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Definitely Not A Rant...


ArkDoneRight

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So i watched 5 minutes of the livestream from twitchcon and saw how far behind they are in aberration then went off and played another game.

Then i saw the Jat and Jen announcements about how aberration would be delayed "some weeks" like we all saw that coming, that didn't even trigger me.

It was when Jen said, and i quote:

Quote

"it's going to better once we get all this hands on feedback from people at the convention, all weekend long we're going to have streamers come to THIS boot where me and jat are right now, they're going to be streaming the game, so not only are we going to get feedback from people here, feedback from streamers"

and then they go on, but the copy of the video i was watching they talk over her because her word isn't worth a grain of salt.

So this triggered me on three levels

  1. Wild Card had their game in beta/alpha for years and didn't listen to the core of their playing group more often than not, so having only a couple streamers to ignore might be easier on them
  2. If they actually listened to feedback and not do their own thing, they would've released more official servers at release, and maybe even servers with a tribe cap instead of having mega tribes ruin their official servers
  3. But instead of listening they try to distract us by announcing an expansion (that no one even asked for) to be released in October (which was clearly an unrealistic expectation)

Just give us our TLC patches, and then maybe make an expansion called "Ark Survival Evolved: Fixed Version" and charge people for that.

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So basically all 3 points (about our new product) that you've made have taken what Jen and Jat said out of context in an effort to get across your frustration with base game ARK.

If you have issues with ARK, you're very welcome to post your issues in a thread about base game ARK... our development team certainly does read the forum on a daily basis and take on board all the feedback we receive. 

Please don't try discredit a product, processes and teams you have no knowledge about based on issues with another matter entirely.

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Responses to your points:

1- Wildcard actually considered a pretty enormous amount of community feedback. The Basilo, Terror Bird, and Karkinos (Giant Crab in Aberration) all exist because of player feedback. The Phoenix got stat adjustments because of player feedback. Even the Flyer TLC was based, in part, on player feedback about PvP meta (far more complex than that, but it did partially seek to address that). And let's also not pretend that every single bit of "feedback" that players give is necessarily good for the game. It's not. On another thread, I used the example of the Rocket Launcher nerf. ARK overwhelmingly favors offense over defense in PvP. Nerfing the Rocket Launcher (alongside giving turrets some better targeting) significantly helped balance that aspect of the game, but people were unhappy and complained even though it was a healthy change for the game overall. Generally, without trying to brown-nose, the devs have an easier time getting the "big picture" view of the game's health, so sometimes when they don't make a change (assuming they're paying attention, and based on the degree of interaction from Jat, Jen, Jeremy, and more, I have no reason to doubt they do), it's because they understand that change may adversely effect the game at large.

2- Servers cost money. If people paid to access servers, then this might not be an issue, but you get to play on Wildcard's Nitrado-rented servers for free. Unless your intent is either to volunteer to give money to Wildcard to open new Official servers, or to financially drive Wildcard into the ground, then I don't think you can fairly expect more Official servers to open. 

3- Expansions are a part of the game that they promised. They do indeed need to work on them if they intend to live up to that promise, and again, the evidence suggests they fully intend to do so. And guess what--crap happens. Sure, it seems like it's happened a lot to Wildcard, but if we're going to be completely fair, it's not like many games have been so openly accessible and traceable as they develop through Early Access to a full release. Much of the issue seems to stem less from Wildcard as their affiliates--Microsoft holding up certifications and Cross-Play, Nitrado having product quality issues with their servers. And yes, sometimes Wildcard does miss a deadline. They've been pretty up front and clear with us for the most part in this regard.

I think your accusations are pretty unfair TBH. Just my two cents.

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1 hour ago, Casanova said:

So basically all 3 points (about our new product) that you've made have taken what Jen and Jat said out of context in an effort to get across your frustration with base game ARK.

If you have issues with ARK, you're very welcome to post your issues in a thread about base game ARK... our development team certainly does read the forum on a daily basis and take on board all the feedback we receive. 

Please don't try discredit a product, processes and teams you have no knowledge about based on issues with another matter entirely.

I dont think i took the live stream out of context at all, if you want more context 20 seconds later they started talking about the free skins... usually out of context would imply that i left a key part of the conversation out.

 

47 minutes ago, PuffyPony said:

1- Wildcard actually considered a pretty enormous amount of community feedback. The Basilo, Terror Bird, and Karkinos (Giant Crab in Aberration) all exist because of player feedback. The Phoenix got stat adjustments because of player feedback. Even the Flyer TLC was based, in part, on player feedback about PvP meta (far more complex than that, but it did partially seek to address that). And let's also not pretend that every single bit of "feedback" that players give is necessarily good for the game. It's not. On another thread, I used the example of the Rocket Launcher nerf. ARK overwhelmingly favors offense over defense in PvP. Nerfing the Rocket Launcher (alongside giving turrets some better targeting) significantly helped balance that aspect of the game, but people were unhappy and complained even though it was a healthy change for the game overall. Generally, without trying to brown-nose, the devs have an easier time getting the "big picture" view of the game's health, so sometimes when they don't make a change (assuming they're paying attention, and based on the degree of interaction from Jat, Jen, Jeremy, and more, I have no reason to doubt they do), it's because they understand that change may adversely effect the game at large.

In the grand scheme of things i understand they listen to their customers and understand they're not always right or that their complaint or feedback is valid. It's just frustrating when they hear the feedback they say they'll implement the feedback, but they dont. you could look through countless community crunches / digests see the Q&A, see them say, it's a good idea and they're looking forward to implementing it soon... but it jsut never comes.

 

43 minutes ago, PuffyPony said:

2- Servers cost money. If people paid to access servers, then this might not be an issue, but you get to play on Wildcard's Nitrado-rented servers for free. Unless your intent is either to volunteer to give money to Wildcard to open new Official servers, or to financially drive Wildcard into the ground, then I don't think you can fairly expect more Official servers to open.

I think that it's an interesting discussion about the cost of servers and how to pay for it. we would never know if people would actually pay for Official clusters or not because we weren't really given that option. but it would be interesting if season pass went toward servers and you could join one "premium cluster" which would be off meta, ie one with only solo players on it. i'd love to see a solo player cluster and see how it all goes.... there are over 2000 unofficial servers so its clear some people are willing to pay to get the game play they want, the issue with unoffical is that its really hard to populate the servers because you can't stand out and for some servers they don't even show up when searched for (wouldn't want to fix that por favor)

41 minutes ago, PuffyPony said:

3- Expansions are a part of the game that they promised. They do indeed need to work on them if they intend to live up to that promise, and again, the evidence suggests they fully intend to do so. And guess what--crap happens. Sure, it seems like it's happened a lot to Wildcard, but if we're going to be completely fair, it's not like many games have been so openly accessible and traceable as they develop through Early Access to a full release. Much of the issue seems to stem less from Wildcard as their affiliates--Microsoft holding up certifications and Cross-Play, Nitrado having product quality issues with their servers. And yes, sometimes Wildcard does miss a deadline. They've been pretty up front and clear with us for the most part in this regard.

I agree that expansions were / are part of the game, but this wasn't like wow when people are content locked waiting for the new expansion, although mega tribes didnt take long to refresh and get tek, i'm not sure the mega tribes were like "done! gg put game down."

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1 hour ago, ArkDoneRight said:

So i watched 5 minutes of the livestream from twitchcon and saw how far behind they are in aberration then went off and played another game.

Then i saw the Jat and Jen announcements about how aberration would be delayed "some weeks" like we all saw that coming, that didn't even trigger me.

It was when Jen said, and i quote:

and then they go on, but the copy of the video i was watching they talk over her because her word isn't worth a grain of salt.

So this triggered me on three levels

  1. Wild Card had their game in beta/alpha for years and didn't listen to the core of their playing group more often than not, so having only a couple streamers to ignore might be easier on them
  2. If they actually listened to feedback and not do their own thing, they would've released more official servers at release, and maybe even servers with a tribe cap instead of having mega tribes ruin their official servers
  3. But instead of listening they try to distract us by announcing an expansion (that no one even asked for) to be released in October (which was clearly an unrealistic expectation)

Just give us our TLC patches, and then maybe make an expansion called "Ark Survival Evolved: Fixed Version" and charge people for that.

#1 does seem to be a serious problem. Sure they listen to feedback sometimes but it's them basically buying into the newsletter of that guy at the street corner ranting about aliens stealing our precious bodily fluids.

"Gee. Thanks for the tweaks no one cares about. Still waiting on a decent tribe system."

I don't really agree with #3 since it's more likely the exact opposite. The expansion is THEIR distraction from the main game. Fixing stuff is hard. :D And come on, you have to at least tack on a few weeks to every ETA they give. It was the same back when Jeremy Stieglitz was in charge at Trendy. It's how he runs things.

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4 minutes ago, Vrallox said:

I don't really agree with #3 since it's more likely the exact opposite. The expansion is THEIR distraction from the main game. Fixing stuff is hard. :D And come on, you have to at least tack on a few weeks to every ETA they give. It was the same back when Jeremy Stieglitz was in charge at Trendy. It's how he runs things.

You're not wrong, but my gripe isnt with the delay or expansion itself. When finished, looks great, pats on the back. What annoyed me was that out of no where THEY set the timeline, THEY created the expectation

1 hour ago, Casanova said:

Please don't try discredit a product, processes and teams you have no knowledge about based on issues with another matter entirely.

The fact that the player base knew it wouldn't be ready on october shows that it's actually them that lacks knowledge of processes and the time it would take their team to complete.

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maybe were getting too old and we realize they are just trowing bones at us. Sometime i wish i was young and naive again so i would not see the bigger picture. Dont worry there plenty of young one that will jump on shiny luminescent skin like they were the light of a giant angler fish. Someone gotta feed the beast .

 

Image result for find nemo angler fish

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32 minutes ago, Ramrod said:

I don't understand why anybody would even buy a new product when the current one is broken and being neglected the way it is. It's an ongoing cycle to get money.... theft by deception. 

How is it theft when you willingly gave them your money? In what way have the deceived you?

Seriously, tell me how they put a gun to your head and took your money. If your story is sad enough,
I'll give you the beach front property on the sun that I own.

Anything prior to Ark's launch day was subject to drastic change and would not reflect the game post-launch.
No matter how little or dramatic that change may be. You got what you paid for, nothing more, nothing less.

Like it, love it, hate it, leave it, those are your options, but don't for one damn second start accusing anyone of theft.

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9 minutes ago, Extraterrestrial said:

How is it theft when you willingly gave them your money? In what way have the deceived you?

Seriously, tell me how they put a gun to your head and took your money. If your story is sad enough,
I'll give you the beach front property on the sun that I own.

Anything prior to Ark's launch day was subject to drastic change and would not reflect the game post-launch.
No matter how little or dramatic that change may be. You got what you paid for, nothing more, nothing less.

Like it, love it, hate it, leave it, those are your options, but don't for one damn second start accusing anyone of theft.

I'm not backing the theft claim, but people could claim the change of release dates of the actual launch as something that breaks consumer laws in some european countries and in Australia you could get a refund pre-release as it would fall under our false advertising laws.

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1 hour ago, Casanova said:

our development team certainly does read the forum on a daily basis and take on board all the feedback we receive. 

Dont know whether to laugh or cry at this comment, 
I post well over a year ago about an issue with harvested resources not spawning back, which IS a game breaking bug as the only fix is to start over,  yet we still have that bug even after official release, plus many many other bugs that have being around for a long time,

So how can you sit there and say they take on board and listen us, stop defending them when clearly you are wrong about what you say about them!

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3 minutes ago, WolfeUK said:

Dont know whether to laugh or cry at this comment, 
I post well over a year ago about an issue with harvested resources not spawning back, which IS a game breaking bug as the only fix is to start over,  yet we still have that bug even after official release, plus many many other bugs that have being around for a long time,

So how can you sit there and say they take on board and listen us, stop defending them when clearly you are wrong about what you say about them!

Proof would be nice.

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3 minutes ago, ArkDoneRight said:

To be fair Casanova is "them" =(

He's not really THEM. He's the Web & Video Producer at Wildcard so he's not tied to the actual game development or anything like that. I'd say he's part THEM and part...not THEM. :D

edit: And also those points in the original post need to be longer and stuff. (Post now on topic.)

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2 minutes ago, WolfeUK said:

Proof of what ?


Of anything that you and O.P are saying.

If they didn't care, they wouldn't be working on the game in any capacity.

If they didn't care, there wouldn't be a Dino TLC pass.

If they didn't care, they wouldn't have a forum here, where they get constantly
verbally shat on day in and day out on a daily basis by people who have the
patience of a humming bird. 

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Just now, Extraterrestrial said:

If they didn't care, they wouldn't be working on the game in any capacity.

money

1 minute ago, Extraterrestrial said:

If they didn't care, there wouldn't be a Dino TLC pass.

money

1 minute ago, Extraterrestrial said:

If they didn't care, they wouldn't have a forum here, where they get constantly
verbally shat on day in and day out on a daily basis by people who have the
patience of a humming bird. 

money

Basically it's about future money they can make off us. Even some of the people who complain are going to give them more money. There's no point in moving on to another project they'd have to possibly start from scratch if there's more money that can be squeezed out of this baby. Just look at the battle royale mode they tried out. They were hoping for some of that sweet, sweet league revenue that other games have been cashing in on. Blizzard absolutely loves what happened with Starcraft and they didn't even do anything in the beginning to foster it.

And let's not forget about future customers. Gotta make the game as shiny as possible to attract customers. Especially with the negativity surrounding it.

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11 minutes ago, Vrallox said:

money

money

money

Basically it's about future money they can make off us. Even some of the people who complain are going to give them more money. There's no point in moving on to another project they'd have to possibly start from scratch if there's more money that can be squeezed out of this baby. Just look at the battle royale mode they tried out. They were hoping for some of that sweet, sweet league revenue that other games have been cashing in on. Blizzard absolutely loves what happened with Starcraft and they didn't even do anything in the beginning to foster it.

And let's not forget about future customers. Gotta make the game as shiny as possible to attract customers. Especially with the negativity surrounding it.


Your argument is pathetically weak.

Look, I get it, you're angry and pissed off. Go back through my previous posts, I was there too.
Especially when it came to the flier nerf. I'm still angry about that. But you know what? I learned
in the past few months that, WildCard is gonna do what wildcard wants.

They're the ones holding all the *snrk* cards, in this whole thing. We paid for the game, they have
our money. The transaction is complete, no take backs, yada yada.

At this point, all they can do is entice you into paying them more. They're not forcing you into anything.

Also, I don't see it evil that they want to make money. I presume you have a job, you have that job to make money right?
Does that make you evil? If so then consider me evil too, cause guess what: I have a job too. I go out to make that sweet
green poop, just so I can *gasp* give it to someone else so they can make money. Holy poop, what a concept.

This is an industry, not a charity. No one is forcing you to buy poop, and unless they start putting loot boxes and poop into it
the way EA and Activision and basically anything else resembling E-Sports and P2W, they're not evil imo.

But that's what it boils down to, a matter of opinions. Yea, WildCard's made a lot of mistakes the past few years. Know
what else they've done? Created a studio. built not one, but two expansive games, several expansions, debugging,
con appearances, dealing with law suits and putting up with a bunch of brats on the forums the entire damn time while
some how not hanging themselves.

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1 minute ago, Extraterrestrial said:


Your argument is pathetically weak.

Look, I get it, you're angry and pissed off. Go back through my previous posts, I was there too.
Especially when it came to the flier nerf. I'm still angry about that. But you know what? I learned
in the past few months that, WildCard is gonna do what wildcard wants.

They're the ones holding all the *snrk* cards, in this whole thing. We paid for the game, they have
our money. The transaction is complete, no take backs, yada yada.

At this point, all they can do is entice you into paying them more. They're not forcing you into anything.

Also, I don't see it evil that they want to make money. I presume you have a job, you have that job to make money right?
Does that make you evil? If so then consider me evil too, cause guess what: I have a job too.

This is an industry, not a charity. No one is forcing you to buy poop, and unless they start putting loot boxes and poop into it
the way EA and Activision and basically anything else resembling E-Sports and P2W, they're not evil imo.

But that's what it boils down to, a matter of opinions. Yea, WildCard's made a lot of mistakes the past few years. Know
what else they've done? Created a studio. built not one, but two expansive games, several expansions, debugging,
con appearances, dealing with law suits and putting up with a bunch of brats on the forums the entire damn time while
some how not hanging themselves.

I...think you completely misread my post. You wanted explanations for things they've done or are going to do and I explained why they did or are going to do them.

Ya then went on to type my argument back at me about the money aspect. And when did I say making money was evil? Again, I was just giving the explanation that you were asking about in your questions.

It's all good. At least we both seem to be in agreement that my actual post was spot on about them doing those things for money and therefore answered your questions to your satisfaction.. Whether or not it's EEEEEVIIIIIILLL is not something I am concerned with on this topic anyway.

Only thing I'm angry with at the moment is that the sloped ceiling items I'm trying to place will not flip over even though this wall is identical to the one they're oriented to. Argh!

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1 hour ago, RoyHess666 said:

pretty late asking for feedback on the game... I must agree with the OP on that.
The devs don't seem to care a lot about bug postings (at least I feel like that, looking at my list of bugs I posted)

It's never too late to ask for feedback :P 
During the very first stream with someone other than Jat and Jen, the streamer asked Jat a question and that was great feedback because it was about the Rock Drake's camo, how the agro should drop if the Drake went invisible after attacking something and it made perfect sense. Because in the demo the creatures went in a straight line for the invisible Drake. Something Wildcard hadn't considered and now got feedback on and they might end up implementing it into the game.

"The devs don't seem to care"
Evidence, please? Where is your proof that they aren't looking through bug reports and fixing what they can?
"Where's your proof they are?"
I don't have any but I'm not posting ridiculously stupid opinions on what I think the devs may or may not be doing.

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30 minutes ago, Vrallox said:

money

money

money

Basically it's about future money they can make off us. Even some of the people who complain are going to give them more money. There's no point in moving on to another project they'd have to possibly start from scratch if there's more money that can be squeezed out of this baby. Just look at the battle royale mode they tried out. They were hoping for some of that sweet, sweet league revenue that other games have been cashing in on. Blizzard absolutely loves what happened with Starcraft and they didn't even do anything in the beginning to foster it.

And let's not forget about future customers. Gotta make the game as shiny as possible to attract customers. Especially with the negativity surrounding it.

It's pretty damn simple... they don't make "future money" if the game isn't fun. Ya dig? So, maybe YOU and some others will not pay, cuz you don't have the fun I and many others are having. Cool. You can list your reason for not enjoying the game all day... I've read them elsewhere... and seen how the toxic forum people bob their heads and say "See! See!". But I'm telling you I don't really give a flying raptor about those things. The core game is FUN right NOW!. And every patch and every expansion is adding to that fun for me.

So, yes... they have my MONEY. And they earned it by giving me and my kids hundreds of hours of gaming fun.

Lemme give you all some advice... as an old dog who has seen and done more than most here... Let the game go. You are done. You obviously are not happy. Let it go and move on. It's only a video game. You are supposed to quit them after awhile, dude.  Why stay and piss on cornflakes? If you are more mad about 'missed potential" than happy to play the game 'as is'... dude... it's time. 

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28 minutes ago, HighFlyer15 said:

It's never too late to ask for feedback :P 
During the very first stream with someone other than Jat and Jen, the streamer asked Jat a question and that was great feedback because it was about the Rock Drake's camo, how the agro should drop if the Drake went invisible after attacking something and it made perfect sense. Because in the demo the creatures went in a straight line for the invisible Drake. Something Wildcard hadn't considered and now got feedback on and they might end up implementing it into the game.

"The devs don't seem to care"
Evidence, please? Where is your proof that they aren't looking through bug reports and fixing what they can?
"Where's your proof they are?"
I don't have any but I'm not posting ridiculously stupid opinions on what I think the devs may or may not be doing.

Maybe they do care about our feedback. Maybe. However, they did not do anything to make us feel the feedback matters. I dare them to prove me wrong.  What you just mentioned regarding a drake should have been reported by QA team to begin with (in general good it was spotted anyway). 

WC does not reply on this forum to anyone,  unless there is sh#tstorm about something they did. So tell me how are we suppoused to believe their claimes this forum is read by them. I want proof by their activity here. Example.  There are/were so disconnected with playerbase that boss' wife decided to ask us what servers we needed after premiere. That's community manager's job, not someone who was not even hired by WC. They had been ingoring growing frustration of playerbase which could not play the game, because of lack of servers. That was one of example of their lackluster communication that is main source of growing frustration in ARK community.

Problem is we talked about it countless of times, Jat claimed communication would improve over time, but nothing has been changed at all. 

 

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1 minute ago, Ganelon said:

Lemme give you all some advice... as an old dog who has seen and done more than most here... Let the game go. You are done. You obviously are not happy. Let it go and move on. It's only a video game. You are supposed to quit them after awhile, dude.  Why stay and piss on cornflakes? If you are more mad about 'missed potential" than happy to play the game 'as is'... dude... it's time. 

can i just not buy the x-pack and hope for improvement were there definitely need improvement. 

 

I said it before just copy past the Rust building, Take the sound pack also. Would be nice to ear someone shot from more than 100 meter of you. Take the risk of getting sue its gonna cost way less money than trying to improve the current building way . When your base is trash it really hard to build something great out of it.

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