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Bullet soaking dinos


metsfan92286

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1 hour ago, Rofelo said:

The problem with that is the saddles will break super quickly because wild card. The best counter we have to aim botters are buildable saddles. Making it so the platform breaks, so the structures break, would be a huge buff to aim botters.

I think you went ot. I meant the armor would go into a different slot, maybe the costume slot, and that would have the durability stat. The saddles would therefore still be unbreakable but also not have any armor stat. 

Also you should never make design decisions affecting most players with a niche class of exploiters / abusers in mind. You should make the right decision for the most people and go after the abusers by other means.

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52 minutes ago, Milsurp said:

I think you went ot. I meant the armor would go into a different slot, maybe the costume slot, and that would have the durability stat. The saddles would therefore still be unbreakable but also not have any armor stat. 

Also you should never make design decisions affecting most players with a niche class of exploiters / abusers in mind. You should make the right decision for the most people and go after the abusers by other means.

Aim botters are just one thing that effect the meta of official pvp. I understand that there are unofficials, but they have the power to change these things now, so balance changes should be for official servers. (OT they should balance official pvp and pve separately) 

I understand now that you were separating dino armor and the saddle and I think thats an amazing idea!! If they were separate they could make unlocking the ability to use it cheap and then make adding armor expensive with varying qualities. I don’t see WC doing this but its a great idea.

 

Just to push my own agenda and stance on bullet soaking dinos again. I still feel that adding “This turret does an additional .1% of the targets health while the tribe is offline” would be great! This would mean only a 1 damage increase versus targets under 1,000 health, 10 damage increase at 10k health and 100 bonus damage at 100k health.

The heavy turret would be at .4% so to do more than 1 bonus damage to a target it has to have more than 250 health. This means that turret damages would be unchanged versus players and really only impact high health dinos.

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On 1/21/2018 at 1:24 PM, Rofelo said:

Thats why you just make the turrets gain “This turret does an additional .1% damage against targets while you are offline” and .4% for heavy turrets. It wouldn’t even be an annoyance for low health flyers and players, it would just make it so if a 100,000 health bronto is soaking it does 100 more damage to it with a normal auto turret.

I get your point, it wouldn't hurt , for turrets to have some kind of stacking damage mod, I think though , fixing orp exploits would go a long way, in making pvp in the game more fun. 

Everytime i have online battles to defend my things. I find it to be fun, exciting , and usually a somewhat logical battle. your brain is your strongest weapon :). 

so maybe the game needs both, something to combat bullet eating, although the goal shouldn' t be to make raiding any more tedious/ less fun. 

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4 hours ago, Rofelo said:

It would be hard to fox a lot of the ORP exploints, but it would ve super easy to add damage boosts to turrets and damage resistance to structures while offline.

Although people would just make allied tribes and not log into them, so that will always be a thing.

lol super hard to disable the use of other tribes dino gates, and also make it so that the orp protection  lasts for about 10 sec after your turrets come online? 

these two changes would pretty much fix the exploits. 

in fact i wanted to see if I could make those changes with the dev kit, but it looks like the vanilla orp isn't in the dev kit as far as i could tell. 

seems like i would have to make my own ORP just to get started.

 

 

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4 hours ago, Rofelo said:

It would be hard to fox a lot of the ORP exploints, but it would ve super easy to add damage boosts to turrets and damage resistance to structures while offline.

Although people would just make allied tribes and not log into them, so that will always be a thing.

also allied tribes don't work on orp right now. 

you can ally but i think it turns off the orp entirely. 

if you disable the use of pincodes entirely, it fixes the shell tribe problem. 

your talking about adding a whole new mechanic, which comes with a lot to work out. 

how terrible that mechanic would be on offence lol, you would slaughter people on too slow of a mount ;)

either way, its getting off topic. 

in my opinion , its not balanced for player vs base. Theres no setup that will keep them out for anywhere close to the time it takes to make the base. 

So either always be online, hide your stuff, or play ORP servers. 

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  • 7 months later...
On ‎1‎/‎16‎/‎2018 at 8:18 PM, metsfan92286 said:

We just fought off a raid on our base, but in the process they managed to waste over 20,000 bullets before the stegos finally died. 

If you had 20 turrets then that's only 1k bullets a piece. That's not even a full cap on a regular turret. Stop complaining and get on a better grind or learn how to spam correctly

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  • 2 months later...

It's been some time but i think the soaking meta needs to be balanced... i'm a solo player and my heavies on the front just got soaked again...15k bullets by only one stego. That just doesnt make sense to me. As a solo player i gotta spent hours and hours to build up defenses, but it only takes one stego to drain my turrets and one arthro to tear down the base... my base is still there but i got no motivation to refill the turrets atm. I just dont get why soaking (and flak running) is still the only way to raid. It takes pretty much 0 effort to raid a base.

I feel like buffing plant x to be the soaking dino killer (as it's present on all maps) would help out a lot and bring up some new (and in my opinion better balanced) raid mechanics by using siege weapons (mostly cannon). That would force raiders to spent way more stuff to get past the defenses and as defenders u got the chance to focus the enemy's siege weapons to actively defend ur base.

I think if the dmg over time effect of the plant x deals a percentage of the max hp of the creature, it will help to balance raiding a lot. If plant x gets resistance to fire arrows, raiders will have to use the cannon to destroy them first before they can start soaking the turrets. Like that, soaking dinos wouldnt get useless, but defenders wouldnt have to grind that many bullets at the same time (as plant x only takes fertilizers).

From a defender's perspective there's just nothing i can do atm, at least thats what i think. It doesnt make sense to grind bullets for days just to have them soaked in like 1h while i am offline. Pretty much no chance to defend because it doesnt take any effort to raid/soak. Especially with soaking and the arthros attackers dont even have to think about if a raid will be worth it, cause they dont have to waste any stuff at all.

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2 hours ago, Punkreas9216 said:

It's been some time but i think the soaking meta needs to be balanced... i'm a solo player and my heavies on the front just got soaked again...15k bullets by only one stego. That just doesnt make sense to me. As a solo player i gotta spent hours and hours to build up defenses, but it only takes one stego to drain my turrets and one arthro to tear down the base... my base is still there but i got no motivation to refill the turrets atm. I just dont get why soaking (and flak running) is still the only way to raid. It takes pretty much 0 effort to raid a base.

I feel like buffing plant x to be the soaking dino killer (as it's present on all maps) would help out a lot and bring up some new (and in my opinion better balanced) raid mechanics by using siege weapons (mostly cannon). That would force raiders to spent way more stuff to get past the defenses and as defenders u got the chance to focus the enemy's siege weapons to actively defend ur base.

I think if the dmg over time effect of the plant x deals a percentage of the max hp of the creature, it will help to balance raiding a lot. If plant x gets resistance to fire arrows, raiders will have to use the cannon to destroy them first before they can start soaking the turrets. Like that, soaking dinos wouldnt get useless, but defenders wouldnt have to grind that many bullets at the same time (as plant x only takes fertilizers).

From a defender's perspective there's just nothing i can do atm, at least thats what i think. It doesnt make sense to grind bullets for days just to have them soaked in like 1h while i am offline. Pretty much no chance to defend because it doesnt take any effort to raid/soak. Especially with soaking and the arthros attackers dont even have to think about if a raid will be worth it, cause they dont have to waste any stuff at all.

Yeah,the game already has siege weapons and raiding should be centered around them not this dumb soaking meta. Imagine siege brontos with artillery !

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19 hours ago, johnm81 said:

whats that extinction dino thats an infinite ammo turret that doesnt count against your turret cap? 

there is an answer...

I thought it might be a good idea too when i first heard of it, but i see 2 problems on that one:

1. It's an extinction only dino, so u gotta own extinction or buy an egg from someone. And i dont think that a Basic creature for base defense should be available through paid dlc only.

2. You can shoot it with a simple crossbow or any other ranged weapon without getting hit, so the effort to raid doesnt go much higher (only a few arrows or ammo). Only way to prevent this would be by glitching it through a wall so it cant be shot but i think it doesnt aggro on enemies then (correct me if i'm wrong). Even though if it would be possible, a glitch to safe it from arrows and guns doesnt seem like a good idea for the whole game.

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10 minutes ago, Punkreas9216 said:

I thought it might be a good idea too when i first heard of it, but i see 2 problems on that one:

1. It's an extinction only dino, so u gotta own extinction or buy an egg from someone. And i dont think that a Basic creature for base defense should be available through paid dlc only.

2. You can shoot it with a simple crossbow or any other ranged weapon without getting hit, so the effort to raid doesnt go much higher (only a few arrows or ammo). Only way to prevent this would be by glitching it through a wall so it cant be shot but i think it doesnt aggro on enemies then (correct me if i'm wrong). Even though if it would be possible, a glitch to safe it from arrows and guns doesnt seem like a good idea for the whole game.

Lets first and foremost have a mutual agreement on what we are trying to achieve with these suggestions. 

 

We are not trying to offer suggestions to make a base unraidable. That would be far more OP than anything currently but in the other direction. We are trying to offer ideas to make raiding bases 'harder'. No defense system should be without any sort of counter. And in reality the only thing defense really does in this game is buy the defenders time to group up and counter attack an attacker.

That is all.

So that said, can you snipe them? Yes. As it should be. Having many dinos that force the enemy to snipe them down before starting to work on your turrets slows the enemy down... as it should. As it should and do nothing more.

 

As for it being an extinction dino, you can go there get some and bring them back.

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3 minutes ago, johnm81 said:

We are not trying to offer suggestions to make a base unraidable.

Totally agree with you!

 

4 minutes ago, johnm81 said:

No defense system should be without any sort of counter.

Agree with you too. But now think it the other way around. No raid System/mechanic should be without a counter too. But currently there is pretty much nothing to counter soaking. Turrets are useless against a single stego with some veggie cakes on it. It can soak your whole base. And thats what i want to adress. I am wasting so many hours to build up turrets and ammo and all it takes to tear it all down is a single stego with some veggie cakes and one or two heavies with some batteries in them to defend the stego. Why should Building defenses be so expensive while soaking + raiding is so cheap? And thats the only thing i want to adress. Not making bases unraidable, but forcing raiders to invest more mats...

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1 hour ago, Punkreas9216 said:

Totally agree with you!

 

Agree with you too. But now think it the other way around. No raid System/mechanic should be without a counter too. But currently there is pretty much nothing to counter soaking. Turrets are useless against a single stego with some veggie cakes on it. It can soak your whole base. And thats what i want to adress. I am wasting so many hours to build up turrets and ammo and all it takes to tear it all down is a single stego with some veggie cakes and one or two heavies with some batteries in them to defend the stego. Why should Building defenses be so expensive while soaking + raiding is so cheap? And thats the only thing i want to adress. Not making bases unraidable, but forcing raiders to invest more mats...

The counter to soaking is to counter attack the attackers and push them to their fob, then you soak their turrets.

Base defenses are only meant to buy you time. 

But there is a counter to soaking.

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2 minutes ago, johnm81 said:

The counter to soaking is to counter attack the attackers and push them to their fob, then you soak their turrets.

Base defenses are only meant to buy you time. 

But there is a counter to soaking. 

So you stand no Chance if you are offline at the time u got attacked, and only one stego is enough to wipe u then :D For me as a solo Player i just got absolutly no Chance to Counter raids, and many other tribes on small tribes Servers got the same issues as even many youtubers say.

I know you are right, that pushing the attackers back to their fob and soak their turrets is a Counter. Agree with you!

Still i feel like some adjustments might get a more balanced Feeling on costs for defenses and attacks. I would love to try out such changes. Wildcard definetly needs some test Servers :D

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5 minutes ago, Punkreas9216 said:

So you stand no Chance if you are offline at the time u got attacked, and only one stego is enough to wipe u then :D For me as a solo Player i just got absolutly no Chance to Counter raids, and many other tribes on small tribes Servers got the same issues as even many youtubers say.

I know you are right, that pushing the attackers back to their fob and soak their turrets is a Counter. Agree with you!

Still i feel like some adjustments might get a more balanced Feeling on costs for defenses and attacks. I would love to try out such changes. Wildcard definetly needs some test Servers :D

I have played in Megas

I have played solo

And everything in between.

 

Yes you are right with current meta solo player has no chance if offline or drastically outnumbered. Shouldn't it be that way though? But with that said as a small tribe you do have a recourse and that is hiding. Not lame hiding that never works like a 1x1 under a tree. Rather the use of purlovia spread out over large areas and utilizing boats as they are effective. 

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2 hours ago, Punkreas9216 said:

So you stand no Chance if you are offline at the time u got attacked, and only one stego is enough to wipe u then :D For me as a solo Player i just got absolutly no Chance to Counter raids, and many other tribes on small tribes Servers got the same issues as even many youtubers say.

I know you are right, that pushing the attackers back to their fob and soak their turrets is a Counter. Agree with you!

Still i feel like some adjustments might get a more balanced Feeling on costs for defenses and attacks. I would love to try out such changes. Wildcard definetly needs some test Servers :D

I've played as solo for a few months and in small tribe for over a year and I've also been in 3 mega tribes. Now my advice to you as a solo player would be to be realistic. You aren't going to be able to have a big base on a populated server. It will get wiped the first day. Play smart, build small, build only what you need to. Same for tames either do without or tame only the very essential ones for your particular need.  Spread your stuff over the place, don't store all your eggs in the one basket.

Play as a guerrilla is what I'm basically saying. The benefits are you can log off at night and absolutely not give a damn if your base gets raided because you will lose next to nothing. Its a good feeling.

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17 hours ago, ForzaProiettile said:

I've played as solo for a few months and in small tribe for over a year and I've also been in 3 mega tribes. Now my advice to you as a solo player would be to be realistic. You aren't going to be able to have a big base on a populated server. It will get wiped the first day. Play smart, build small, build only what you need to. Same for tames either do without or tame only the very essential ones for your particular need.  Spread your stuff over the place, don't store all your eggs in the one basket.

Play as a guerrilla is what I'm basically saying. The benefits are you can log off at night and absolutely not give a damn if your base gets raided because you will lose next to nothing. Its a good feeling.

Good tips!

I'm playin solo since early Access and i'm playing mostly how u described. But some day the time comes where i wanna build up bigger :D but like 2 days later i know why i hate ark's raiding mechanics when 1 guy soaks all my turrets with 1 stego and my whole b is gone :D after that i usually quit ark for 2 or 3 weeks to come back afterwords and start building up small hidden bases again. I know i'm not gonna be Alpha as solo Player but when it takes 0 effort to raid a base, something must be wrong with the game, at least in my opinion ^^

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