Sarco don't suck...

[CaptainBonecold]

3 hours ago, St1ckyBandit said:

If you have any good dino you can kill them easily. On foot with good gear you can still kill a group without too much trouble. Yeah if they catch you with crap gear and no mount they can kill you, that doesnt make them any good. 

Giga eats all your land dinos. Rockets destroy everything. So what? Nuke kills all.  If power that what everything was about then there be only gaias,rexes and flyers.

[CaptainBonecold]

9 minutes ago, PuffyPony said:

That's exactly my point. And a base defense situation will suck because anything short of an Allo or higher realistically sucks in base defense. Again, I'm using a holistic judgement here, not specifically examining case situations in PvP or PvE

Sabertooth is shorter than an Allo. There alot of dinos shorter than an allo.  The dilo and bat combo blinds and stripes you of your armor.  The eel swarm dis mounts you and kills fast.  You forgot the doed. It small and rolls around.

[PuffyPony]

6 hours ago, CaptainBonecold said:

Sabertooth is shorter than an Allo. There alot of dinos shorter than an allo.  The dilo and bat combo blinds and stripes you of your armor.  The eel swarm dis mounts you and kills fast.  You forgot the doed. It small and rolls around.

What are you even talking about? You aren't even making a coherent point

[CaptainBonecold]

23 hours ago, PuffyPony said:

What are you even talking about? You aren't even making a coherent point

What was your point talking about PVP and allo? I love using sarcos. Found lv 150. By the way sarco pit worth it. My gator pit. Just because something has low stats don't mean it sucks. I love the frogs. Hopper you will be missed. 

[vanyelxp5]

I'd put my Murderbronto up against your sarcos and (slowly) walk away with a smile on my face.

[PuffyPony]

4 hours ago, CaptainBonecold said:

What was your point talking about PVP and allo? I love using sarcos. Found lv 150. By the way sarco pit worth it. My gator pit. Just because something has low stats don't mean it sucks. I love the frogs. Hopper you will be missed. 

It was a reply to StickBandit pointing out that, by the metric that he was using, then pretty much anything short of an Allo is going to suck in PvP because anything weaker is going to die in mere seconds to a raiding party (the Allo isn't like the concrete bottom, there are still other creatures but the Allo is just my example). I do agree with you that low stats don't automatically make a creature suck. Take the Jerboa, for example. It'd never stand up in a fight, but it's still a very useful creature. The problem with the Sarco extends beyond its stats though to niches and functionality, which is why it sucks.

Also, as an update to my mega breakdown post early, I did some dino DPS testing, including for the Sarco and Kapro. Using the Training Dummy to get a measurement for RPS, a Sarco and Kapro hit at a rate of 0.8 and 1.2, respectively. At 100% Melee, this translates into 28 and 30 DPS, respectively. Now, the Sarco does scale slightly better than the Kapro in melee post-tame, but even with the improved scaling, it does not significantly out-damage the Kapro, which also retains the advantage of Stamina drain and the Grab.

[YUSHOETMI]

Only good sarco is a dead sarco.

 

Seriously tho they was only ever good before the big dino nerf a year and abit back, could stack melee impressively on them and even take on alphas.  Once the nerf hit they became useless other than for fast travel in the water.  The deffo need a buff.

[Likwid]

Half way between a land and water Dino, unfortunately makes it doesn't make the list for either

[X111]

personally its a useless animal

 

[Ranger1]

While I doubt we'll see a "Death Roll" attack, I must admit I could go for a tail swipe attack that temporarily stuns those caught in it's area of effect.  It would need a cool down period so you couldn't perma-stun a target(s), but it would be a nice touch I think.

I suppose it could also serve as a counter to the Kapro leap attack.

[PuffyPony]

13 minutes ago, ranger1presents said:

While I doubt we'll see a "Death Roll" attack, I must admit I could go for a tail swipe attack that temporarily stuns those caught in it's area of effect.  It would need a cool down period so you couldn't perma-stun a target(s), but it would be a nice touch I think.

I suppose it could also serve as a counter to the Kapro leap attack.

This would be a neat variation to keep the Sarco from feeling like too much of a big Kapro. The Sarco has fairly narrow jaws, too, like a gharial, so it's structurally unsound for doing a death roll (compared to a crocodilomorph such as the Deinosuchus). That does risk being a bit too Baryonyx, though, so I suppose WC would need to figure out how to work that

[St1ckyBandit]

On 8/6/2017 at 3:43 PM, PuffyPony said:

That's exactly my point. And a base defense situation will suck because anything short of an Allo or higher realistically sucks in base defense. Again, I'm using a holistic judgement here, not specifically examining case situations in PvP or PvE

The other guy already mentioned bats and dilos but I'd take dimos as well. Those things will shred you in a pack and are hard to hit.

 

If you are putting something inside a tight space for smaller base defense than there are so, so, so many better options than the raptor or terrorbird. The raptor really doesnt do anything you can do 10x better with a different dino. At least the Tbird has the niche glide ability.

[CaptainBonecold]

14 hours ago, vanyelxp5 said:

I'd put my Murderbronto up against your sarcos and (slowly) walk away with a smile on my face.

My 3 rexes would eat your bronto.  Since my swamp has 7 raptors and 3 rexes.  I kepp my swamp packed with dinos.  It my swamp. Sarcos very fast in water. 

[St1ckyBandit]

2 minutes ago, St1ckyBandit said:

The other guy already mentioned bats and dilos but I'd take dimos as well. Those things will shred you in a pack and are hard to hit.

 

If you are putting something inside a tight space for smaller base defense than there are so, so, so many better options than the raptor or terrorbird. The raptor really doesnt do anything you can do 10x better with a different dino. At least the Tbird has the niche glide ability.

Edit- Actually I forgot about the chalico poop thrower for base defense. 

[CaptainBonecold]

Just now, St1ckyBandit said:

The other guy already mentioned bats and dilos but I'd take dimos as well. Those things will shred you in a pack and are hard to hit.

 

If you are putting something inside a tight space for smaller base defense than there are so, so, so many better options than the raptor or terrorbird. The raptor really doesnt do anything you can do 10x better with a different dino. At least the Tbird has the niche glide ability.

Pack bonus. Raptors are fastest land dino. Most players keep there raptors as pets. It easier to get a large pack of raptors than dire wolves. Faster taming on raptors. You get a pack of lv 150 raptors and they dangerous. Sure they're no rex. But that pack bonus+night bonus. 

[PuffyPony]

1 minute ago, St1ckyBandit said:

Edit- Actually I forgot about the chalico poop thrower for base defense. 

Honestly, bats, dilos, and dimorphs are not that powerful. All lack armor, all can be killed quite quickly. In a base defense situation, anything without a saddle is going to die very quickly, even inside (Dimorphs can be killed easily by backpedaling while attacking). Raptors and Terror Birds, while certainly not super amazingly powerful, at least have that damage reduction going for them.

That said, however, of those creatures, the only one I consider to "suck" is the Bat, simply because A) it doesn't really do anything the Dimorph/Vulture/other smaller creatures don't already do, and B) it's an outrageously frustrating tame. Base defense is a metric for determining usefulness, and by that metric, all the tames you listed I'd consider relatively useless (Dilo would be okay if PSX didn't basically do the same thing). This isn't to say the Raptor and Terror Bird excellent for base defense, but my point is that using only a single metric to determine a creature's viability as a "useful" tame isn't really a good way to go (Raptor, for example, is weak, but easily tamed and tamed early on, making it very useful for early game players. Also a decent cave mount until you get a Wolf/Saber/Thyla/Megatherium, and even after the fact, it makes good cannon fodder because of its speed, easy tame, and benefit from saddle).

[lokifeyson]

On 8/5/2017 at 8:11 PM, CaptainBonecold said:

Base Swimming speed 1000 and walking speed 150. The sarco is dealier than the karpo. You can't drown a sarco. The karpo can drown. The karpo walking speed is 180.  The sarco beats the karpo in all stats but walking speed. Look up the official wiki. It'll show you that.  Sarco isn't weak. Your not building it the right way. Don't hate on sarcos. 

I've always defended the sarco, he is a badass. Course this game has lots of strong mobs when leveled properly

[DarkCloud]

DILO did I just read. 

[CaptainBonecold]

18 minutes ago, PuffyPony said:

Honestly, bats, dilos, and dimorphs are not that powerful. All lack armor, all can be killed quite quickly. In a base defense situation, anything without a saddle is going to die very quickly, even inside (Dimorphs can be killed easily by backpedaling while attacking). Raptors and Terror Birds, while certainly not super amazingly powerful, at least have that damage reduction going for them.

That said, however, of those creatures, the only one I consider to "suck" is the Bat, simply because A) it doesn't really do anything the Dimorph/Vulture/other smaller creatures don't already do, and B) it's an outrageously frustrating tame. Base defense is a metric for determining usefulness, and by that metric, all the tames you listed I'd consider relatively useless (Dilo would be okay if PSX didn't basically do the same thing). This isn't to say the Raptor and Terror Bird excellent for base defense, but my point is that using only a single metric to determine a creature's viability as a "useful" tame isn't really a good way to go (Raptor, for example, is weak, but easily tamed and tamed early on, making it very useful for early game players. Also a decent cave mount until you get a Wolf/Saber/Thyla/Megatherium, and even after the fact, it makes good cannon fodder because of its speed, easy tame, and benefit from saddle).

There a reason to have rexes and other dinos with sarco. Raptors fast. Bats are used to attack while dilo blinds you. Raptors fastest land dino. Saddles + Speed= armor speed attackers.   I love using sarcos. I hunt rexes with sarcos and Large metal traps.

[DarkCloud]

4 minutes ago, CaptainBonecold said:

There a reason to have rexes and other dinos with sarco. Raptors fast. Bats are used to attack while dilo blinds you. Raptors fastest land dino. Saddles + Speed= armor speed attackers.   I love using sarcos. I hunt rexes with sarcos and Large metal traps.

Bro,

 

There is literally a better dino for every scenario that you would use a Sarco.

Damage? Rex/Spino/Giga/Dire Bear probably several others but don't feel like confirming, either way the Sarco attack animation/hitbox is terrible.

Under water damage: Squid, Mosa, Pleisy, Baslio

Need to be amphibious for some reason, becauuse you just roam all biomes on a dino all day without returning home? Spino/frog(especially since you said river, so Spinos water speed doesn't matter since it can run on the river shore)

There is no reason to use a Sarco late game and I would argue it's pointless early game, just tame a dolphin if you need to traverse underwater, they out run everything.

[ChargingParacerParacer]

Hell I'd rather just have a frog than a Sarc. You'll probably kill faster 9 times outta 10 with the frog and your FAR faster on land.

[Babii4eva]

On 8/5/2017 at 10:11 PM, CaptainBonecold said:

225 wild max lv. 450 breeded dino max lv. Update of max breeding dino lv was increase in July 2017.

which still rules out the possiblity of a level 1800 rex on offiical

[LilNastyGurl]

On 8/6/2017 at 11:29 PM, PuffyPony said:

This is kind of laughable. Let's break this whole shebang down. We'll start with a Kapro vs Sarco comparison
 

DON'T DO IT ITS A TRAP!

On 8/6/2017 at 11:29 PM, PuffyPony said:

A 1,385 Word Paragraph

I really hope you didn't do this for this thread specifically and had this saved away in a notepad document somewhere.

What are you even talking about? You aren't even making a coherent point

....and that's why

[CaptainBonecold]

1 hour ago, DarkCloud said:

Bro,

 

There is literally a better dino for every scenario that you would use a Sarco.

Damage? Rex/Spino/Giga/Dire Bear probably several others but don't feel like confirming, either way the Sarco attack animation/hitbox is terrible.

Under water damage: Squid, Mosa, Pleisy, Baslio

Need to be amphibious for some reason, becauuse you just roam all biomes on a dino all day without returning home? Spino/frog(especially since you said river, so Spinos water speed doesn't matter since it can run on the river shore)

There is no reason to use a Sarco late game and I would argue it's pointless early game, just tame a dolphin if you need to traverse underwater, they out run everything.

Sarcos out speed most water creatures. 1000 base swimming speed. 

[CaptainBonecold]

1 hour ago, ChargingParacerParacer said:

Hell I'd rather just have a frog than a Sarc. You'll probably kill faster 9 times outta 10 with the frog and your FAR faster on land.

My swamp had a white frog.