Morals, ethics and whatnot of using the Water Breeding Glitch

[Lumitesi]

12 hours ago, Volcano637 said:

No human nature is not to exploit anything they can. That's what horrible people do and that is why in the real world there are a lot of people in prison. It is nowhere near close to human nature. Wanting to exploit something is a character defect.

thats like trying to say all the horrible people that grieve people in game are just acting according to human nature. They are also not. They just have a character defect. 

And this, ladies and gentlemen, is why people should be able to diferentiate a game from real life. Seems some people around here can't. Breaking the rules in a game (especially if you aren't harming anyone by doing so) is very, very different from Breaking the law IRL and you should never compare one another. 

But you are right in one aspect, it isn't human nature to exploit everything, but it is Nature's nature to always find and use the most efficient way to do what is needed. All loving beings (with some exceptions) are wired that way. We aren't any different.

[Volcano637]

4 hours ago, YUSHOETMI said:

Read up, Jat says they're looking into it and will be fixing it with time, this wasn't intended to be a fix it just wound alot of people up, if water breeding was intended they would have said sorry and rolledback for those affected.  Funny how the guy who posted the Jat comment also seen it as "carry on boys" when he clearly says they are aware of it and will fix it eventually. Just seems that those who use it are insanely delusional.

 

They never said they fixed it, it was an offset of ORP being added to PvE it just was amusing to see all those abusing an exploit (yes it is an exploit) crying because they lost dinos whilst doing so.

"Hardly an exploit" you really are deluded on that one aren't you, you say yourself that it decreased food consumption, that was never intended so therefore is an exploit, the fact that land tames can perpetually float and not lose stamina, health or oxygen is again abusing an exploit.  The simple fact that they are LAND dinos being left in WATER for days/weeks is also abusrd

Regardless of how you twist the morality in your head it will remain an exploit as it was never intended to be in the game and gave you an advantage.  Just admit it.

It hasn't been patched, you can still do it so it won't be patched for consoles either, yet.

 

Gloss it how you like, was still using an exploit.  I have managed to raise countless dinos without using the water glitch and not lost any to the food bug so the mechanics are hardly broken, that's just an excuse for people to use the glitch and then cry "I lost so many to the food bug that it was the only way to breed blah blah blah" when in reality its just laziness and willingness to abuse a broken mechanic.

Funny how all those abusing it will adamantly refuse to admit it is a glitch/exploit and defend their use of it as moral or legitimate isn't it.  No matter what you say to them they will claim they never gained an advantage of it whilst in the same sentence explaining how it decreased food consumption and made breeding easier. Glad to see we agree on more than just the wipe topic 

Yeah and he said I was hilarious for thinking it was an exploit lol. Some people just can't take responsibility for their actions. And yes we actually agree on a great deal of stuff. 

[Volcano637]

21 minutes ago, Lumitesi said:

And this, ladies and gentlemen, is why people should be able to diferentiate a game from real life. Seems some people around here can't. Breaking the rules in a game (especially if you aren't harming anyone by doing so) is very, very different from Breaking the law IRL and you should never compare one another. 

But you are right in one aspect, it isn't human nature to exploit everything, but it is Nature's nature to always find and use the most efficient way to do what is needed. All loving beings (with some exceptions) are wired that way. We aren't any different.

Not sure what you are going on about. I never said ark was in any way the same as real life. This discussion was about the morals of using the water glitch. It gives an unfair advantage and a lot of other people don't even know it exists. Therefore, it is immoral and unethical to use it. 

And yes in game wise you are hurting people by getting those 5 extra gigas out way faster than someone is even getting one. When you use those 5 gigas that you unethically obtained and wipe them before they had a chance to raise their own and they spent the same amount of time(sleepless nights) that is very immoral.

argue whatever you want dude. That is just wrong. 

[BipedTadpole]

13 hours ago, Volcano637 said:

No human nature is not to exploit anything they can. That's what horrible people do and that is why in the real world there are a lot of people in prison. It is nowhere near close to human nature. Wanting to exploit something is a character defect.

thats like trying to say all the horrible people that grieve people in game are just acting according to human nature. They are also not. They just have a character defect. 

What I meant was that it is in some people's nature. Not all of humanity collectively. I completely agree with you that there are some horrible people who grief just to be a PITA and that there are also decent people that just want to play and have a pleasant experience. 

[Lumitesi]

57 minutes ago, Volcano637 said:

Not sure what you are going on about. I never said ark was in any way the same as real life. This discussion was about the morals of using the water glitch. It gives an unfair advantage and a lot of other people don't even know it exists. Therefore, it is immoral and unethical to use it. 

And yes in game wise you are hurting people by getting those 5 extra gigas out way faster than someone is even getting one. When you use those 5 gigas that you unethically obtained and wipe them before they had a chance to raise their own and they spent the same amount of time(sleepless nights) that is very immoral.

argue whatever you want dude. That is just wrong. 

1- You are making assumptions. You don't know how many people know or not about the mechanic. The nonsense starts there. 

2 - Alot of people don't know the Therizino is actually the best Meat gatherer in the game by a mile, and it is a huge advantage to use one, so is it immoral and unethical? Hope you don't get a big boo boo because I use one to farm meat

3 - I don't even think it is a bug. All land dinos get into stasis when in the water, not only babies. That probably was put there for some reason, it's a game mechanic. Therefore water breeding is just clever use of game mechanics. Unless it Is a bug that land dinos get into stasis when on water. 

Lastly, I was talking PvE (that's what I play so it's what I can comment on). Also, being honest, in my (outsider) opinion, on PVP everyone tries to get all the advantage possible so if you refused to do water breeding you had to accept the fact you were gonna be left behind. It's like you refused to farm metal with an Anky. Noone to blame but yourself.

I mean, even the devs used this method. One of then even lost a 230 melee Giga baby due to ORP. So it must not be so unacceptable, immoral, or unethical.

[powerstuck]

Now I can only wish they were this proactive on the flyer nerf.

[wallaby]

there's nothing right or wrong about it when a game throws ridiculous poop at u people will find ways to exploit it ALWAYS! devs should look at this and understand that breeding is a desirable yet unreasonable part of there game and should improve it for the players not punish them.

[YUSHOETMI]

4 minutes ago, wallaby said:

there's nothing right or wrong about it when a game throws ridiculous poop at u people will find ways to exploit it ALWAYS! devs should look at this and understand that breeding is a desirable yet unreasonable part of there game and should improve it for the players not punish them.

So by that logic the fact the game is grindy makes it okay for people to dupe because they found an exploit that suits their laziness?  They don't need to be punished either right?

[RadioActiveMan]

While I  am all for reducing the time intensive process of raising babies and imprinting.  The effect of floating dinos eating less to me is a bug that needs fixed.  I do hope they fix the food bug that causes dinos to fail to eat food they have available and starve instead first.

 

My main point would be to facilitate a non-tektier mechanism to pause the baby process during times when people need to tend to RL and take care of themselves etc. and then resume it later.  I am all fine if the end to end activity time is the same, just give us a pause button.

I know we had a very nice lady on our server recently wind up in the hospital because she was not sleeping and taking care of herself properly because she was raising dino babies.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[wallaby]

2 minutes ago, YUSHOETMI said:

So by that logic the fact the game is grindy makes it okay for people to dupe because they found an exploit that suits their laziness?  They don't need to be punished either right?

yeah lets not pretend we're not capable of common sense here mate there's a clear indication that breeding is to demanding on the majority of players, slowing the rate of food consumption on a 2 to 5 day raise is not anywhere near the same as the instant exploitation of duping 

[FredFlinstoner]

Was refrigerated troughs a rumor? People are using water trick cause school and work. I can only really breed on 3day holiday weekends. If they put in those refrigerated troughs people can prep a lot better and they would just have to grind the hand feeding. I don't think people would get to upset losing the water trick for refrigerated troughs. And also i think the breeding times are fine the way they are.

[RadioActiveMan]

6 minutes ago, FredFlinstoner said:

Was refrigerated troughs a rumor? People are using water trick cause school and work. I can only really breed on 3day holiday weekends. If they put in those refrigerated troughs people can prep a lot better and they would just have to grind the hand feeding. I don't think people would get to upset losing the water trick for refrigerated troughs. And also i think the breeding times are fine the way they are.

many people have requested refrigerated troughs, I have never seen confirmation of such an appliance coming to the game yet.

[YUSHOETMI]

19 minutes ago, wallaby said:

yeah lets not pretend we're not capable of common sense here mate there's a clear indication that breeding is to demanding on the majority of players, slowing the rate of food consumption on a 2 to 5 day raise is not anywhere near the same as the instant exploitation of duping 

That's the problem right there "common sense" the aspect of mentality that eludes all those who seem to abuse this glitch as they cannot see it is a glitch and refuse to do so, whilst simultaneously saying how it made it easier for them, go figure.

I breed alot on ark and have a very busy life, isn't as demanding as most people make it out to be

[BobRoss]

On 1-6-2017 at 2:23 PM, McCluskeyy said:

Should keep this trick a thing and not patch it. Its not like it changes spoil times or makes the baby grow faster, it slows consumption.  Not every base has a deep water area so id say its pretty balanced, its a disadvantage too. Its hard enough doing imprints every 4 hours. Spoil times are the same so it would mean the same amount of meat runs but less frequently. 

It helps smaller tribes get bigger too.

Just me that thinks this?

should definitely be patched out, this just detracts the attention from the devs towards other matters because they think breeding is fine the way it is. if this gets patched and people are forced to use the conventional methods there will be more people asking for the mechanic to be changed. And maybe then there will be more people that are able to enjoy it fully, instead of only a select few with special living conditions being able to breed frequently.

[Lumitesi]

43 minutes ago, YUSHOETMI said:

So by that logic the fact the game is grindy makes it okay for people to dupe because they found an exploit that suits their laziness?  They don't need to be punished either right?

Are you really comparing 1h metal farming sessions with up to 28h babies? Like for reals?

 

13 minutes ago, YUSHOETMI said:

That's the problem right there "common sense" the aspect of mentality that eludes all those who seem to abuse this glitch as they cannot see it is a glitch and refuse to do so, whilst simultaneously saying how it made it easier for them, go figure.

I breed alot on ark and have a very busy life, isn't as demanding as most people make it out to be

You see it as a glitch therefore it is a glitch? All hail the lord Yusho, his opinion is now fact. Also using Theris instead of rexes to farm meat makes it easier for me. Do I glitch too hard? Land dinos being in stasis when on water is a game mechanic. Was here long before babies. The fact it applies to babies nad makes breeding easier is just clever use of game mechanics. Get that fork out of your ass please.

[Zederia]

47 minutes ago, Lumitesi said:

You see it as a glitch therefore it is a glitch? All hail the lord Yusho, his opinion is now fact. 

1

Not to mention the devs patched the drowning bug so we COULD do it

[McCluskeyy]

Its balanced though imo.. Finding a good enough spot to do this ''Floating Breeding'' is a challenge on its own.. It poses risk. 

 

You need to be unemployed to breed 100 percent dinos on this game, No Joke.

 

Thats why i think the devs need to Re-look at this breeding like they did with the gather rates.

[YUSHOETMI]

2 hours ago, Lumitesi said:

Are you really comparing 1h metal farming sessions with up to 28h babies? Like for reals?

 

You see it as a glitch therefore it is a glitch? All hail the lord Yusho, his opinion is now fact. Also using Theris instead of rexes to farm meat makes it easier for me. Do I glitch too hard? Land dinos being in stasis when on water is a game mechanic. Was here long before babies. The fact it applies to babies nad makes breeding easier is just clever use of game mechanics. Get that fork out of your ass please.

 

1 hour ago, Zederia said:

Not to mention the devs patched the drowning bug so we COULD do it

You two really are hilarious. 

For one, people who where caught duping gave the whole "the games too grindy so we used it to make it easier" argument. Sound familiar?

Secondly, it isn't a glitch because I say so, it's a glitch because it simply is. Look up the thread in bugs and reports for the pc, Jat clearly states and I quote (loosely) "water breeding is an issue, one we will work out eventually just not now, we have more pressing concerns) or something to that affect. So yeah it is not an intended mechanic, it was not meant to be abused as it is and is therefore above all else and unarguably a glitch. Read up on this thread too, another post from Jat on twitter, stating they know the water breeding glitch is an issue and will eventually get around too it.  

Also ive stated theri's need a nerf in another thread, better than a rex? They're better than a giga! Awesome animals but yeah they need a small nerf. It isn't an exploit tho meat eventually decays and there isn't all that much you can eat, I'd say excessive meat collection compared to making the breeding stage stupidly easier is a whole different ball game. 

Also it's YUSHOETMI not yusho, get it right 

[YUSHOETMI]

1 hour ago, McCluskeyy said:

Its balanced though imo.. Finding a good enough spot to do this ''Floating Breeding'' is a challenge on its own.. It poses risk. 

 

You need to be unemployed to breed 100 percent dinos on this game, No Joke.

 

Thats why i think the devs need to Re-look at this breeding like they did with the gather rates.

How is it balanced? A person using the exploit doesn't need to collect half as much resources as one not using it, meaning they can breed more animals at the same time and do a fraction of the work. 

Hell if I decided to join the dark side and use it I could breed about 50 gigas at a time. 

Also I have a job, a good one, doesn't mean I can't work the breeding schedules around my work and life. 

[Zederia]

you're the hilarious one. they literally fixed it so it COULD be done again, says a lot about how they feel, doesn't it? Maybe they just accepted it's a thing and will continue to do so until they overhaul the breeding system?

[YUSHOETMI]

12 minutes ago, Zederia said:

you're the hilarious one. they literally fixed it so it COULD be done again, says a lot about how they feel, doesn't it? Maybe they just accepted it's a thing and will continue to do so until they overhaul the breeding system?

Omg are you mentally deficient? They clearly stated it was unintentional and was a byproduct of the orp update, they fixed it so that dinos that where in the water for legit purposes wouldn't drown but that the water breeding was on their radar and will eventually be fixed, how can not be any more clear to you?

they didn't fix it so it could continue to be done, they fixed it because legit dinos like spinos and dimetrodons where drowning as well. The simple fact it's not high on their priorities doesn't make it okay to do or anymore of an intended mechanic, it just means that eventually it will be patched out properly. Again yesterday's incident wasn't a patch for water breeding it was coincidental (and funny) that you all lost water breeds and complained despite abusing a glitch. 

[McCluskeyy]

7 minutes ago, YUSHOETMI said:

28 minutes ago, YUSHOETMI said:

How is it balanced? A person using the exploit doesn't need to collect half as much resources as one not using it, meaning they can breed more animals at the same time and do a fraction of the work. 

Hell if I decided to join the dark side and use it I could breed about 50 gigas at a time. 

Also I have a job, a good one, doesn't mean I can't work the breeding schedules around my work and life. 

Are you forgetting the spoil times are the same? Just as much meat runs as normal breeding and also just because your job suits your gaming time doesn't mean everyone else's does.

 

[YUSHOETMI]

7 minutes ago, McCluskeyy said:

What you said

Maybe the spoil times are the same but the Dino doesn't need near enough meat as it would without floating so the spoil time is irelivant. My troughs always empty before they spoil if I leave them so I have to do at least 2-3 food runs a day when doing a big breeding project. I can gaurentee you only need to do 1 if that or 1 every 2 days using fridges as storage. That my friend is what is called an advantage. Yes I could do your method, would it make it easier for me? Yes it would, but I won't. 

Also if spots to do this are rare then doesn't that make having one an advantage too as others won't be able to use that spot on your server. 

[McCluskeyy]

Just now, YUSHOETMI said:

Maybe the spoil times are the same but the Dino doesn't need near enough meat as it would without floating so the spoil time is irelivant. My troughs always empty before they spoil if I leave them so I have to do at least 2-3 food runs a day when doing a big breeding project. I can gaurentee you only need to do 1 if that or 1 every 2 days using fridges as storage. That my friend is what is called an advantage. Yes I could do your method, would it make it easier for me? Yes it would, but I won't. 

Also if spots to do this are rare then doesn't that make having one an advantage too as others won't be able to use that spot on your server. 

I play primitive so the fridges are not an option.

[MTek9]

I like the float exploit. It adds an unintended and pretty useful mechanic to breeding. I play this game a lot because I love it, and a lot of the time real life just doesn't allow you to be on four days on end to raise something like a giga they way you feel you deserve. It gives us a rewarding break. That's what I think.