Halcyon Posted February 8, 2018 Share Posted February 8, 2018 Now that cheat pollution on official launch servers is equal to that of legacy servers, and considering how most official launch servers are dino capped, why not bring legacy back into the official server cluster? This way legacy crowd don't get raptored with uncertainty, and the official launch crowd get to have new Dinos again. Win Win for everyone. Or at the very least, EVERYONE get's raptored equally, and players give Wildcard a one-time amnesty for having double standards. (i.e. slapping a death warrant on legacy servers because of cheaters... then forgiving cheaters on official launch 5 months later for an exploit known since August 2015.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iAmE Posted February 8, 2018 Share Posted February 8, 2018 The people on Legacy will still have huge advantages over those on the new servers. Plus it would create huge power vacuums between people who keep contacts/presence on both legacy/new servers. TLDR; Maybe if they decide to start closing down new servers due to inactivity, and release a new cluster, maybe. Otherwise probably a bad idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halcyon Posted February 8, 2018 Author Share Posted February 8, 2018 Legacy servers are mostly "reclaimed by the wild" now, not sprawling metropolises like they once were. Whatever superiority legacy once had, is now few and rare, but i think legacy poeple who have held out regardless of hopelessness have earned their superiority alone through the virtue of maintenance. It is no different from poeple who have started from the beginning of official, getting the best spots and maintaining that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iAmE Posted February 8, 2018 Share Posted February 8, 2018 13 minutes ago, Halcyon said: Legacy servers are mostly "reclaimed by the wild" now, not sprawling metropolises like they once were. Whatever superiority legacy once had, is now few and rare, but i think legacy poeple who have held out regardless of hopelessness have earned their superiority alone through the virtue of maintenance. It is no different from poeple who have started from the beginning of official, getting the best spots and maintaining that. No. They really aren't. Most of the "Large bases" maintained by some of us who remain on legacy, are built under the mesh because legacy was officially regarded as ruleless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halcyon Posted February 8, 2018 Author Share Posted February 8, 2018 41 minutes ago, iAmE said: No. They really aren't. Most of the "Large bases" maintained by some of us who remain on legacy, are built under the mesh because legacy was officially regarded as ruleless. Ah... that's unfortunate. Think I understand the situation then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ranger1 Posted February 8, 2018 Share Posted February 8, 2018 iAmE makes a valid point about Legacy servers, but one thing in the OP is inaccurate I believe. 1 hour ago, Halcyon said: exploit known since August 2015 If I understand the situation correctly, the ability to take advantage of the exploit was inadvertently introduced at that time. However, it wasn't really in widespread use until a few months ago... and WC wasn't made aware of it until just now. I know you probably didn't mean it that way, but you made it sound like it was in common usage (and WC was also aware of it being used) all that time. I'm only mentioning it because during turbulent times even unintentional blurring together of the facts can take on a life of its own, which only makes things more confusing for everyone. Other than that, I totally see where you are coming from were it not for the point iAmE made. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yster Posted February 8, 2018 Share Posted February 8, 2018 1 hour ago, Halcyon said: why not bring legacy back into the official server cluster? I honestly hope they NEVER consider this. If legacy server population are low, they can bring over the hardware as a new clean map.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halcyon Posted February 8, 2018 Author Share Posted February 8, 2018 23 minutes ago, Ranger1 said: iAmE makes a valid point about Legacy servers, but one thing in the OP is inaccurate I believe. If I understand the situation correctly, the ability to take advantage of the exploit was inadvertently introduced at that time. However, it wasn't really in widespread use until a few months ago... and WC wasn't made aware of it until just now. I know you probably didn't mean it that way, but you made it sound like it was in common usage (and WC was also aware of it being used) all that time. I'm only mentioning it because during turbulent times even unintentional blurring together of the facts can take on a life of its own, which only makes things more confusing for everyone. Other than that, I totally see where you are coming from were it not for the point iAmE made. Thanks for making things clear And yeah, I wasn't expecting people on legacy to actually dig their own graves. This has me a gutted right now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halcyon Posted February 8, 2018 Author Share Posted February 8, 2018 From a fairness point of view though, what is the difference between legacy and official, now that cheaters have been forgiven, and their assets now washed? Knowing technology, and the evolution thereof, I don't think this is the last time this is gonna happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArkCreation Posted February 8, 2018 Share Posted February 8, 2018 2 hours ago, Halcyon said: Now that cheat pollution on official launch servers is equal to that of legacy servers, and considering how most official launch servers are dino capped, why not bring legacy back into the official server cluster? This way legacy crowd don't get raptored with uncertainty, and the official launch crowd get to have new Dinos again. Win Win for everyone. Or at the very least, EVERYONE get's raptored equally, and players give Wildcard a one-time amnesty for having double standards. (i.e. slapping a death warrant on legacy servers because of cheaters... then forgiving cheaters on official launch 5 months later for an exploit known since August 2015.) I am not certain with Pvp, but PvE the uncertainty most feel about playing legacy is just based on the fear of no customer support. I don't know you're reasoning, but it sounds like pvp is where you came from. i would just avoid official pvp both on legacy and official. All you will find is pain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woodsman Posted February 8, 2018 Share Posted February 8, 2018 So what was this major exploit anyways? Im kinda curious or are we not able to discuss it. But i would suspect wc prefers having legacy servers to the new ones because it cost them less to run. Im guessing at a ratio of 10 to 1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
isu Posted February 8, 2018 Share Posted February 8, 2018 Lancast explained it on reddit: Quote So what was the exploit? Pretty much, it made you sort of an admin on the official servers. That's one way to look at it, the things the exploit actually allowed to do included: aimbot, esp radar, insta teleport to cloud wherever you are, you can download dinos from the cloud everywhere, everything is a transmitter for you, you are a transmitter (however you couldn't actually download individual items off cloud anywhere as that did require an actual obelisk/transmitter initialization so small limitation), bypass any pin code by opening remote inventory of anything you look at, client wakeup/sleep which allowed for various of interesting things, and some duping methods. Now that's just a small list, it goes on and on but these are the "major" gamebreaking things the exploit allowed. You don't need to know how the exploit was achieved so don't ask, just know, it doesn't work anymore - at least for now, wouldn't be the first time WC did a lazy fix or unpatched something you know... Even though yes the exploit technically existed since 2015, it was never known by anyone back then. This exploit has been in use for about 6 months - or however long the new servers were running for. And actually its wasn't spread as WC told us: Quote Now to correct Wildcard's statement a bit. No actual "Mega tribes" had actual access to the exploit. Besides Substitute and myself, VERY FEW people had actual access to the exploit - I'm not going to mention the other people so don't ask. And even if new servers will get even to worse state, they still shouldn't be merged together with legacy servers. Legacy servers have still much more OP BPs and dino DNA, which should never see light on the new servers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halcyon Posted February 8, 2018 Author Share Posted February 8, 2018 2 hours ago, isu said: Lancast explained it on reddit: And actually its wasn't spread as WC told us: And even if new servers will get even to worse state, they still shouldn't be merged together with legacy servers. Legacy servers have still much more OP BPs and dino DNA, which should never see light on the new servers. Dino DNA - Yes... there are some lvl 449 monsters on Legacy. I don't mind admin removing those tho. I'd even volunteer to help the admins do some cleaning if they'd have me. As for OP BP's - Aren't item stats clamped at 290%? And even if you cryo-freeze characters filled with 380% craft bonused longneck rifles into the obelisk, then retrieve them whenever u need one for an operation, this can be done on official live too. OP BP's aren't exclusive only to legacy servers.... unless there's another exploit regarding BP's i'm not aware of. Other than that... If Mega Tribes didn't have access to the exploit... then what is WC on about? It's outright suicide to blatantly lie to that degree. They *have* to have been certain of facts before putting that onto a letter to the community. Lying to the Internet is simply pure suicide. I doubt Wildcard is BSing cuz this would earn them a 1-way ticket to the Electronic Arts shytewagon 100%. It's too obvious. Too crazy. 4 hours ago, ArkCreation said: I am not certain with Pvp, but PvE the uncertainty most feel about playing legacy is just based on the fear of no customer support. I don't know you're reasoning, but it sounds like pvp is where you came from. i would just avoid official pvp both on legacy and official. All you will find is pain. Uncertainty as in, not knowing when they are going to shut down your legacy server. Only that they are doomed to be shut down one day, because Wildcard clearly said they reserve the right to repurpose them at their whim. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkasaurio Posted February 8, 2018 Share Posted February 8, 2018 Personally, I'm largely in agreement with you. The current officials having had so many problems with exploits, the line they drew starts to seem more arbitrary and unfair all the time. It's not just that they're separate clusters, its that one is supported and the other is not. However, this would never happen in the way OP is thinking about it. For WC to reconnect and resupport legacy servers signals to players and critics that they believe their new servers are just as broken and corrupt as the old - that might be true (though not the point), but for WC to admit it is admitting defeat. I could maybe, possibly, see them launching new-new-officials, "Officials 2.0" and rolling current officials into the legacy program, particularly if there is another massive "we really should ban half our player base" exploit exposed in the near future. However, WC doesn't add new servers, meaning if this happens Officials 2.0 have to come from somewhere and my guess at the most likely candidates are the current legacy servers. In other words, current officials become legacy and current legacy is wiped and recycled for Official 2.0 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
isu Posted February 8, 2018 Share Posted February 8, 2018 What you should worry about is that tribe "Tea" got devwiped by admins and few days later admins rollbacked it and "Tea" got their bases back as part of amnesty with this exploit. "Tea" is chinese tribe known for ddos and aimbot. But what is interesting, that even people behind this exploit said that "Tea" hadn't access to this exploit. Wildcard never rollbacked some devwiped server, this was 1st time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buck386 Posted February 9, 2018 Share Posted February 9, 2018 B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halcyon Posted February 9, 2018 Author Share Posted February 9, 2018 16 hours ago, Arkasaurio said: Personally, I'm largely in agreement with you. The current officials having had so many problems with exploits, the line they drew starts to seem more arbitrary and unfair all the time. It's not just that they're separate clusters, its that one is supported and the other is not. However, this would never happen in the way OP is thinking about it. For WC to reconnect and resupport legacy servers signals to players and critics that they believe their new servers are just as broken and corrupt as the old - that might be true (though not the point), but for WC to admit it is admitting defeat. I could maybe, possibly, see them launching new-new-officials, "Officials 2.0" and rolling current officials into the legacy program, particularly if there is another massive "we really should ban half our player base" exploit exposed in the near future. However, WC doesn't add new servers, meaning if this happens Officials 2.0 have to come from somewhere and my guess at the most likely candidates are the current legacy servers. In other words, current officials become legacy and current legacy is wiped and recycled for Official 2.0 That is an interesting perspective. Food for thought. I agree on a lot of your points, especially WC not wanting to admit defeat. Tho, one aspect of this whole rabbit hole got me thinking... The ramifications thereof are following: This isn't the last time exploits are gonna happen. Are they going to "legacy" server clusters everytime there is gonna be an exploit? I'm sure they are discussing this right now.. .Or atleast i hope they are, because this sort of thing will change the paradigm upon which players will find reasons to play official PvE, if persistence becomes a finite prospect. (time limited; in simple english...) in short "Why play if it's gonna get wiped sooner or later? I can't tell exploiters not to exploit and raptor it up for the rest of us." Instead of nerfing flyers and adding leedsichtyses and obelisk timers, why not use that time to implement a system that tracks assets which operate "outside of the norm" and auto-delete these or so admins can delete these more efficiently? Surely lesser wipes is conducive to more consumer confidence. Cuz like I said... we can't ask exploiters not to exploit and frakk the rest of us in the process. The game is too competitive for that sort of decency. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkasaurio Posted February 9, 2018 Share Posted February 9, 2018 22 minutes ago, Halcyon said: That is an interesting perspective. Food for thought. I agree on a lot of your points, especially WC not wanting to admit defeat. Tho, one aspect of this whole rabbit hole got me thinking... The ramifications thereof are following: This isn't the last time exploits are gonna happen. Are they going to "legacy" server clusters everytime there is gonna be an exploit? I'm sure they are discussing this right now.. .Or atleast i hope they are, because this sort of thing will change the paradigm upon which players will find reasons to play official PvE, if persistence becomes a finite prospect. (time limited; in simple english...) in short "Why play if it's gonna get wiped sooner or later? I can't tell exploiters not to exploit and raptor it up for the rest of us." Instead of nerfing flyers and adding leedsichtyses and obelisk timers, why not use that time to implement a system that tracks assets which operate "outside of the norm" and auto-delete these or so admins can delete these more efficiently? Surely lesser wipes is conducive to more consumer confidence. Cuz like I said... we can't ask exploiters not to exploit and frakk the rest of us in the process. The game is too competitive for that sort of decency. I agree that exploits will happen again. In fact I quit playing official sometime ago because I realized Ark is never going to be anything like a "fair game" on the official side. I don't mean the somewhat toxic community, unlimited tribe size or any of that, it's simply that so many exploits and issues go un-dealt with. Plainly, the technology is too unstable and the game is too complex (balance) so it needs referees (imho), known as admins in this case. WC is never going to provide anything like a fair, unbiased, and most of all interested referee; with no membership fee it's not in their business model. My point is they admitted current legacy is corrupt, that's why it's legacy. If WC simply recombines clusters they are admitting their whole official game is corrupt and is unfixable. Like I said, I think the tech is too rough and needs human intervention, so too me that's objectively true, however no company in their right mind admits or even implies something like that. So to me here the only thing that can happen is that possible existing officials get combined with legacy and new officials are launched, because it allows WC to kick the can down the road for another six months to the next big exploit. On your comment on why they focused on other things while they could have been tracking this stuff down, your guess is as good as mine. I think it's both a difficult problem and not a priority. If it were easy to eliminate exploits from Ark I think WC would have done it. We could debate WC's competency at these things, but frankly I don't know enough about gaming technology. It's not a priority, because content sells many more copies than cleaning up exploits, especially when you can change something that partially fixes the issue and say "there, exploit fixed!" Check out these forums and reddit for what I mean, both incredibly critical overall, yet you've got posts right now about what people want to see in the next DLC... the vast silent majority of single and unofficial players would rather RP Cpt. Ahab with the leeds than have WC keep exploits out of their game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
isu Posted February 9, 2018 Share Posted February 9, 2018 As OP is one of player who still plays on legacy, I can see why he wants to unify servers. I don't know how you can compare servers, where only few people cheated to servers, where almost every bob could dupe full inventories. And dont forget on god dinos or duped BPs from prenerf time. I doubt that WC are even thinking about it, because they would just shot themselves to the foot with this move. Even full wipe would be smarter decision. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newflux86 Posted February 9, 2018 Share Posted February 9, 2018 No way is it anywere close to the same as legacy. Legacy had tons of duped tek. C4, dinos and other stuff. Alot of official still jus has stone gates and stuff. So no way is it equalSent from my SM-G920F using SurviveTheArk Community mobile app Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orfew Posted February 9, 2018 Share Posted February 9, 2018 It would be a serious and advantageous attitude to the servers on the part of the WC staff, since it would promote union rather than division, the reasons for separating servers no longer exist and, to the extent that is argued in practice, in my opinion , I see no argument needed to remain separate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grayroad Posted February 9, 2018 Share Posted February 9, 2018 No way should the servers be combined. They should all be wiped rather than combined. Ofc it would suck for the players who did not cheat .. specially in light that on the new servers ppl would try to cheat again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ForzaProiettile Posted February 9, 2018 Share Posted February 9, 2018 Legacy servers are completely corrupted and full of duped items, broken BPs and dinosaurs that have bugged stats. The current servers may not be perfect but they are a significant improvement over legacy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RawOrange Posted February 9, 2018 Share Posted February 9, 2018 There's too much theorycrafting going on here. WC is too unpredictable for us to do such things and to believe any of it is within WC's actionable boundaries. They should have banned them all, end of story. Not doing so has created ANOTHER long term mess for themselves and more than they've anticipated. Mark my words, the messy path continues and they're doing it to themselves. You'd figure they've learned their lesson the first time around. I just don't understand.. There was NO justifiable reason to NOT ban them. Inb4 the official Conversions to legacy rinse/repeat condundrum another year from now. Some 3rd party/company needs to purchase and create a large cluster, admin them, and charge players 5-10$ a month to use it. Let the pros do it, WC. Just roll out your patches and fixes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SmokeyB Posted February 9, 2018 Share Posted February 9, 2018 On 08/02/2018 at 4:47 AM, Halcyon said: Now that cheat pollution on official launch servers is equal to that of legacy servers, and considering how most official launch servers are dino capped, why not bring legacy back into the official server cluster? This way legacy crowd don't get raptored with uncertainty, and the official launch crowd get to have new Dinos again. Win Win for everyone. Or at the very least, EVERYONE get's raptored equally, and players give Wildcard a one-time amnesty for having double standards. (i.e. slapping a death warrant on legacy servers because of cheaters... then forgiving cheaters on official launch 5 months later for an exploit known since August 2015.) I would hate it if they did that. For the sole reason that... First they made centre with no transfers so people left island for the new map populated servers then When scorched came out they said no two way transfers, some people abandoned island bases to go scorched so they can't be cross server raided get a new map and new dinos etc, but some sad twats stayed on their old island bases. The sad twats that stayed on the island had dead servers to build on for months with no competitors as everyone was busy on new maps, this didn't matter as no transfers they was just wasting their time on a dead map, but then wc switched it up and made two way transfers and suddenly the sad twats that stayed out of all the fighting building in peace in servers everyone thought was dead were handed a massive advantage over everyone else, all their pve farming alone on the server now meant they were the strongest tribes in the game, as they had much longer to build than centre servers and could transfer over gigs to wipe scorched servers with ease. Really the stubborn cowards that didn't want to fight on new maps and didn't mind playing on a 2/70 server for six months alone were now rewarded for being the weakest players in ark, by having way more stuff than everyone else. I would hate to see this happen again with the sad twats on legacy, they refused to join new servers as they knew they was too weak to take over again and instead stayed to solo pve on dead legacy servers. If you merge legacy and official you are once again rewarding the weakest players in ark. The strong players from legacy left on release started from scratch and are now built on official letting their mega bases despawn. The sad twats that stayed don't deserve to be handed all that power, when they didn't earn it. Some legacy bases are near three years old full to the Brim with tames and equipment farmed by players long since gone with just probably one guy logging on to feed dinos and put gas in turrets, no way should people be rewarded for that. Would be better to just wipe all servers then merge them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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