Trolling is not Griefing

[GraveBane]

people who troll and grief on a game would troll and grief in real live if they could do it anomalously with no repercussions. the type of person who enjoys pooping on other people for fun is the type of person that enjoys pooping on other people for fun. its just in real life their are real consequences for their actions and they don;t have the cajones. with laws and cops to enforce those laws, you will never be the alpha tribe, you follow the law or alpha tribe throws you in jail. 

[Elliebird]

4 minutes ago, GraveBane said:

people who troll and grief on a game would troll and grief in real live if they could do it anomalously with no repercussions. the type of person who enjoys pooping on other people for fun is the type of person that enjoys pooping on other people for fun. its just in real life their are real consequences for their actions and they don;t have the cajones. with laws and cops to enforce those laws, you will never be the alpha tribe, you follow the law or alpha tribe throws you in jail. 

I disagree entirely.

Like I said in my post, the reason not to shoot someone in the face is because they'd die. Whether or not WE get punished for shooting them, there is an effect to our action- The person is dead. Their life is gone, their loved ones will grieve, all their potential gets tossed out. I am fine with shooting someone in the face in a video game. I am NOT fine with shooting them in the face in real life, even if I could get away with it without any potential punishment to myself. It's not a law that is telling me not to shoot somebody, it's my own moral code and ethics.

I will poop on you in Ark. I will not poop on you in real life. Real poop is disgusting and dumping that on someone's face is way out of line (unless that's their thing, y'know).
 

[GraveBane]

 

2 minutes ago, Elliebird said:

I disagree entirely.

Like I said in my post, the reason not to shoot someone in the face is because they'd die. Whether or not WE get punished for shooting them, there is an effect to our action- The person is dead. Their life is gone, their loved ones will grieve, all their potential gets tossed out. I am fine with shooting someone in the face in a video game. I am NOT fine with shooting them in the face in real life, even if I could get away with it without any potential punishment to myself. It's not a law that is telling me not to shoot somebody, it's my own moral code and ethics.

I will poop on you in Ark. I will not poop on you in real life. Real poop is disgusting and dumping that on someone's face is way out of line (unless that's their thing, y'know).
 

and the type of person that gets off on causing other people grief really won't care about any of that. I mean really whats it matter to you if someone else is dead if you got all their stuff? I mean people kill other people just for whats in their pockets thousands of times a year in america, so not even laws will stop some people from doing it. I troll people, I troll them in games, I troll them in real life. I'm a smartbutt and I like to mess with people, in the old days we would call it being a prankster, now its called trolling. I have no interest in griefing though.

[Logan96]

6 minutes ago, Elliebird said:

I disagree entirely.

Like I said in my post, the reason not to shoot someone in the face is because they'd die. Whether or not WE get punished for shooting them, there is an effect to our action- The person is dead. Their life is gone, their loved ones will grieve, all their potential gets tossed out. I am fine with shooting someone in the face in a video game. I am NOT fine with shooting them in the face in real life, even if I could get away with it without any potential punishment to myself. It's not a law that is telling me not to shoot somebody, it's my own moral code and ethics.

I will poop on you in Ark. I will not poop on you in real life. Real poop is disgusting and dumping that on someone's face is way out of line (unless that's their thing, y'know).
 

I can see your point but would you agree that the griefer while they may not be that extreme in real life, their own personal ethics have a good chance of being lower than that of the friendly player?

[Elliebird]

3 minutes ago, GraveBane said:

 

and the type of person that gets off on causing other people grief really won't care about any of that. I mean really whats it matter to you if someone else is dead if you got all their stuff? I mean people kill other people just for whats in their pockets thousands of times a year in america, so not even laws will stop some people from doing it. I troll people, I troll them in games, I troll them in real life. I'm a smartbutt and I like to mess with people, in the old days we would call it being a prankster, now its called trolling. I have no interest in griefing though.

The type of person that gets off on causing people won't care, no. That's not who we are discussing though. The point is that trolling or griefing in a video game doesn't automatically make you the kind of person to be fine and happy with causing mayhem in real life. If you mess with people in real life, you likely won't have a problem messing with them in a game. If you mess with people in a game, that isn't as likely to mean that you mess with people in real life.

 

[Logan96]

2 minutes ago, GraveBane said:

 

and the type of person that gets off on causing other people grief really won't care about any of that. I mean really whats it matter to you if someone else is dead if you got all their stuff? I mean people kill other people just for whats in their pockets thousands of times a year in america, so not even laws will stop some people from doing it. I troll people, I troll them in games, I troll them in real life. I'm a smartbutt and I like to mess with people, in the old days we would call it being a prankster, now its called trolling. I have no interest in griefing though.

I agree completely on the trolling aspect. There is ways to mess with people that is funny and ultimately harmless. Why that is not enough for some people on Ark I dont understand.

[GraveBane]

logan gets what I'm saying. griefers get off at pissing other people off. if there were no consequences, in real like they will piss other people off. maybe instead of killing you and takign your stuff, they just key your car, smash your windows, slash your tires, hack your computers. people who get off on pissing other people off get off on pissing other people off, that doesn't change between the real world and the game. its just griefing in the game is easy access with no repercussions. 

[Logan96]

But to be honest the pooping on people in ark is one of the less harmless ways to troll lol

[Elliebird]

1 minute ago, Logan96 said:

I can see your point but would you agree that the griefer while they may not be that extreme in real life, their own personal ethics have a good chance of being lower than that of the friendly player?

It would honestly depend on the situation.

[GraveBane]

1 minute ago, Logan96 said:

But to be honest the pooping on people in ark is one of the less harmless ways to troll lol

lol I was trying to use a family friendly term we use for doing someone wrong to just to piss them off. pooping on them is the closest I could come lol.

[Logan96]

3 minutes ago, Elliebird said:

It would honestly depend on the situation.

Let's say the person with a giga who enjoys eating starter stone bases vs the person who enjoys putting a trip wire alarm on in front of a door to scare them when they come out.

Do you think that I can at least judge whether or not one person is more friendly than the other in real life?

3 minutes ago, GraveBane said:

lol I was trying to use a family friendly term we use for doing someone wrong to just to piss them off. pooping on them is the closest I could come lol.

Ohhhhhhh now I understand lol

[OttoGrunf]

On 3/8/2018 at 4:00 PM, Logan96 said:

The title says it all. Lately I've been seeing youtube videos on ark with titles like "trolling server whatever" or something similar and when I click on it all I see are people killing passives and destroying important structures like grinders and forges. 

What happened to trolling being funny and creative? Try sneaking up on someones house and painting it a random color, or putting bear traps around their base. Maybe even drop some aggressive dodos into their base.

Long story short I think that players are being overly aggressive to eachother on the ark because some youtube video they watched convinced them that the best way to troll is to grief. thoughts?

making small pranks like knocking out people with electric rod when they didnt expect it but leaving a valuable sorry gift like real good item = trolling

wrecking people, bases and tames for no other reason but for fun = griefing

its simple as that

[LouSpowells]

I recommend that folks read at least a small selection of the vast collection of scientific and psychological studies, journals, and reviews on this topic rather than presuming the connections between violence in video games and the likelihood of video game violent actions being carried through into real life. There's a lot of info out there that would spare a lot of folks from needing to use their creative imaginations.

 

[Logan96]

4 minutes ago, LouSpowells said:

I recommend that folks read at least a small selection of the vast collection of scientific and psychological studies, journals, and reviews on this topic rather than presuming. 

 

I'd like hear your own thoughts and/or findings on the subject if you have read these vast collections. Share what you know if you would be so kind.

[LouSpowells]

53 minutes ago, Logan96 said:

I'd like hear your own thoughts and/or findings on the subject if you have read these vast collections. Share what you know if you would be so kind.

My personal thoughts/feelings on the subject are reflective of mental health professionals around the world: In individuals with stable mental health, actions taken in a violent video game are not reflective of actions they would take in the real world. 

There are plenty of places to learn more, but the APA is literally the most qualified place to start. I have neither the time nor patience to share what I know about psychology as it relates to video game players anywhere within earshot of this or any other video game forum. 

 

As for your original point, trolling and griefing are subjective words. Most people getting trolled think they're being griefed. Most people doing the griefing think they're trolling. 

 

[RipRavage]

3 hours ago, Elliebird said:

I disagree with the idea that Ark is any indication of how people will behave in reality. I disagree that video games in general are a good indication of how people will behave, or people's personalities, or anything of the sort.

If I go up to somebody in Ark, shoot them in the face, kill all their dinos, steal their things and destroy their base, that does not mean I'm going to go up to someone in real life, murder them, kill their pets, rob them blind and then burn their house down. I do not equate 1s and 0s to a real person's life. I don't equate dinos to real animals. I don't equate virtual property to real property. As many of you already know, the reason we choose not to do something is often because of that lovely word, consequences.

For instance, shooting someone in the face is bad because it would hurt or kill them. It's not because the action is bad, it's because the result of the action is bad.

I play PvE, so the more destructive aspect of the game isn't something that I touch. But if someone trolls or griefs you in a video game, that's no reason to think that they'd cause you actual harm in the real world, where the consequences DO matter. Are there people out there who would? Absolutely. But they have always been the minority. They have always been the exception, not the rule. We live in a world with over 7 billion people now, if the majority of us were crazy, we'd already be gone.

TL;DR: Don't judge a person on how they act on a video game, 'cause more than likely that's not how they are in real life, where things actually matter.

Buddy I’m not judging people based on my experience with them in ARK, I’m basing my opinion of human beings on the way people have reacted historically.  ARK and other online survival games are mini societies and more often then not people act the same way humans did historically to adversity, ruthlessly.  Of course you aren’t going to run out and murder somebody in real life, but there are other factors like your fear of the law and societal comfort that prevent that.  Keep in mind though that you are rationalizing destroying hours, days, maybe even weeks of a persons hard work when you wipe them, that gives them anguish. I am in no way condemning anybody I am just stating that humans can do really nasty things when they have no fear of repercussions or guilt.  Yes it is just a game, but that doesn’t mean your character isn’t reflected slightly by the way you act.

[AlphaPrime01]

Griefing can be bannable? idfk, i dont 'understand' ark PVP and i dont understand what anyone thats playing PVP has got any right to bitch about anything. your playing a game mode that literally the difference is "my stuff can be killed or destroyed by other people" vs PVE is "my stuff cannot be destroyed by other people" PVP is PVP is PVP not PVE-sometimes-P /shrug

[Logan96]

15 hours ago, AlphaPrime01 said:

Griefing can be bannable? idfk, i dont 'understand' ark PVP and i dont understand what anyone thats playing PVP has got any right to bitch about anything. your playing a game mode that literally the difference is "my stuff can be killed or destroyed by other people" vs PVE is "my stuff cannot be destroyed by other people" PVP is PVP is PVP not PVE-sometimes-P /shrug

I think there is a common theme with players immediatley assuming that a post about a concern is the same as complaining. I've already stated that I enjoy this aspect of the game and I merely want to see more players use their head and be creative. The first step is raising awareness to the issue thats been brought up in the very first post I made.

 

17 hours ago, LouSpowells said:

As for your original point, trolling and griefing are subjective words. Most people getting trolled think they're being griefed. Most people doing the griefing think they're trolling. 

This seems to be the common belief. I still disagree that they are actually subjective terms outside of their exact definitions. My standing now is that players who are actively griefing hide behind the term trolling to help give justification to their actions. Whenever I personally troll somebody I don't think that they have any grief either. Maybe at first but once they realize that they aren't suffering a setback they seem to chill out.

[Cullis]

On 08/03/2018 at 5:08 PM, RipRavage said:

Online video games perfectly sum up how humans would most likely react in a real life survival / post-apocalyptic scenario.  Most people are pieces of garbage, and when there is no law to tell them otherwise they are going to do some horrible stuff.  They will use the blah blah excuse of "THIS IS WHAT I MUST DO TO STAY ALPHA" or "SURVIVAL OF THE FITTEST" but the truth is that most humans are pieces of crap that enjoy taking their angst out on weaker people.  Survival games always foster environments of mistrust since human nature inevitably leads to an act of betrayal, everybody tries to be the first person to either plunge a knife into the others persons back or shoot them right between the eyes.  People blowing up forges or offline griefing are just the angry small fries that couldn't convince a pack of 12 year olds to zerg for them.

Calm down Thomas Hobbes. Alpha-tribe apologia isn't that popular here.

[RipRavage]

4 hours ago, Cullis said:

Calm down Thomas Hobbes. Alpha-tribe apologia isn't that popular here.

Lol, we were having a discussion about the psychology of players actions, motivations as to why do they troll.  Would you rather have me post about how poorly coded the game is like I usually do?  And thank you, I’m happy to be compared to a great philosopher like Thomas Hobbes.

[vowels]

The only trolling/griefing I do is ... using smoke grenades, throwing 300 whiteglowsticks into a base and then using fireworks flares  

[DESTROYER]

I remember trolling a friend over a year ago he had a white dire wolf named ghost so through the span of a week I found tamed and levelled a new identical wolf until it was the same lvl it took some time as I didn't want him to know I had another wolf.

 

Then when I had the chance I found a hiding spot for ghost and renamed the recently tamed wolf ghost then told him that I'm going on a cave run with his dire wolf once I entered the cave I let myself get killed and made a bug fuss and soon after ghost died.

 

It was hilarious after 15 minutes I let him know that ghost is safe and alive.

[Logan96]

6 hours ago, vowels said:

The only trolling/griefing I do is ... using smoke grenades, throwing 300 whiteglowsticks into a base and then using fireworks flares  

Props to you! Glad to see somebody has class lol

[Logan96]

6 hours ago, DESTROYER said:

I remember trolling a friend over a year ago he had a white dire wolf named ghost so through the span of a week I found tamed and levelled a new identical wolf until it was the same lvl it took some time as I didn't want him to know I had another wolf.

 

Then when I had the chance I found a hiding spot for ghost and renamed the recently tamed wolf ghost then told him that I'm going on a cave run with his dire wolf once I entered the cave I let myself get killed and made a bug fuss and soon after ghost died.

 

It was hilarious after 15 minutes I let him know that ghost is safe and alive.

 thats genius! Knowing my luck, my tribe would've opened the dino gates and whistled aggressive with everything set to wander in retalliation lol

[Dodowhisperer]

This whole game is about being trolls/griefers aka assholes. Even on pve servers theirs pillar spam all over. On the official pvp server I play on there’s a tribe with swastika turret towers and the GMs still have not wiped them despite the server being hosted in Berlin.  Want a decent experience sans no life trolls? Play on private servers.