DomiDarko

So, Scorched Earth is kinda pay2win?!

38 posts in this topic

No hate here, but I've just questioned myself, if Scorched Earth isn't a type of pay2win, because you maybe won't get the complete story behind Ark without the explorer notes and cave-art you can find there. We don't know if the Scorched Earth-artifacts will be counted towards the Artifact Archaeologist-achievement in the future, and even the Manticore will be part of the Survivor Evolved-achievement. Same is with the explorer notes/dossieres for the Veteran Paleontologist-achievement... What do you guys think? I own Scorched Earth, but I'd hate it to miss parts of the story. That's one of the few reasons I bought it.

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Artifact Archaeologist only counts towards the artifacts found on the island. Veteran Paleontologist only counts the "first season" dinos. If anything the very limited staple of dinos in scorched earth works against that particular achievement.

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I don't see it as Pay2Win, mainly as there is no achievments where you need SE to obtain.. SE is build as a more harder experience in the ARK world, You can use much of the exclusive animals there to easier win against any of the bosses needed for the achievments, as you can't have any flyers onto the arenas..

Adobe will not give you more protection on the Center nor the Island...

I will say that I find bringing over the Manticore and Torny Dragon to one of the other original maps make things easier, but not by much..

I bought SE cuz I really wanted more challenges, a new breath into the game.

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25 minutes ago, ciabattaroll said:

Artifact Archaeologist only counts towards the artifacts found on the island. Veteran Paleontologist only counts the "first season" dinos. If anything the very limited staple of dinos in scorched earth works against that particular achievement.

I know, but I'm talking about things in the future. Maybe the devs decide to count the dossiers/notes/artifacts/bosses all in. Who knows? :D

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Unless Flame Arrows have been patched in the background in the last fortnight, they make Scorched Earth absolutely Pay-2-Win. The damage they deal to dino tames is ridiculous. You can take down a L200+ dino with a measly x5 arrows. We've lost L200 Argies in a SINGLE Flame Arrow (low health ones). What makes them P2W? The fact that you need the Cactus Sap from Scorched Earth. I do hope that they've been toned down but I'm yet to see any patch notes (and I'd hope they would be public about it considering how many people I know that have quit because of them). Try it out. Go into SE, take back 500 Flame Arrows to The Island and watch how fast you can drop 2 months of a tribes tames. It'll take you a single night of raiding.

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2 hours ago, Thalantyr said:

Unless Flame Arrows have been patched in the background in the last fortnight, they make Scorched Earth absolutely Pay-2-Win. The damage they deal to dino tames is ridiculous. You can take down a L200+ dino with a measly x5 arrows. We've lost L200 Argies in a SINGLE Flame Arrow (low health ones). What makes them P2W? The fact that you need the Cactus Sap from Scorched Earth. I do hope that they've been toned down but I'm yet to see any patch notes (and I'd hope they would be public about it considering how many people I know that have quit because of them). Try it out. Go into SE, take back 500 Flame Arrows to The Island and watch how fast you can drop 2 months of a tribes tames. It'll take you a single night of raiding.

well considering you can still disarm people on pve using the whip..., wich should never be a thing,  i doubt anything from SE has been patched besides the whipdisarm chance

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3 hours ago, ciabattaroll said:

Artifact Archaeologist only counts towards the artifacts found on the island. Veteran Paleontologist only counts the "first season" dinos. If anything the very limited staple of dinos in scorched earth works against that particular achievement.

Yea.. I've seen and heard of many servers were scorched ppl invaded and got their butts handed to them.. the tames are different and highly useful but still not op enough that it's an unfair advantage. Everything has a counter. 

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2 hours ago, Thalantyr said:

Unless Flame Arrows have been patched in the background in the last fortnight, they make Scorched Earth absolutely Pay-2-Win. The damage they deal to dino tames is ridiculous. You can take down a L200+ dino with a measly x5 arrows. We've lost L200 Argies in a SINGLE Flame Arrow (low health ones). What makes them P2W? The fact that you need the Cactus Sap from Scorched Earth. I do hope that they've been toned down but I'm yet to see any patch notes (and I'd hope they would be public about it considering how many people I know that have quit because of them). Try it out. Go into SE, take back 500 Flame Arrows to The Island and watch how fast you can drop 2 months of a tribes tames. It'll take you a single night of raiding.

If a base on the island drops in a single night then it really wasn't fortified that well.. or the issue becomes offline raiding and not a matter of balance between scorched and the island/center

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11 hours ago, Ep1cM0nk3y said:

If a base on the island drops in a single night then it really wasn't fortified that well.. or the issue becomes offline raiding and not a matter of balance between scorched and the island/center

That's absolutely incorrect. It's a combination of all of them. In this instance I'm referring to Primitive Game Mode, so that may also be a big contributor here. Normally if you manage to get yourself to a side wall or something along those lines (let's pretend offline raiding still plays it's part) then you're usually met with a truckload of dinosaurs that you are trying to pike to death, shoot with arrows over and over, etc. With the addition of Scorched Earth you now take a step back 1-metre, fire Flame Arrow, wait 10 seconds, fire another, tame is dead. Move on to the next one. Basically the tames become absolutely useless. Base design in terms of how you structurally build becomes your best defense.

So in terms of my angle:

a) Primitive Game Mode has defense problems

b) Offline raiding is still a problem

c) Flame Arrows amplify both of the above problems that haven't been fixed

People that have Scorched Earth now just have a way of speeding up offline raiding. I've seen major alpha tribes dropped in a night of offline raiding by transferring tribes in numbers. It doesn't take much. Flame Arrows need to be toned down majorly to player tames as it's definitely P2W.

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28 minutes ago, Thalantyr said:

That's absolutely incorrect. It's a combination of all of them. In this instance I'm referring to Primitive Game Mode, so that may also be a big contributor here. Normally if you manage to get yourself to a side wall or something along those lines (let's pretend offline raiding still plays it's part) then you're usually met with a truckload of dinosaurs that you are trying to pike to death, shoot with arrows over and over, etc. With the addition of Scorched Earth you now take a step back 1-metre, fire Flame Arrow, wait 10 seconds, fire another, tame is dead. Move on to the next one. Basically the tames become absolutely useless. Base design in terms of how you structurally build becomes your best defense.

So in terms of my angle:

a) Primitive Game Mode has defense problems

b) Offline raiding is still a problem

c) Flame Arrows amplify both of the above problems that haven't been fixed

People that have Scorched Earth now just have a way of speeding up offline raiding. I've seen major alpha tribes dropped in a night of offline raiding by transferring tribes in numbers. It doesn't take much. Flame Arrows need to be toned down majorly to player tames as it's definitely P2W.

You just proved my point... it's a matter of offline raiding.. and I do play primitive, exclusively.. and any good base has several walls,  doubled walls, spiked fences plus pillars, etc etc.. base design goes a long way.  If they can get to your tames,  fire arrows or not they will kill them regardless if it's an offline raid. And it's also an issue of tribes gaining strength on another server and being able to transfer items/tames to another server without the other server knowing or having a warning.. Wouldn't matter if it was scorched to island or island to island, the end result would be the same unless the invaded server had people who knew how to pvp (which is a big thing I see, just because your base is big doesn't mean that it's pvp ready).

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Can someone please clear something up for me re: SE content. 

In order to bring SE content back to the Island or the center ... must you be in a cluster? or can you bring SE content back to ANY official server?

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Most people dont consider those a form of winning.  Most would consider winning as becoming and maintaining status as server hegemon (i.e. alpha).  Like life, there is no winning since it is open ended.  Since everyone will die sooner or later, and mankind itself will one day go extinct, there really is no winning, only survival in the present.

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15 hours ago, Vesuvoous said:

Can someone please clear something up for me re: SE content. 

In order to bring SE content back to the Island or the center ... must you be in a cluster? or can you bring SE content back to ANY official server?

SE content can be transferred back to both The Island and The Center maps without being on the cluster servers.

 

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14 hours ago, Mendoza said:

You can't win in an open ended game... hahaha  ....sorry couldn't resist !

Technically, filling out the dossier, taming everything possible,  killing all BOSSES (wonder why they would call them that) is basically the win scenario.. you can keep playing due to it being open ended/ sandbox, but once you've achieved all,  you've won. 

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2 hours ago, NanaNitro said:

SE content can be transferred back to both The Island and The Center maps without being on the cluster servers.

 

But you can not transfer to the center from the island. nor take things from the island or center maps.

 

@ep1cm0nk3y, I think it was the players that started calling them bosses. I think WC called them ultimate lifeforms. Just woke p, and coffee has not kicked in yet.

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5 hours ago, Wyrm said:

Pay to win is when you get something that gives you advantage over other players. How explorer notes is an advantage? o_O

Even the dinos don't really give you an advantage. The golems are weak against explosives. And the wyverns have the turning radious of a delivery truck with flat tires.

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1 hour ago, Jamagh said:

 And the wyverns have the turning radious of a delivery truck with flat tires.

That's not true.

They have the turning radius of a locomotive.

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2 hours ago, Jamagh said:

Even the dinos don't really give you an advantage. The golems are weak against explosives. And the wyverns have the turning radious of a delivery truck with flat tires.

But the Flame Arrows do ;)

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@Thalantyr You're missing the concept here. Scorched Earth supplies a new and more challenging experience from the base game. I reckon you might have access to relatively strong weapons or mounts with Scorched Earth, but you are also subject to a more treacherous environment and acquiring said weapons or mounts is a difficult and lengthy process. You can blame 'Pay to Win' all you want if it makes you feel any better, but the developers stated in the past that there would be paid downloadable content, however, it would not give players an advantage over others that chose not to pay for said content. To me, and as for any other reasonable individual, the developers have kept true to their words. Maybe next time build a safe pen for your mounts ;)

Edited by Astroneer
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I have never like the words pay to win. I will say it pay to get a advantage. But wining still take skill. A good plan and some skill can win out. But not all the time. I will not say that all the stuff in SE is not powerful. Some of it really is OP. But when it come down to it. We all like games like ark. That's why we are here. And Wildcard need to make money. So they can keep putting out the game. And that how it is WC need to pay for the people to make the game so we have it to play. Right or wrong do not forget money is what this is all about in the end. It is a dino eat dino world and you have to evolve to keep up. 

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