying about Megatribes. 

ABOUT THIS GAME

As a man or woman stranded naked, freezing and starving on the shores of a mysterious island called ARK, you must hunt, harvest resources, craft items, grow crops, research technologies, and build shelters to withstand the elements. Use your cunning and resources to kill or tame & breed the leviathan dinosaurs and other primeval creatures roaming the land, and team up with or prey on hundreds of other players to survive, dominate... and escape!

So how is it, a game that literally markets itself and to it's players about being cunning, teaming up with or preying upon hundreds of other players, suddenly wants to shift to some communist level garbage? Make the game more fair by limit your tribe sizes from hundreds to a mere handful so everyone is equal?? You're not a tribe at that point, there wont be the "tribal warfare" that was marketed, or that has been a constant in the game since EA release. That's quarreling neighbors at that point.

And sorry to burst the bubble here, you can't put a limit on cunning, even if you did limit tribes, they'd still team up in the hundreds anyway.

Reading comprehension sure is difficult on this thread. Keep taking everything out of context.

I look forward to a good laugh.

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Guest DJRone89
1 minute ago, MandaBear said:

This will not be an across the board change based on what I read on twitter. It will be a specialty case at first that may later turn into its own cluster according to Jat. This is just ark giving people with a different preference of play style the ability to enjoy the game as well. If you are a fan of the current mega tribe play style then you will be fine staying in your current situation while those that are not will leave to the specialty servers. It's ok for everyone to have different ways that they want to play, and to be honest ark needs to do something since it is having a massive exodus of players on official pvp due to a common complaint of megatribes, cheats, and glitches. All 3 of those need to be addressed equally or else the downward trend will continue. 

You’re talking to an echo chamber at this point.

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Just now, DJRone89 said:

You’re talking to an echo chamber at this point.

A lot of the over reacting would be put in check if @ForzaProiettile would include the comments on KISHKO's post where Jat said it was for specialty. Most people are not going to read that on page 3 and are within their right to be nervous if they think this will break apart their already established tribes. I feel bad because I would have been the same back when I was playing if I heard our tribe was about to be broken down after all of the hard work we put in together. Nobody wants to have hundreds of hours wiped with the flick of a switch, and breaking up the tribes would do just that. lol it would put the servers into mass chaos since a lot of the megas would quickly discover that their members don't have as much devotion as they think they do. ?

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19 minutes ago, DJRone89 said:

Reading comprehension sure is difficult on this thread. Keep taking everything out of context.

I look forward to a good laugh.

 

8 minutes ago, MandaBear said:

A lot of the over reacting would be put in check if @ForzaProiettile would include the comments on KISHKO's post where Jat said it was for specialty. Most people are not going to read that on page 3 and are within their right to be nervous if they think this will break apart their already established tribes. I feel bad because I would have been the same back when I was playing if I heard our tribe was about to be broken down after all of the hard work we put in together. Nobody wants to have hundreds of hours wiped with the flick of a switch, and breaking up the tribes would do just that. lol it would put the servers into mass chaos since a lot of the megas would quickly discover that their members don't have as much devotion as they think they do. ?

Speaking of reading comprehension, at no point did Jat OFFICIALLY say it was ONLY going to be for specialty servers, only that they were CONSIDERING it for specialty servers in an offhand comment. And at no point did JEN say it was for ANY type of server at all, other than doing a broad poll on preferred tribe limit sizes. And since Official Servers are well the OFFICIAL SERVERS it can generally be taken that any ideas they are considering are for Official Servers. Thus people are unhappy about this because anyone on an Official Server can be impacted by this.

 

22 minutes ago, MandaBear said:

This will not be an across the board change based on what I read on twitter. It will be a specialty case at first that may later turn into its own cluster according to Jat. This is just ark giving people with a different preference of play style the ability to enjoy the game as well. If you are a fan of the current mega tribe play style then you will be fine staying in your current situation while those that are not will leave to the specialty servers. It's ok for everyone to have different ways that they want to play, and to be honest ark needs to do something since it is having a massive exodus of players on official pvp due to a common complaint of megatribes, cheats, and glitches. All 3 of those need to be addressed equally or else the downward trend will continue. 

Now onto this common complaints of megatribes, cheats and glitches, are a very interconnected web for those of you who have not been part of an Alpha tribe or later a Megatribe and participated in actual constant 24/7 tribal warfare. Pre-Server transfers, servers still fought one another, sneaking onto servers at level 1, and building secret huts, grinding out rockets, grenades, c4 in hidden little 3x1 shacks until you had hidden an amassed enough mats and gear, then you called in buddies and hordes of lvl 1-10's wiped Alphas. Duping wasnt very prominent during this time period or aimbotting. It had been done and most of those were fixed, *most* not all. But because there were no mega-tribes and it was a very closed information system back then, it wasnt a wide spread problem.

Your average alpha was anywhere between 10-30+ people easy on a server. When server transfers opened up it forced tribes to beef themselves up to survive, and that was when you started seeing 35+ Alpha tribes, as medium and large tribes on a server often started merging in order to survive the constant griefers coming in. This worked well enough for like a week, when people could actually defend themselves, until the chinese started pushing into the US and EU servers backed by 3-4+ servers, many servers got wiped, and the only defense after that was to make allies and friends and defense/raid networks. soon it was pretty common to have 5+ servers alpha tribes working together, and before too long it bloomed to 10+ and more.

That's a pretty natural progression, no single tribe is really 600+ members, it's a pretty loose coalition of tribes of 35-60 members that each dominate their own server, it's really not a whole lot different than NATO, or any other real world Alliance.

The problem inherently with cheating in ARK that drives the Mega-tribe AKA Coalition Alliances, is that once one side started duping, the other side would have to as well or they would lose out via not being able to compete resource wise. Now for those tribes that were strictly against that, I applaud them, mine was too, and we eventually got wiped out, can't out compete people when you kill a dino with the same ID over and over again, and no matter how well you defend, and win and win and win, eventually you run out of resources and lose. The problem is, even those tribes strictly against cheating still get banned for fighting with their coalition by getting caught up in blanket bans when getting called in to fight on a server, you show up, join a tribe, and suddenly banned for being there. This happened to a lot of people. 

All these blanket bans lost the game players that were actually legit, more who werent banned quit the game, you cant win playing honestly, and you can get banned because the Devs *think* 1 person cheated and tribeban everyone. BOOM exodus of players. Constant cheating? Well yeah you get a whole lot of people leaving over that too, so lost players there. Bugs, poorly optimized gameplay? Sure you're gonna lose players to that too.

So all in all, the general response from Devs for a long time has been, "Look we're busy pushing new content, just ban them all". The advent of ALL this new content they have been pushing for so long, while nice, overlays the entire problem and adds to it.

Coding a game this big is built up in layers, the problem with the day 1 bugs and dupe methods that are persistently referred to, are problems that were known to the devs ages ago and IGNORED in spite of pushing content and rushing to deploy Scorched Earth, the Server transfer system, which only added more ways to dupe and cheat. The foundation of the game is the problem, they built over so many issues and made new ones, which they again built over. Some of these bugs and exploits these mega-tribes use are so deeply ingrained into the game, they would have to rework massive portions of the game to fix them. 

And that takes time. Time they could be spending pushing new content to draw in more players or paid DLC, which at the end of the day is their bottom line, which is what really matters.

Band-aid fixes, like Tribe size limits, alliance limits, massive nerfs etc are temp fixes to combat the massive scale duping that is so heavily abused in mega-tribe warfare. They don't fix any of the underlying issues, and won't solve the problem. 

 

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@Inigo Yea you can pipe down with the insults. I'm not the one saying you have reading comprehension issues. But I am going to be the one stating that after that type of response from you, this conversation will not be continuing any further between you and I. There is no reason to act like that over someone telling you to calm down and trying to show proof of why you should not worry.

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15 minutes ago, MandaBear said:

@Inigo Yea you can pipe down with the insults. I'm not the one saying you have reading comprehension issues. But I am going to be the one stating that after that type of response from you, this conversation will not be continuing any further between you and I. There is no reason to act like that over someone telling you to calm down and trying to show proof of why you should not worry.

I'm sorry you have that misperception. 

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Y'know, if people can't hold a civil discourse about these topics without devolving to insults, then maybe we shouldn't be having discussions about these topics in the first place.

Furthermore, just because we stated that we're considering this for specialty servers does not default that statement to mean that we plan to apply it to official servers. It simply means that it's an idea being thought of for specialty servers.

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