100 Turrets Is Not Enough

[Yster]

Truth about turrets is the calculation between the turret and projectile or dino in range.

if you shoot a rocket the server needs to calculate the point of inpack between you and the turret and respond withing ms to shoot down the rocket. doing that calculation for 1000 of turrets causes LAG.. 

That is a FACT.. but this only reduce the insane amount of lag caused by raiding.. if you have raided a large tribe you'll know the mount of lag, and I have walked the same path on a Bronto 5 to 7 times with lag.. 

Fact 2.. for everyday playing this didn't change a single thing. 

Solution.. 

Well.. let me know also... 

Personally.. smaller tribes, fewer alliances, so there cant be 500 player  sized tribes. cause step one in defeating an alpha sized tribe is spam log till your out numbering them or logged so that they are all unable to connect.. then its so to speak an offline raid

hour or three of soaking and you can raid any sized tribe, no matter how willing they are to log and defend.

you don't have to be a 500 size tribe to defeat a 500 sized tribe, but if the tribe are limited to say 10 online members.. then you cant spamlock a map. 

[Frogspoison]

I have posted this in another thread, and I will post it here - Utilize DINO defenses in addition to turrets.

 

Most of the current soaker-disabling dinos, such as Kapros/Raptors (Disable Stegos, Trikes, Turtles), and Purlovia's/Microrapors (Disable Diplos/Paracers/Brontos/Rock Golems) are EXTREMELY easy and cheap to tame (Kapros/Raptors can easily be tamed on raw meat in MASS. Microraptors on any official level can be tamed with a single rare flower. Purlovia's up to lvl 130 are easily tamed with mutton, and up to 150 can be easily tamed with raw meat during 2x.

 

These are just dismounters to prevent players from effectively soaking. Vultures and Dimorphs (Vultures being extremely easy to raise, Dimorphs being easy to tame) will make quick work of players. A group of Allos will slaughter ANY soaker regardless of armor and health amount. Kentro's are a death sentence to any player they impale (A Kentro with 500% melee will kill a player with a full 130 points invested into health). Dilos and Araneos slow down targets, and Arthros and Bigfoot crush through armor. Not to mention the reflection damage to larger carnivores from Arthros and Kentros (Will enrage gigas!) This doesn't even cover Icthys and Pegos, which will strip away your opponents equipment in no time en-massed

 

The biggest threat are flyers, since a Quetzal with a 60 armor saddle is REALLY tough to take down (Although a group of fast Dimorphs/Vultures is enough to get the player killed, and the Quetzal distracted), although even with that, Fire Wyverns are the answer.

 

So, really, pair dino defenses with turret defenses. Furthermore, use a large variety of dinos in order to prevent further counters (Bronto's can make quick work of unamored Dimorphs/Vultires, ect, but a group of Kentro's will quickly decimate a Bronto. The Kentro's can be killed easily by a guy on a Lightning/Fire wyvern, but a large group of Dimorphs/Vultures/Misc flyers (Think Argents) will make quick work of a Wyvern.

[Yster]

3 hours ago, Frogspoison said:

I have posted this in another thread, and I will post it here - Utilize DINO defenses in addition to turrets.

any Dino on argo or neutral I kite into the sea or down a cliff to deal with him later.. 

Dinos are the good defense only if there is players online to control them. 

[BoboOfTheFriendlies]

The huge base with massive turret towers around it meta is gone, and so is the server freezing lag that were also part of the defense.  Good riddance.

Be smart about where and how you build, build smaller, use heavies and choke points, and farm element and use tek.   Adapt, survive, and all that.

[iDankEngine]

Wildcards lack of attention to undermapping and dossing and the fact that they are favoring certain people on official pc servers than others is great evidence that wildcard gives "0" heck anymore. No amount of turrets will save you from either of those your best off giving up your life and being on 100% to stare at your tames and make sure they are ok. BTW you can still build any size base because all you have to do is divide your turrets by the ammount of sides on your base. Finding areas that have 1 way up and enough land to spread out turret coverage are the best for ONLINE defending. No amount of defenses can defend an offline raid. Using high range on your turrets give them more time before the projectile or enemy reaches the generator. Fill your turrets as much as possible, Use bear traps, spikes, dino gates, bill boards, kentros, raptors, and behemoth gates to increase the amount of c4 required to reach the top. Tek turrets MUST be mixed into a large base because platform dinos can blind sight turrets to level your defenses, These turrets cause knock back and mixed with plant x will make it very difficult for one dino to soak by itself. If you're lucky enough to be online for a defense use therizinos to deal with footed enemies and unmounted dinos. Overall its best to have a large tribe size to maximize your chance of being online for a defense. Have a discord for contacting available tribemates who can get on and join the fight. 

[Frogspoison]

7 hours ago, Yster said:

any Dino on argo or neutral I kite into the sea or down a cliff to deal with him later.. 

Dinos are the good defense only if there is players online to control them. 

That's why you tether them. I didn't mention it because I feel that tethering your defending dinos is a very, VERY basic skill. You can't kite tethered dinos past a certain point.

[iAmE]

3 minutes ago, Frogspoison said:

That's why you tether them. I didn't mention it because I feel that tethering your defending dinos is a very, VERY basic skill. You can't kite tethered dinos past a certain point.

Yeah, you can. Unless they changed it in the last 3 months, the aggro overrules the tether. You just keep them aggrod the whole time (By staying closer to them), and get them out of render of the tether, and the tether drops. 

[ac273]

Doesn't matter anyway.  The turret limit is bugged so hard it is pointless.  We have bases where half the turrets go offline every patch or server reset.  WC has yet to fix it.  It is getting old as hell picking up hundreds of turrets and putting them back down.

 

[Frogspoison]

3 hours ago, iAmE said:

Yeah, you can. Unless they changed it in the last 3 months, the aggro overrules the tether. You just keep them aggrod the whole time (By staying closer to them), and get them out of render of the tether, and the tether drops. 

Dino's attempt to return to the tether regardless of distance - I've tested this by flying across the entire map on a flyer tethered to a ground dino. Get off, flyer takes off in the exact same direction of the tether. Now, if they aren't rendered, they don't actually move, but they do attempt to return regardless of distance, and won't reacquire aggro once it's dropped. If it's enemy flyers (The Dimorphs/Vultures I keep refering to), you have to take the time to actually kill them.

[Yster]

9 hours ago, ac273 said:

 

this was reported long ago.. You actually have more than a 100 turrets in range. its just the numbering system below the turret that's incorrect. 

 

We had to pickup every last turret we placed and placed them one by one till we could see how and where the limits are enforced. 

its a pain in the backside, cause you would think something like the 44/100 would be useful. but its bugged.. not the turret limit by itself. also remove that turret is useless now.. the plant X makes more damage. heavy turrets or Tek.. 

9 hours ago, ac273 said:

 

[ac273]

7 hours ago, Yster said:

We had to pickup every last turret we placed and placed them one by one till we could see how and where the limits are enforced. 

its a pain in the backside, cause you would think something like the 44/100 would be useful. but its bugged.. not the turret limit by itself. also remove that turret is useless now.. the plant X makes more damage. heavy turrets or Tek.. 

 

 

 

You Misunderstand.  There are actually 44/100 in range.  The problem is when they restart the server it kicks the turrets offline.  We pick them up and place them down and they function.  Next patch or restart kicks them off again.   What your talking about is zone of influence for the turret limit.  I wrote a whole post about how it is bugged. 

 

 

Posted February 23

I am going to model this in 2D.  I realize each turret has a 3D sphere around it, but it is easier to model in 2D.  I am also going to make each circle represent 20 turrets to keep it simpler as well.  Some quick terms I am going to use defined to keep things simple.

• Radius of Influence - Radius of a sphere around each turret that adds to the turret limit in an area.
• Firing Distance - Radius around a turret that is its firing distance (This is currently much smaller than the radius of influence)
• Overlapping Zone of Influence - Zones where multiple Radius of Influences cause the turret limit total to be over 100 turrets
• Zone of Over-Influence - Theoretically possible to create a zone with 400/100 turrets in range.  Thanks Math!!

I am going to start with how it is possible to knock your own turrets offline.  And how it is possible to create zones of over-influence. 

Let's start with a standard box base with 4 turret towers.  This is just a simplified example, so let us not get bogged down on base design.  I am simply trying to show and issue with the way the new limits are implemented.

 

To keep things simple, each circle represents 25 turrets.  Lets start by putting 25 turrets in each corner of the base (not realistic, but if I showed each individual turret zone it would be impossible to visualize)

You can see how the zones overlap.  I added a blue zone in the middle to show where the turret limit is met.  100/100 in range due to the 4 overlapping zones of influence from 25 turrets each circle.  But look at the turret towers.  Each only only sees 25 turrets in range.  This allows you to place 75 turrets at each tower.   Let's place those turrets and see what happens. 

Every part of the base sees over 100 turrets now, so all of those turrets deactivate.  And on top of that there is a zone in the very center of the base that sees 400/100 turrets. 

The issue isn't the placement limit, the issue is that the radius of influence for placing the turrets is the same size as the radius of influence for deactivation.  The radius of influence for deactivation needs to be exactly half of the radius for placing the turrets.  If we do that the map preventing us from placing too many turrets looks exactly like the map above, but the issue for knocking turrets offline is solved. (see below)

 

Hard turret limit is achieved and there are no zone of over-infuence.  Please Wildcard.   Consider implementing this change.  In its current iteration the hard turret limit is a disaster.

 

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The main thing is no money