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Why Ark is fundamentally flawed as a competitive game.


Octia

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I think the main reason why there's a focus on large/mega tribes on the new official PvP servers is because a lot of the players came from legacy, where they basically wasted all of their time building relations with players they don't know, grinding, building, leveling, taming, breeding, imprinting, losing sleep and having a slight constant worry in the back of their minds about how their base is doing while they're offline. It was like that for me over the 7 months of having just one base after the first one got wiped early. The thought of repeating it all over on the official servers isn't motivating at all, so I guess that's why people gather together and dominate until they're strong enough to branch out go their separate ways on the same server... so obviously the solo/small tribes may as well not bother, which I unfortunately found out the hard way.

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No, it doesn't work as a competitive game because free time trumps skill in Ark. 

Your viewpoint about hiding away is flawed because there isn't only 1 map you can hide on. Transfer to a different smaller server and build up there. Then tx back when you're ready to fight. Alas, fighting back is a moot action because no matter how long you grind for. They will always beat you.

Free time and Friends is what wins in Ark. Not being unable to hide.

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My observations

Half the people a talk with "B" button are kids who sound 12 or under.
There are a lot of players who come to Ark pvp thinking its a shootem up and play like its battlegrounds.
A lot wipe out multiple times against each other. All in the thatch and wood stage and give up.

See all the wood and thatch ruins... most don't stay past level 30.

My tips playing solo on a pvp server (I don't pvp btw)

1) don't bother building in anything other than stone and move to metal as fast as possible.
2) you won't hide any base that has a dino gate. Maybe underwater but I doubt it with the gamma enabled on official pvp now. Smaller dinos (frog, pter) can be stored by breaking and replacing walls.
3) make a 2x3x5 dino gate stone base. The bottom level is a 2x3x1 base with a 2x3x4 dino pen on top with a ramp down. Door under the ramp. Only tame a trike. Make lots and lots of narcos for xp. Expect it gone (unless in stone) next time you log in. If your lucky they will break in down the bottom leaving your dinos up top. Don't store anything in the dinos up top, otherwise they will kill them in repeat raids.
4) It only takes a few hours to level though to being able to build in stone.
5) the only dinos you really need  are trike (narco berries and food), dodo's (kibble for the pter), pter (fly back and forth to get 100  metal), frog (cement paste and chitin)
6) store everything valuable elsewhere in a 1x1x1 stone then metal hidden base with a smithy in it.
7) you can store frogs underwater if you really need to.
8) later use the pter to kill alpha raptors for xp. level it weight to 200 odd, stam to 300 and hp to 1500+ first.
9) you can make a stone base, leave out an outside wall and ceiling and paint it some of it with black paint to make it look like its a ruin.
10) on a pter fly low and hidden in trees and behind rocks but not where wild dinos jump and dismount you.

 

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You can fight mega tribes, with 4 guys we fought off 20 from our male shift troll base with 10 turrets and we killed 5 of there quetzals several pteros, killed them several times, ( that's where we got the gear to kill there tames) we held of for 4 hours and had them very mad we lost 5 birds at the end.

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Before server transfers you could easily play solo pvp and have fun. Raiding smaler tribes and griefing alpha. And ofc even back then you couldn't raid entirely the alpha tribe. Why? Because it just takes too much to raid a base with hundreds of turrets. The reason it ain't so easy to play solo these days is that players have evolved in ark pvp. When cross ark transfer was opened again all servers were full of easy bases and even alpha tribe bases did look like pve. Now everyone has learned that you can't have a stone castle base and you need to really focus only on pvp to survive.

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Despite the ever presence of mega tribes do the PVP'ers here actually enjoy the combat in ark?  I am a long time FPS player on PC and console and the combat in this game is not anywhere close to being what brings me  back to playing it.   The gun play is sloppy, slow and the inherent network issues with a game this size make landing shots extremely frustrating (blood spatter but no hit marker anyone?)  Combat on dinos is just holding down an attack button, not thrilling gameplay in my opinion.

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Despite the ever presence of mega tribes do the PVP'ers here actually enjoy the combat in ark?  I am a long time FPS player on PC and console and the combat in this game is not anywhere close to being what brings me  back to playing it.   The gun play is sloppy, slow and the inherent network issues with a game this size make landing shots extremely frustrating (blood spatter but no hit marker anyone?)  Combat on dinos is just holding down an attack button, not thrilling gameplay in my opinion.
It doesn't do much for me. If I want to shoot someone I'll log in to battlefront.
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Your greatest weapon as a small tribe vs a big mega tribe is believe it or not, ark transfers. This feature commonly looked upon as a tool of mega tribe invasion is actually a bigger advantage for smaller tribes. Being able to set up a logistic base in some distant peaceful server and importing weapons/explosives into a war zone server with a mega tribe gives the small guys a massive advantage. 

1. Don't import tames. There deaths will reveal your home base location. Have a third low pop server where you tame your animals importing kibble there so that there is no tracing to your home base.

2. Use 123 for your steam names so battlemetrics can't be used against you.

3. Don't transfer characters, Just load up items on one obi with a character from the home base. Log off, log on the war server with its own character open up an obi/drop and you will see your gear. Its tied to your steamID#.

 

Hope this helps.

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On 9/16/2017 at 4:30 PM, lfeworthliving said:

Which ones? I have played on 9 servers since the official launch. Each one had a issue with mega or alpha tribes not wanting anyone to build. And politics is my thing in most games. First thing I do on  a server is try to make alliances. 

If you know of one or more servers that have chill alpha tribes let us know cause the PVE alpha's junk up the maps so you cant build and the PVP ones wipe you out daily. I have one server that I was on since day 1. We had alliances with various of the local tribes. We are a tribe with 5 players. Then another tribe came on the scene that was much larger and no matter how small we make our base or where we try to hide we get wiped out.

I have tried to make peace with the alpha's on the servers but no go. So I am at a standstill. I paid 60 for a game that since the launch I can no longer play. That stinks. 

 

Oh and don't get me started with the rubberbanding and other crazy issues like being killed by a sea creature in the forest. 

For obvious reasons it is nice to have a server to yourself.. afk taming.. leaving Dino's outside.. never being killed.. this is what some alphas attempt. You just need to play politics a bit. I'm on such a server. Where alpha wipes any base they find. Yet not mine? They have been to my main base (I hide my stuff just in case) yet I'm the only person I know of that isn't ever touched. I've been longnecked before. They apologize and move on. Why? Politics. It's as simple as letting them know of high end wilds. You see a 150? Let them know. Find a missing dino? Let them know. Find a bp that you know they could make better with their crafting character? Offer them the bp if they make it for you. These are all VERY easy to do and you are generally rewarded for it. It's such a simple thing.. I've even had tribes of other servers come to find me. They get kosed by my servers alpha and are unable to find my hidden 2x2 or even my separate dino pens..

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On 9/21/2017 at 8:06 AM, johnm81 said:

Your greatest weapon as a small tribe vs a big mega tribe is believe it or not, ark transfers. This feature commonly looked upon as a tool of mega tribe invasion is actually a bigger advantage for smaller tribes. Being able to set up a logistic base in some distant peaceful server and importing weapons/explosives into a war zone server with a mega tribe gives the small guys a massive advantage. 

1. Don't import tames. There deaths will reveal your home base location. Have a third low pop server where you tame your animals importing kibble there so that there is no tracing to your home base.

2. Use 123 for your steam names so battlemetrics can't be used against you.

3. Don't transfer characters, Just load up items on one obi with a character from the home base. Log off, log on the war server with its own character open up an obi/drop and you will see your gear. Its tied to your steamID#.

 

Hope this helps.

I agree with much of this. However, some of it can be avoided. The main and 2ndary servers I play on have bully alpha that keeps server to themselves. I do have 2 characters 1 main and a farming character. My farming character is also the taming character. My main is my PvP/main base. I transfer to high population servers to pvp. Due to politics I am safe from both for now. The enemies I make by transferring and killing have come to look for me. So far they get killed by the tribe that has claimed the server. Haven't found my farming character base yet anyway.

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Personally I feel like SOTF is where the pvp should take place, ark is fun an all, but playin official is such aids these days cause I don't have 2000 hours a week to dedicate to it and I don't enjoy having to work with 20+ ppl just to get anything goin worth mentioning. but SOTF, that's all I want on xbox, only been playing ark on xbox for two years in anticipation for SOTF to eventually be put back into production and released on xbox, if wildcard really doesn't ever take advantage of the gold mine that is SOTF, I just don't get it.

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16 minutes ago, RAWRzillaaaa said:

Personally I feel like SOTF is where the pvp should take place, ark is fun an all, but playin official is such aids these days cause I don't have 2000 hours a week to dedicate to it and I don't enjoy having to work with 20+ ppl just to get anything goin worth mentioning. but SOTF, that's all I want on xbox, only been playing ark on xbox for two years in anticipation for SOTF to eventually be put back into production and released on xbox, if wildcard really doesn't ever take advantage of the gold mine that is SOTF, I just don't get it.

16 minutes ago, RAWRzillaaaa said:

Personally I feel like SOTF is where the pvp should take place, ark is fun an all, but playin official is such aids these days cause I don't have 2000 hours a week to dedicate to it and I don't enjoy having to work with 20+ ppl just to get anything goin worth mentioning. but SOTF, that's all I want on xbox, only been playing ark on xbox for two years in anticipation for SOTF to eventually be put back into production and released on xbox, if wildcard really doesn't ever take advantage of the gold mine that is SOTF, I just don't get it.

I would agree with some but not all of this. I loved sotf. But it is not the only way to PvP. They have made it very easy to get gear without putting in time (looking at you wooden club/bola) that's not even counting scorched engrams.. not to mention how easy it is to prime tame something when there are alphas getting stuck.. any "competitive" game.. time is an advantage. If you waste time you will most likely lose no matter how good you are. Ark has made it easy to counter lack of time. Anybody can get on once a day to reset their ark data time.. you don't ever actually even need a base if I'm being honest. Get kill.. loot.. use what you want.. put rest in data.. then whenever you get on to PvP you have gear waiting. 

To be honest the people like you that think.. let me spend this 5 hours of time taming these useless Dino's that aren't going to protect me when I'm offline or let me build this base bla bla.. your doing it wrong man. If you can't be online more than offline why build a base? If your going for PvP what's the point of base at all? It doesn't help you.. it makes you an easy target. You will never be able to out build the guy that has the same time as you that spends it on raiding you.. that is ark. But you people. The people who build.. I love you.. without you guys.. I wouldn't have your raided bases to repair my gear <3

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I don't believe Ark will ever have the PvP appeal of a game like Rust, PUBG, or whatever the next flavor-of-the-month early access PvP game. As others have said, Ark's gunplay PvP just plain doesn't hold a candle to games like that. To me, though, it's kind of like comparing GTA5 to CS:GO. Yes, they're both games that have gun PvP, but they're not attempting to do the same thing. From day one, Ark never seemed like it was trying to be a game all about competitive PvP

This is personal opinion, of course, but the PvP I've enjoyed most in Ark is in no way similar to the PvP I've enjoyed in DayZ, Rust, Counter Strike, Arma, or any other game like that. I like the long-term strategy approach to "PvP" in Ark. I like the utilization of in-game creatures, the ability to fortify a base in a number of different ways that allow creative offensive and defensive strategies. Can these things be found in other games? Sure. Most games have more polished gun play than Ark, but I never got the impression from Wildcard that the intent of the game was to be competitive with the multitude of shooter games on the market.

In that aspect, I agree with the OP in that Ark is fundamentally flawed as a competitive game when compared to many of the other games out right now. 

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It seems the only thing you can do now, is wait for the New DLC to be released and be first on that server. Personally i'm taking a week off work when Aberration is released because I actually want to play the game before the griefers dominate the servers. Heck I might even form a Mercenary Tribe just to combat the on-coming alpha tribes.

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On ‎21‎/‎09‎/‎2017 at 11:36 PM, johnm81 said:

Your greatest weapon as a small tribe vs a big mega tribe is believe it or not, ark transfers. This feature commonly looked upon as a tool of mega tribe invasion is actually a bigger advantage for smaller tribes. Being able to set up a logistic base in some distant peaceful server and importing weapons/explosives into a war zone server with a mega tribe gives the small guys a massive advantage. 

1. Don't import tames. There deaths will reveal your home base location. Have a third low pop server where you tame your animals importing kibble there so that there is no tracing to your home base.

2. Use 123 for your steam names so battlemetrics can't be used against you.

3. Don't transfer characters, Just load up items on one obi with a character from the home base. Log off, log on the war server with its own character open up an obi/drop and you will see your gear. Its tied to your steamID#.

 

Hope this helps.

Very good tips for those new to raiding. Another big tip would be to not speak in global chat. It gives away a lot of information and change tribe name regularly. 

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4 hours ago, LouSpowells said:

I don't believe Ark will ever have the PvP appeal of a game like Rust, PUBG, or whatever the next flavor-of-the-month early access PvP game. As others have said, Ark's gunplay PvP just plain doesn't hold a candle to games like that. To me, though, it's kind of like comparing GTA5 to CS:GO. Yes, they're both games that have gun PvP, but they're not attempting to do the same thing. From day one, Ark never seemed like it was trying to be a game all about competitive PvP

This is personal opinion, of course, but the PvP I've enjoyed most in Ark is in no way similar to the PvP I've enjoyed in DayZ, Rust, Counter Strike, Arma, or any other game like that. I like the long-term strategy approach to "PvP" in Ark. I like the utilization of in-game creatures, the ability to fortify a base in a number of different ways that allow creative offensive and defensive strategies. Can these things be found in other games? Sure. Most games have more polished gun play than Ark, but I never got the impression from Wildcard that the intent of the game was to be competitive with the multitude of shooter games on the market.

In that aspect, I agree with the OP in that Ark is fundamentally flawed as a competitive game when compared to many of the other games out right now. 

The real issue with ARK's gunplay and why ARK's sniper weapons are probably some of the most OP to be found in any video game in modern times is that they use hit scan instead of real ballistics. What this means is all a player has to do is put the crosshair on a target and click and its a "hit". It doesn't matter if the target is 1km away or 10m away. There is no bullet drop and no bullet travel time nor is there a need to lead a target. Bullets in this game travel faster then light. The moment you click they hit the target.

The effect of this is sniper rifles in this game offer numerous advantages and few draw backs that's why if you were to see a chart on weapons used in ARK - longneck and fab sniper would top it for ranged weapons. There is little to no point in using shotguns or assault rifles given their limited range and or low damage and with crosshair bizarrely being turned on you can even use your fab sniper like a semi auto assault rifle shooting from the hip at close range.

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On ‎19‎/‎09‎/‎2017 at 4:05 PM, Crows said:

I think the main reason why there's a focus on large/mega tribes on the new official PvP servers is because a lot of the players came from legacy, where they basically wasted all of their time building relations with players they don't know, grinding, building, leveling, taming, breeding, imprinting, losing sleep and having a slight constant worry in the back of their minds about how their base is doing while they're offline. It was like that for me over the 7 months of having just one base after the first one got wiped early. The thought of repeating it all over on the official servers isn't motivating at all, so I guess that's why people gather together and dominate until they're strong enough to branch out go their separate ways on the same server... so obviously the solo/small tribes may as well not bother, which I unfortunately found out the hard way.

I've been in a few of these mega tribes - one was Chinese and one was not. What I can say of what I found in these tribes was that the players in these tribes didn't like PVP in general and didn't like doing PVP. Most of them seemed to join these tribes so they could avoid PVP and instead just farm and breed and base build. The overall skill level of most of the players I encountered was low - medium. A handful I would call decent PVPers are they were really the only ones in the tribe that would regularly do some form of PVP. The rest came along only if they were needed.

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On 9/13/2017 at 12:37 PM, Octia said:

You can't win at Ark unless the mega tribe lets you.

 

Allow me to elaborate:

You can't "hide away" and attack a mega tribe as a solo or small tribe, they will ALWAYS find you. ALWAYS. It is very important to stress that there is NOWHERE to hide. You see, this is what the devs think balances the game, they think you can hide away from megatribes until you're leveled enough to fight back. Anyone who has played on a server where the megatribe are trying to claim the entire official server to themselves will know that you simply can't hide. This leaves anyone not in the megatribe at the mercy of the megatribe; you exist by their whims. Competitively the game is completely flawed for this reason. It boils down to the power of persuasion, which just doesn't work because it is still THEIR CHOICE, and they still hold all the cards. 

 

This leaves the player three options, leave the server (an option which is diminishing as these tribes are becoming a thousand strong, and spanning all official servers), or persuade them not to destroy you. These are the options anyone not in a megatribe have. In terms of gameplay, you have no form of defense against it; a game you paid for, and you can't fight back because the system is rigged from the start to support those who have the numbers, and those who started first. The third option? Try and join a megatribe. Another element that relies on persuasion, and is completely outside of your direct control.

 

Why can't you hide? Everyone knows all the hiding spots, and the map really isn't that big, all they need is a bronto to stomp through all the trees and it is GG, or just a bird to fly through the forest and over the map. Secondly, the refertilizer DOES NOT WORK. Sometimes it does regrow trees, sometimes it doesn't, the complete mechanic needs an overhaul, or just outright remove it and let trees grow back on their own. This would go a long way in helping smaller tribes hide, yet as is, if a diplo strays through leaving your base in the open, say goodbye to your base, looks like you'll be starting again. How fun. On top of that? Pillars... Pillars everywhere... Really guys? These tribes will pillar the entire map so you can't build anywhere good. It is like you're allowing people to cheat within the rules, where the slimiest lowest players win by being as shameless as possible, exploiting every loophole and flaw in the game.

 

If you can't hide, you can't survive, and right now, you can't hide. The game as is, is flawed. As a simulation of survival ? It fails even in that regard; you see, in real life you only get ONE LIFE, but in ark; you kill them? They come right back, how is survival the main focus when death has no consequence? So unless you're playing hardcore, the megatribe will stay ontop even if you kill them. You can't remove them from their perch without complete annihilation of their bases across all servers.. Now tell me, how is a solo player or small tribe meant to do that?

 

You can't have a game like this where people band together in the thousands without selling short everyone who can't play like that, or doesn't want to play like that.. You're forcing people to play a certain way, a way that is entirely outside of their control and at the whims of the other players; because they don't have the numbers supporting them, or they joined the game later. You've essentially put the success of your game in the hands of the megatribes; right now, they decide who plays the game, and who doesn't; and you're fine with that?..

 

The saddest part is, those in megatribes are usually the worst type of people, and the worst at the game, the type too afraid to face the challenge of playing solo, or in a small tribe...You'll get lots of people defending megatribes, but these people haven't tried the game from the perspective of someone NOT in a megatribe, because if they had, they would know that in it's current state it is unplayable. And lets be honest, impossible.

 

How can you have a competitive game when your opponent decides the outcome? You can't.

 

 

SotF was meant to be there competitive side of ark. Normal ark was meant to be survival of the strongest this means numbers as numbers win fights no matter bad or good people who can get 60,70 will win the fight. 

 

What this game needs is the alliance system removed and actually have a cap of players. Majority of alpha alliances i have seen/been apart of work on backstabbing people in  the alliance making others look worse for something you have done. Example:

 

- Player A disconnects 

- Player B steals all the gear instead of dragging the body back

- Player A  reconnects gets mad starts raging on discord

- Player B blames player C who was no where near this issue

- Player A gets pissed off and starts taking gear from Player C's tribe

- Player B is known as the hero of this story for telling Player A a lie to make Player C and his tribe look worse.

 

This is one example of the distrust in the large alliances that rule the official ark servers. If a player cap of 30 Players actually came in and alliances were not allowed half of these tribes would be at war with each other however, Strength in numbers will prevail so they put aside all their annoyances and issues they have with old enemies and team up. Verbal alliances crumble faster then butter melts on toast. It only takes 1 stray turret to kill someone off there bird and they will be at war with old alliances.

 

 

All this being said WC want these 70/70 lock outs i generally feel they enjoy watching these raids on twitch and are happy with the current balance of the official servers which is none but in a game where rng can make your dino have 40 more points in to oxy then your enemies giga balance is thrown out of the window from the get go and you have to accept that.

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On ‎9‎/‎12‎/‎2017 at 10:07 PM, Octia said:

You can't win at Ark unless the mega tribe lets you.

 

Allow me to elaborate:

You can't "hide away" and attack a mega tribe as a solo or small tribe, they will ALWAYS find you. ALWAYS. It is very important to stress that there is NOWHERE to hide. You see, this is what the devs think balances the game, they think you can hide away from megatribes until you're leveled enough to fight back. Anyone who has played on a server where the megatribe are trying to claim the entire official server to themselves will know that you simply can't hide. This leaves anyone not in the megatribe at the mercy of the megatribe; you exist by their whims. Competitively the game is completely flawed for this reason. It boils down to the power of persuasion, which just doesn't work because it is still THEIR CHOICE, and they still hold all the cards. 

 

This leaves the player three options, leave the server (an option which is diminishing as these tribes are becoming a thousand strong, and spanning all official servers), or persuade them not to destroy you. These are the options anyone not in a megatribe have. In terms of gameplay, you have no form of defense against it; a game you paid for, and you can't fight back because the system is rigged from the start to support those who have the numbers, and those who started first. The third option? Try and join a megatribe. Another element that relies on persuasion, and is completely outside of your direct control.

 

Why can't you hide? Everyone knows all the hiding spots, and the map really isn't that big, all they need is a bronto to stomp through all the trees and it is GG, or just a bird to fly through the forest and over the map. Secondly, the refertilizer DOES NOT WORK. Sometimes it does regrow trees, sometimes it doesn't, the complete mechanic needs an overhaul, or just outright remove it and let trees grow back on their own. This would go a long way in helping smaller tribes hide, yet as is, if a diplo strays through leaving your base in the open, say goodbye to your base, looks like you'll be starting again. How fun. On top of that? Pillars... Pillars everywhere... Really guys? These tribes will pillar the entire map so you can't build anywhere good. It is like you're allowing people to cheat within the rules, where the slimiest lowest players win by being as shameless as possible, exploiting every loophole and flaw in the game.

 

If you can't hide, you can't survive, and right now, you can't hide. The game as is, is flawed. As a simulation of survival ? It fails even in that regard; you see, in real life you only get ONE LIFE, but in ark; you kill them? They come right back, how is survival the main focus when death has no consequence? So unless you're playing hardcore, the megatribe will stay ontop even if you kill them. You can't remove them from their perch without complete annihilation of their bases across all servers.. Now tell me, how is a solo player or small tribe meant to do that?

 

You can't have a game like this where people band together in the thousands without selling short everyone who can't play like that, or doesn't want to play like that.. You're forcing people to play a certain way, a way that is entirely outside of their control and at the whims of the other players; because they don't have the numbers supporting them, or they joined the game later. You've essentially put the success of your game in the hands of the megatribes; right now, they decide who plays the game, and who doesn't; and you're fine with that?..

 

The saddest part is, those in megatribes are usually the worst type of people, and the worst at the game, the type too afraid to face the challenge of playing solo, or in a small tribe...You'll get lots of people defending megatribes, but these people haven't tried the game from the perspective of someone NOT in a megatribe, because if they had, they would know that in it's current state it is unplayable. And lets be honest, impossible.

 

How can you have a competitive game when your opponent decides the outcome? You can't.

 

 

you can solo play easily on no tame. dont request the game to be easier because youre having trouble 1v20. get a tribe

 

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4 hours ago, KurbbieStompp said:

problem is people build in obvious areas

 

No the problem is more to do with flaws in the games engine that allows players to adjust their setting for enhanced vision.

The maps themselves are also a problem. The best map to hide on is the island but that suffers from being rather small. Then you have The Center and Ragnorak those big bland boring maps that suffer from a lack of dense vegetation which means your relying on the size of the map to hide you rather then terrain. 

If you ask me they should add some kind of camouflage netting. You drape it over your base and then unless you go within 20m of it, the base doesn't render. Obviously it would have to be balanced I would make it so you can apply one net in a given area and it would cover a very limited area so only for small bases. The moment you put plant x or turrets on said base it should cease to be camouflaged.

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5 hours ago, SlipperySquid said:

SotF was meant to be there competitive side of ark. Normal ark was meant to be survival of the strongest this means numbers as numbers win fights no matter bad or good people who can get 60,70 will win the fight. 

 

What this game needs is the alliance system removed and actually have a cap of players. Majority of alpha alliances i have seen/been apart of work on backstabbing people in  the alliance making others look worse for something you have done. Example:

 

- Player A disconnects 

- Player B steals all the gear instead of dragging the body back

- Player A  reconnects gets mad starts raging on discord

- Player B blames player C who was no where near this issue

- Player A gets pissed off and starts taking gear from Player C's tribe

- Player B is known as the hero of this story for telling Player A a lie to make Player C and his tribe look worse.

 

This is one example of the distrust in the large alliances that rule the official ark servers. If a player cap of 30 Players actually came in and alliances were not allowed half of these tribes would be at war with each other however, Strength in numbers will prevail so they put aside all their annoyances and issues they have with old enemies and team up. Verbal alliances crumble faster then butter melts on toast. It only takes 1 stray turret to kill someone off there bird and they will be at war with old alliances.

 

 

All this being said WC want these 70/70 lock outs i generally feel they enjoy watching these raids on twitch and are happy with the current balance of the official servers which is none but in a game where rng can make your dino have 40 more points in to oxy then your enemies giga balance is thrown out of the window from the get go and you have to accept that.

Very good points SlipperySquid. I for one don't really understand why they even added the alliance system. Before the alliance system there was still alliances but they were more balanced. If your base was being raided and you wanted help from your "ally" you had to either switch off your turrets or keep them and tell your ally not to go near the base but attack from a distance. This kept things in balance. Furthermore with no alliance chat you had to communicate in global which meant anyone could read it. Now a days its near impossible to know who is an ally of who. There is no way to know until you raid a base and see that another tribe that has turned up isn't getting shot by their turrets then you know they are in an alliance together.

 

You are also right about the 70 player limit cap. Whoever came up with that ridiculous figure and thought it was balanced needs to be reassigned to the back office for documentation writing. Before this there wasn't a limit so WC obviously thought that was unbalanced otherwise they wouldn't have bothered applying a limit at all but to come up with 70 and call it balanced defies belief. That is an entire server for 1 tribe. No matter what calculation you use its very unbalanced.

I'd like to see tribes capped at 10 with a max of 1 ally or even no allies. This would create much more drama and PVP on servers as opposed to the current passive PVE mode that seems to exist on most servers which is only interrupted by rogue tribes like mine that just go around killing all these passive types. 

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6 hours ago, SlipperySquid said:

SotF was meant to be there competitive side of ark. Normal ark was meant to be survival of the strongest this means numbers as numbers win fights no matter bad or good people who can get 60,70 will win the fight. 

 

What this game needs is the alliance system removed and actually have a cap of players. Majority of alpha alliances i have seen/been apart of work on backstabbing people in  the alliance making others look worse for something you have done. Example:

 

- Player A disconnects 

- Player B steals all the gear instead of dragging the body back

- Player A  reconnects gets mad starts raging on discord

- Player B blames player C who was no where near this issue

- Player A gets pissed off and starts taking gear from Player C's tribe

- Player B is known as the hero of this story for telling Player A a lie to make Player C and his tribe look worse.

 

This is one example of the distrust in the large alliances that rule the official ark servers. If a player cap of 30 Players actually came in and alliances were not allowed half of these tribes would be at war with each other however, Strength in numbers will prevail so they put aside all their annoyances and issues they have with old enemies and team up. Verbal alliances crumble faster then butter melts on toast. It only takes 1 stray turret to kill someone off there bird and they will be at war with old alliances.

 

 

All this being said WC want these 70/70 lock outs i generally feel they enjoy watching these raids on twitch and are happy with the current balance of the official servers which is none but in a game where rng can make your dino have 40 more points in to oxy then your enemies giga balance is thrown out of the window from the get go and you have to accept that.

Right, this, when employed as a tactic, requires them to make a mistake. Once again, an element outside of your control, and thus can't be relied upon, and thus isn't a valid counter.

I've tried this deception tactic many times; they're all on discord communicating with eachother. They just need one word to eachother and the attempt at getting them to distrust eachother is shattered. So even ontop of the reasons you've mentioned, which basically leaves everything up to chance, it is still near impossible to use guile to defeat these megatribes.

You see, they know this is a tactic people use; and so they take it into consideration.  They know there are people trying to leverage them against eachother. If anything this strengthens their bond.

You can't expect players to rely on megatribes to war with eachother because of the random chance they fly a bird into a turret; and verbal alliances are as strong as the people making them. Also a factor completely outside of the attacking player's control. it is all speculation as to whether verbal alliances actually ARE weaker than official alliances.

Which is why there needs to be an ingame means of allowing people to fight back. None of this stuff that is outside the players direct control. The power to fight back must be in every player's hands, and right now it isn't.

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