v278 Giga enrage mechanic changes

[Jacira]

On 10/02/2018 at 11:41 AM, edskelly said:

What i saw was many many many wasted hours.I have 100% imprinted 8 Gigas, 3 which were done on 1X at 4 hour imprinting.

Now that the patch is out, do you mind doing the community a favour and taking one of those 100% imprinted gigas and try to kill a wild giga or titan with it please?

Looking for someone to report back how bad it is before I risk the neck of my one and only giga I'll ever 100% imprint because I'm a responsible adult that works to pay bills so they can keep a roof over their head in order to keep playing not just Ark, but every other game I will inevitably move on to because if it's as bad as it sounds. I'm done with this disgusting waste of time of a game.

[edskelly]

8 hours ago, edskelly said:

With the patch going live I went and tested the new enrage mechanic against a Titan and Wild Giga. I used a 100% imprinted 345 base damage Giga leveled to 656 damage wearing a 117.5 saddle.

Fighting both the Titan and a level 20 wild Giga the enrage bar never got beyond about 15-20%. Given how wild gigas damage works and how a low level basicly does the same damage as a high level one I do not see this changing much even if it was a 150. I will however test it more as higher level ones spawn.

@Jacira I already have mate,you might of missed this post near the bottom of page 2

 

[edskelly]

I just just killed another wild giga (level 35) and another titan.

Again the enrage bar didnt get above about 10%.Nothing like when they were bugged a couple of months ago.

[Jacira]

45 minutes ago, edskelly said:

@Jacira I already have mate,you might of missed this post near the bottom of page 2

 

I don't read a lot, thanks for clearing that up... mate.

[Blazedkillerz1]

With one of the longest Dinos to raise this new update makes it to where raising gigas is almost pointless.  While i don't disagree that gigas should be nerfed in some form or another like lowering melee and health by 10-15% or more. But this is insane 128% Asc Giga Saddles over 500+ melee in a 8vs5 giga fight and over half of our gigas in rage within two or three bites during our raid attempt. You guys have made it pointless for Good high level saddles with Nice imprints and 2 week babies. To not even try with them anymore. You guys have Over nerfed something that wasn't that broken.

[Sphere]

The joys of unofficial.

[DarthaNyan]

called it:

On 2/8/2018 at 12:38 PM, DarthaNyan said:

And will be pretty much perma-raging during raids.

That result was pretty obvious ever since they announced rage mechanic change:

rage meter that fills based on pure damage received without taking into account any external defensive boosts (mate-boost, yuty buff, rider's buff, saddle), but devs forgot that these same buff types can provide offensive boost for opponent. This creates situation where resulting "pure" boosted damage is way too big for giga to handle.

Proper way would have been to just ignore armor from saddle since other buffs (almost, slightly in favor of defense) cancel each other out in case both engaging parties have them.

[Blazedkillerz1]

1 hour ago, DarthaNyan said:

called it:

That result was pretty obvious ever since they announced rage mechanic change:

rage meter that fills based on pure damage received without taking into account any external defensive boosts (mate-boost, yuty buff, rider's buff, saddle), but devs forgot that these same buff types can provide offensive boost for opponent. This creates situation where resulting "pure" boosted damage is way too big for giga to handle.

Proper way would have been to just ignore armor from saddle since other buffs (almost, slightly in favor of defense) cancel each other out in case both engaging parties have them.

I mean yeah that would have worked to. Like you said in a full on raid like we where in With Yuty Buffs, Mate Boosted and 97% imprint i couldn't even see my rage meter build up before i got knocked off of it and it ate me. I get the concept of what they where trying to achieve. With the Nerfs of Brontos, Paracers, and Stegos Nerfing the Giga had to in some way compensate and make it weaker. The way they did it though makes A giga absolutely Useless other then doing meat runs to feed dinos. I hope they can find some Balance and make changes to the gigas so they aren't completely trash and a waste of time. If not i have 100+ gigas that will just be fodder.  

[Doth]

To nerf something in game design you don't nerf strengths. You are supposed to make weaknesses even weaker. I'm not saying they didn't go overboard but I think it's the right direction. I think any damage reduction should count like imprint and yuty but not the saddle.

[AndrewLB]

3 hours ago, Blazedkillerz1 said:

With one of the longest Dinos to raise this new update makes it to where raising gigas is almost pointless.  While i don't disagree that gigas should be nerfed in some form or another like lowering melee and health by 10-15% or more. But this is insane 128% Asc Giga Saddles over 500+ melee in a 8vs5 giga fight and over half of our gigas in rage within two or three bites during our raid attempt. You guys have made it pointless for Good high level saddles with Nice imprints and 2 week babies. To not even try with them anymore. You guys have Over nerfed something that wasn't that broken.

 

Why do you agree that they should be nerfed further? Sounds like you're just jumping on the bandwagon, because if you had any concept of how bad gigas have already been screwed over, you may re-think it.

 

When gigas were released, wild had approx 330,000 health and once tamed about 117,000. They've reduced base dmg from 1200 to now i believe 400 or 480. Yet you guys want it nerfed more... /smh

[Lockjaw]

40 minutes ago, AndrewLB said:

When gigas were released, wild had approx 330,000 health and once tamed about 117,000. They've reduced base dmg from 1200 to now i believe 400 or 480. Yet you guys want it nerfed more... /smh

Why are you shaking your head at that instead of the fact that they started out so ridiculous in the first place? By that logic they could have introduced seagulls with 1,000,000 health and 500,000 damage per attack, then lowered it down to 250,000 health and 100,000 damage per attack and said "The poor seagulls have been nerfed enough. We need to just leave them alone now because after such a harsh nerf they must be balanced enough."

[THESHREKONING]

2 hours ago, Lockjaw said:

Why are you shaking your head at that instead of the fact that they started out so ridiculous in the first place? By that logic they could have introduced seagulls with 1,000,000 health and 500,000 damage per attack, then lowered it down to 250,000 health and 100,000 damage per attack and said "The poor seagulls have been nerfed enough. We need to just leave them alone now because after such a harsh nerf they must be balanced enough."

The issue is, the giga is menat to be a capital beast of war, which means it whould be powerful and hard to take down, while a seagull is a seagull. There's literally no reason to have gigas now, a good wild tamed rex can have almost as much HP, decent damage, better speed and stam, better maneuverability, and has no rage mechanic.

[Blazedkillerz1]

8 hours ago, AndrewLB said:

 

Why do you agree that they should be nerfed further? Sounds like you're just jumping on the bandwagon, because if you had any concept of how bad gigas have already been screwed over, you may re-think it.

 

When gigas were released, wild had approx 330,000 health and once tamed about 117,000. They've reduced base dmg from 1200 to now i believe 400 or 480. Yet you guys want it nerfed more... /smh

Maybe you should learn to read better lol. I didn't say they should be nerfed more i said they needed to go another direction with how they did it.  I haven't been screwed over my gigas actually it's been the exact Opposite. What  i'm trying to say is they are now pretty much useless in a raid fight now.

 

7 hours ago, Lockjaw said:

Why are you shaking your head at that instead of the fact that they started out so ridiculous in the first place? By that logic they could have introduced seagulls with 1,000,000 health and 500,000 damage per attack, then lowered it down to 250,000 health and 100,000 damage per attack and said "The poor seagulls have been nerfed enough. We need to just leave them alone now because after such a harsh nerf they must be balanced enough."

 Gigas start out ridiculous in the first place was prob needed. When you have to stay up 28 hours to hand feed a giga and then takes another 12 days to raise it. That damn thing better mess something up.  Now you raise it for two weeks and spend the time and effort only to get Raged by two boss rexes that takes half of the time. Something wrong with that mechanic don't you think?

[Lockjaw]

Just to be clear, this is not the way that I would have balanced it. I would have hit the stats hard, and in return removed the killing his own rider mechanic and just let the rage be a damage buff with no drawbacks. Obviously Wildcard doesn't like my way of thinking (The Giga lover in the company probably hates me by now haha), but they do at least recognize that there has to be a trade-off somewhere. With great power comes a great balancing act.

6 hours ago, THESHREKONING said:

The issue is, the giga is menat to be a capital beast of war, which means it whould be powerful and hard to take down

But the same dossier that calls him a "capital beast of war" also says that he's a risky tame that will throw off his rider and eat his own tribe. Like I said, I would have scrapped the current design and given him a complete rework, but if you do want to go by the dossier then you have to go by the whole dossier. You can't cherry pick only the positive aspects of it.

6 hours ago, THESHREKONING said:

a good wild tamed rex can have ... better speed and stam

The Giga might look slower, but he actually walks faster than the Rex runs.

1 hour ago, Blazedkillerz1 said:

Gigas start out ridiculous in the first place was prob needed. When you have to stay up 28 hours to hand feed a giga and then takes another 12 days to raise it. That damn thing better mess something up.

There's a lot wrong with this reasoning, but one of the major problems with it is that it ignores the fact that breeding times are just one aspect in a very grindy game. What it really ends up coming down to is everyone saying "my time grinding is more important than your time grinding."

1 hour ago, Blazedkillerz1 said:

Now you raise it for two weeks and spend the time and effort only to get Raged by two boss rexes that takes half of the time. Something wrong with that mechanic don't you think?

Well, would you rather get raged by a couple Rexes that each took days to raise, or a couple rockets that might have been cooked up in a single afternoon? Also, as I said there's a lot more to the grind than just raising and imprinting. The overall time needed to create a boss-ready Rex is huge, a lot more than just a couple weeks.

 

TL;DR: This isn't how I want the Giga to be balanced, but if you want WC's vision of the Giga then you're getting not only obscene power but also a tame that will throw you off and eat you. You can't have your cake and eat it too.

[Ascendant]

Those asc giga saddle bp's are going to start collecting dust now, lol. 

[Bobo1234]

On 2/8/2018 at 7:21 AM, rororoxor said:

Maybe it encourages us to ACTUALLY let the giga rage.

Think about it. The giga is pretty ill-suited for a traveling mount (low stam, low mobility, etc). Wouldn't it be more efficient to let it follow a tamed flyer, or some other mobile land dino (like a thyla) which you will ride?

And afaik raged gigas won't turn around to attack you if they're already fighting something (ur just in the line of fire if you were riding one) so you should be OK, and also end up with a tougher giga.

Gigas take 11 days to raise on Official servers. You use them as essential DPS and to counteract pushes in raids. I am not spending 11 days of my life raising one to run it down mid. An enraged giga will not follow you and is as good as dead in a lot of cases. 

 

[Bobo1234]

9 hours ago, THESHREKONING said:

The issue is, the giga is menat to be a capital beast of war, which means it whould be powerful and hard to take down, while a seagull is a seagull. There's literally no reason to have gigas now, a good wild tamed rex can have almost as much HP, decent damage, better speed and stam, better maneuverability, and has no rage mechanic.

Gigas don't even work in lag. You can bite every 3 or so seconds during most raids. Biting any faster does not register. 

With all of the various nerfs to gigas, they are a shell of their former selves. A handful of auto turrets can enrage them now.

[Guest DJRone89]

Maybe the silent Giga nerf a few weeks back wasn’t a bug and was just to see what the communities reaction would be to this eventual change...

(Tinfoil hat wearing intensifies)

[THESHREKONING]

13 hours ago, DJRone89 said:

Maybe the silent Giga nerf a few weeks back wasn’t a bug and was just to see what the communities reaction would be to this eventual change...

(Tinfoil hat wearing intensifies)

Silent giga nerf? If yu're talking about how the rage mechanic had extreme sensitivity so that gigas got raged at the first hits from a god rex or titan, that was a glitch caused by the roll rat.

[Guest DJRone89]

1 hour ago, THESHREKONING said:

Silent giga nerf? If yu're talking about how the rage mechanic had extreme sensitivity so that gigas got raged at the first hits from a god rex or titan, that was a glitch caused by the roll rat.

Sigh. I thought the last part of my comment, tinfoil hat wearing intensifies, should have been a good enough indication that I was joking.

[Dudeydude420]

Well with gigas being garbage brontos paracers an stegos being nerfed turrets an many other things makes me wonder where this game is going. In my opinion they are tearing down the things that made this game good. Went on a raid this weekend lost 20+ gigas due to the new rage mechanics. Lots of time wasted for them do this. #Deathofark

[DarthaNyan]

6 minutes ago, Dudeydude420 said:

In my opinion they are tearing down the things that made this game good.

What was good about herds of bullet-soakers standing under thousands of turrets lagging servers to the point of mass disconnect/crash?

[Blazedkillerz1]

5 minutes ago, DarthaNyan said:

What was good about herds of bullet-soakers standing under thousands of turrets lagging servers to the point of mass disconnect/crash?

Whats the point of having Soakers that can't soak poop. Have you ever seen a mega tribe base? hundreds of turrets in on confined location.  You need an army of soakers to help spread that out. Nerfing them only means we now need more putting more strain on the server, causing disconnects/crashes. So your post makes no sense

[Dudeydude420]

Ddoss is still a thing dont know if you tried to raid since this patch not saying soaker nerf was bad can even live with hundred turrets but the gigas were a major thing now they are good for looks period

[Blazedkillerz1]

7 minutes ago, Dudeydude420 said:

Ddoss is still a thing dont know if you tried to raid since this patch not saying soaker nerf was bad can even live with hundred turrets but the gigas were a major thing now they are good for looks period

Couldn't agree more Gigas are now just a glorified animated trophy that can gather meat